CR Rates The Product Announcements Part 1

[Engr Denz]

May I ask why nobody thinks it is the 7D MKII that is coming? what is the product cycle of 7D?

with regards of 60D and G12, I will chose D7000 and P7000 because of video AF, weather sealing, Mag. body, and AF micro lens adjustment of D7000 and longer reach and remote control at P7000.

If and only if the 60D has AF micro lens adjustment and price at $899 I probably chose it than D7000.

Nikon rocks his time, while Canon sucks...

by the way I'm a canon user (7D) but I'm tempted to jump ship because I think there is a better future on the other ship. I wonder what would be the next Nikon FF?

[J]

May I ask why nobody thinks it is the 7D MKII that is coming? what is the product cycle of 7D?

Because the 7D will certainly last more than 1 year. The 7D is still a top of the line APS camera and newer models in the lesser lines won't really change that. The specs are still current and impressive today, 1 year later.

Rebels live for 1 year as the current model but stay in the catalog for about 2 years more. xxD cameras stay current for about 18 months--though how long Canon sells the older model at the same time varies. Full frame cameras stay current for about 3-4 years and clearly replace the previous model of their line. (1D has kind of a weird age history.)

The 7D Mk 1 will probably only start seeming outdated about the time we're rumormongering the 70D, which is quite a ways off as the 60D is still brand spanking new. I'd expect the 7D's cycle to be between the xxD and the full frame xD cameras, for about 3 years.

[c.d.embrey]

You're absolutely right though, there's no guarantee the 5D Mark III is coming soon if ever.  I don't see them changing the line too far from where it is now - maybe they will bump up the specs and price a bit and still call it a 5D series camera

How would you feel if the 5D MkIII turned out to be a FF 60D. The way Canon has been acting lately, it could happen.

[c.d.embrey]

Canon is forcing people who want pro/semipro camera to upgrade to the more expensive 7D. Meanwhile ...

It's just embarrassing...

Canon is forcing people to upgrade to a Nikon D7000.

Canon is making many poor choices in the products that they develop. Making a 70-300 L that no-one asked for, but not making a 50 f1.4, that has needed replacement for a long time, that people have been wanting for.

I've used Canon for a long time, and have three bodies. But I'm switching to Nikon. As good as the D7000 is, I can hardly wait to see the D300s replacement and the D700 replacement. This year Nikon has been releasing some awesome lenses, like the 24 f1.4 and the NEW 35 f1.4, plus the supersharp 16-35 f4. Lenses I need, but Canon just keeps on making expensive Big Whites that I rarely use (I've rented 400mm lenses three time in the last 5 years).

Always use the right tool for the job, and Canon has stopped being the right tool. YMMV

[Edwin Herdman]

You're absolutely right though, there's no guarantee the 5D Mark III is coming soon if ever.  I don't see them changing the line too far from where it is now - maybe they will bump up the specs and price a bit and still call it a 5D series camera

How would you feel if the 5D MkIII turned out to be a FF 60D. The way Canon has been acting lately, it could happen.

I hear you there.  But then I suppose they would need something better to fill the gap an under-specced 5D Mark III would create.  Who knows...maybe they're considering just that.  I have to admit that I'd be interested in a split 5D Mark III line, if one of the cameras comes in under $2500 and is still full-frame.  That said, there's a lot more sense in splitting the lower lines by price and features than doing the same at prices above the 7D's $1400 or so.  People can drop $800-$1000 on a camera but professionals don't want to be messed around with - they want the best camera regardless of the price point, and $2500 strikes me as definitely an elevated pricing group.

[Engr Denz]

May I ask why nobody thinks it is the 7D MKII that is coming? what is the product cycle of 7D?

Because the 7D will certainly last more than 1 year. The 7D is still a top of the line APS camera and newer models in the lesser lines won't really change that. The specs are still current and impressive today, 1 year later.

Rebels live for 1 year as the current model but stay in the catalog for about 2 years more. xxD cameras stay current for about 18 months--though how long Canon sells the older model at the same time varies. Full frame cameras stay current for about 3-4 years and clearly replace the previous model of their line. (1D has kind of a weird age history.)

The 7D Mk 1 will probably only start seeming outdated about the time we're rumormongering the 70D, which is quite a ways off as the 60D is still brand spanking new. I'd expect the 7D's cycle to be between the xxD and the full frame xD cameras, for about 3 years.

if I'm not mistaken, 40D and 50D is exactly 1 year, while 50D and 60D is 2 years. they can randomly release a camera base on needs I think. 7D is still top of the line but with D7000 price at $1200 most rebel users may be tempted to switch. D90 beats 550D but nikon updated it to show to their users that their engineers is doing their home work.

[oalali]

<p><strong>Why I don’t like it</strong></p>

<li><span style=\"font-weight: normal;\">Old AF technology. It doesn’t need to be as good as the 7D, but something improved over the 50D would be welcomed.</span></li>

I totally diagree. It needs to be same if not better than the 7D. the D7000 have a much better focusing system that the 60d (+ many other extra features) and yet it manges to only be a $100 more expensive.

Canon Should stop waisting their R&D money on things like 100MP sensors and sensors 40 times the size of Full Frame.  Seriously, Who needs that ? NASA? Even they decided to go Nikon!

<span style=\"font-weight: normal;\">This seems like a very calculated addition to the lens lineup. I wasn’t a fan of the last 70-300, I always felt it cost too much.</span></strong></p>

<p>This isn’t a cheap lens from the pricing I’ve seen ($1500USD), yet it’s being marketed as an “L” lens newer photographers should look at first.</p>
<p>Optically; it better kick butt for the money.<strong> </strong></p>

Totally agree, I feel that it is just another way for Canon to make money. They could of made a new version but not an L and it would of been much cheaper and more afforable. Most if not all of the Canon's recent lenses were all "L". Which gives the impression that Canon is no more releasing any "normal" lenses.

<p><strong>EF 8-15 f/4L Fisheye<br />

<span style=\"font-weight: normal;\">Wow! </span></strong>What a unique and brilliant idea. One fisheye to work with the entire EOS line. No, it’s not cheap ($1400USD), but for the folks that want a fisheye and have various crop factors in their bag, this is a winner.</p>
<p>I cannot wait to try it out.</p>

I will order this as soon as it is available.

<p><strong>EF 300 f/2.8L IS II & EF 400 f/2.8L IIS II<br />

<span style=\"font-weight: normal;\">Neither of these lenses NEEDED to be replaced, but it cannot hurt to continue to evolve your flagship products.</span></strong></p>
<p>I’m sure they will continue the tradition of Canon’s big white lenses being the stuff of legends.</p>

I was thinking the same until I saw the weight loss! The fat 400mm is the newest "biggest loser"! 

This is one of the biggest things that will make me stick with Canon at least for the next decade or so! 

<p><strong>5D Mark III / 3D<br />

<span style=\"font-weight: normal;\">A full frame camera with at least the 7D autofocus system and all the bells and whistles in a smaller package than the 1D series camera. Don’t increase the megapixel count, just take the 5D Mark II to the next level.</span></strong></p>

It should have the 1D's Focus system like how it used to be with the old film model. As, "Canonians" We are really begging for the minimum right now!

What next? will we beg Canon to retain the Autofocus Feature and not release a body that only have Manual focus ?

[davidjoseph]

Save a few bits and pieces I think the vast majority of people need to catch up to the equipment skills wise ..unless there is some ground shaking breakthrough in technology what needs to be updated.. very little. Personally im glad i get another year out of my gear before the gear heads look at me working and tell me Im using an old camera. Thats of course before they realize my medium and large format gear is film 

[dilbert]

if I'm not mistaken, 40D and 50D is exactly 1 year, while 50D and 60D is 2 years. they can randomly release a camera base on needs I think. 7D is still top of the line but with D7000 price at $1200 most rebel users may be tempted to switch...

Yup, because all of those people who spent $1000 on their DSLR (remember "accessories") are going to be filled with green eyed envy and spend another $1500+ because...

Consider that if nobody wants to buy into Canon because their cameras are just too unpopular that the 2nd hand market value will be substantially lower both from a lack of desire and "flood" of cameras.

I'm sure Nikon would love it to happen, but it ain't.

I'm willing to bet that most of the people buying non-full frame DSLRs are now going to be previous P&S owners, not older DSLR owners. Yes I know people with 20Ds and 30Ds and 40Ds want to upgrade and may buy something but I expect the movement there is much slower.

[davidpeter]

I could not find the reply button, so read my opinion as it is:

A have been waiting for a 5D mkIII for half a year, and I would wait another half, if i knew that it will defenetly come and shine like Nikon D700. However, if i still won't have a clue after Photokina, i get the D700 and abandon this sinking ship.

Sorry guys, put I need good ISO and great AF for low light indoor sports, and the 5D mkII just won't cut that. Nor the 7D with its overpixeled poor sensor...

[Mark D5 TEAM II]

I do hope that there is another new body to be announced in the next few days. If it won't be a 1Ds MkIV (CR2 rumor) or a 2000D (unneeded, just lower the price of the 500D and 550D since the 60D is DOA unless it gets a price-cut ASAP), I pray it would be a 5D2n, nothing radical needs to be changed, just add all the 7D refinements.

[tzalmagor]

The oldest lenses not yet upgraded are:

* The wide primes, which Canon is evidently killing.

* Cheap-o primes for which a better replacement already exists, e.g. the 75-300 is still produced in face of the availability of the 70-300 & 70-300 L.

* The EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM from 2002, MP-E 65mm f/2.8 Macro from 1999, and the EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM from 1998.


I don't see Canon going for a new-lenses-free-year, so I think it's a reasonable bet that Canon will update the EF 24-70mm and the EF 100-400mm next year.

[ELK]

I do hope that there is another new body to be announced in the next few days. If it won't be a 1Ds MkIV (CR2 rumor) or a 2000D (unneeded, just lower the price of the 500D and 550D since the 60D is DOA unless it gets a price-cut ASAP), I pray it would be a 5D2n, nothing radical needs to be changed, just add all the 7D refinements.

Very  reasonable statements. Unfortunately though it's extremely rare that the manufacturers make new products basing on common sense (from our point of view).  Reality is that these are products for masses and the task of manufacturer is to make and sell products that attract all potential segments of customers, which have only one thing in common - psychological limits/ranges where they are ready to pay. For example 1 segment is, say, below $500, next is between $500 and $800, then $800-$1000 and so on.
This segmentation is the first enemy of common sense and unfortunately it looks like Canon concentrates on segmentation games more than on R&D and serious photographers' needs.
Someone already mentioned that Nikon currently tries to put as much as possible into a product in given price range, and Canon tries to put as less as possible... The recent cameras are good proof of it.

[awinphoto]

While I can definitely understand the apparent let down from the 60D and some of Canon's decisions, but reading these replies, it makes me think that we've somehow gotten spoiled with all these cameras and trumped up expectations.  Seriously, my first camera I bought with my own money was the old school film rebel... It had a blazing 3 AF points and shot single shot mode.  It was one hell of a camera at the time... And then when I moved into the digital arena, I used D60's from my college until the fabled 10D came out... shoot... what did that have?  5 or 7 AF points... Beated the hell out of MF everything... Oh yeah it shoot at a brisk 3 frames a second... and we thought that was fast... Guess how much i paid for that dino?  Out the door with battery grip cost me over $1600 on my credit card.  Back then people were grumbling that 6MP was not big enough and that digital equivalent to film was over 20MP and that without a significant improvement in MP, digital would just be a fad for people too cheap to buy film.  Now people are grumbling because we have 18MP sensors and are "too big" and that they aren't shooting at 10 frames a second and dont have 45 AF points, and doesn't have this screen or or that flash triggering, blah blah blah... While in disclosure I do have a 7D and love it and it has paid for itself and then some, I think that cameras, as another poster stated, has gone beyond many peoples technical capabilities and if we all learn to make the most of what we got and stop griping the canon and nikon that you NEEED this feature and that feature but instead focus on the basics and improve quality, you will start seeing fewer cameras released but more substantive and impressive improvements...

[J]

if I'm not mistaken, 40D and 50D is exactly 1 year, while 50D and 60D is 2 years. they can randomly release a camera base on needs I think.

I actually think the 50D was rushed a bit so the design resources could contribute to the 7D. But I think it's worth remembering that at the time of the 50D's release, it too received a rather lackluster reaction. The only real additions were more MP and AF adjustment for several hundred dollars more. Everything else was basically the same.

Maybe the 60D will only last a year until the 70D. I think that's slightly more likely with the D7000 out there, but far from a done deal. I do expect the 60D to sell decently well anyway, especially if they cut $100 to respond to the D7000. $999 is kind of a magic number as prices go, after all. Even more so if they put in AF MA as a firmware upgrade.

I think it's rather funny that Canon was forced to reprice the 50D significantly during the D90's time and that they are repeating history in the next generation. I'm not quite sure what they were going for in designing the 60D to kill the D5000 and D90, as if Nikon wasn't going to update them...

I think it's a reasonable bet that Canon will update the EF 24-70mm and the EF 100-400mm next year.

I'm not trying to pick on you specifically, but everybody has thought this (including me) every year for the past few years...