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Author Topic: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]  (Read 108305 times)

Chuck Alaimo

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #75 on: October 27, 2013, 06:24:14 PM »
If the grip is too big, how do you even hold a non gripped 5d, or a 7d?  Sounds like you need a much smaller body in general...

My 5D fits my hand like it was made for me.  My 20D is just a tiny bit too small but still comfortable.  My T2i is way too small and horribly uncomfortable to use for any length of time.


Quote
either way, the point is, your also asking for 1d specs in a much smaller cheaper body, just not happening....if the grip is too big for you, then so will this new 7d....

I am not.  I'm not asking for the built in grip, the weather sealing, or the high frame rate of the 1Dx.  I'm asking for a 5D4 with the same basic sensor technology and features of the rumor.  The 5D3 is almost there except for the sensor.


This is pure speculation though...this is a rumor of a spec list, nothing confirmed....but you somehow feel that this sensor will be that much better than the mk3's?  It's still an APS-C, so even if it's the very best APS-C sensor ever made the look and feel of a FF sensor may still win.   Either way, I can't accept this as a rational statement because as far as any of us are concerned this sensor does not exist!  Come back to me with this statement in a year when we at least start seeing some test images and other data.  This is a CR1 rumor for crying out loud.

And, personal preference.... I don't want the 5d4 to be that at all....leave the sports line to the 7d and the 1dx, for the 5d4 I like what the current 5d3 has to offer...keep the frame rate the same, up the MP's, 2 CF card slots, improved low ISO performance, and yeah, a bit better low light (not that what is currently there is bad at all)...

 

 
Owns 5Dmkiii, 6D, 16-35mm, 24mm 1.4, 70-200mm 2.8, 50mm 1.4, 85 mm 1.8, 100mm 2.8 macro, 1-600RT, 2 430 EX's, 1 video light

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #75 on: October 27, 2013, 06:24:14 PM »

pwp

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #76 on: October 27, 2013, 06:24:43 PM »
Shooting with a 1Diii for 30 seconds made me want to drop the thing into a mine shaft.  I feel the same about my T2i after 5 minutes but have no trouble with my 5D or 20D after 12 hours.
You gave it a whole thirty seconds? Well that's certainly plenty long enough to get to know the 1D3 intimately.
Look, they may not work for you and that's perfectly fine, but yours isn't the sole valid viewpoint on the planet in regards to 1-Series bodies.

-pw

Don Haines

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #77 on: October 27, 2013, 07:42:18 PM »


Good grief.  EVFs are years, if not decades away from being usable in high-speed and/or low-light situations, plus we need a good factor of 4 increase in battery performance before we go that way.

A  bit of an overreaction? He didn't suggest building a space elevator.

Space elevators are at least possible.  EVF as good as OVFs are not possible, ever.

At least you confirmed suspicions of an over reaction =/

Who knows what will be possible in the next decade or so. I'll agree that it's not going ot happen for a few more years, but there's no way of knowing what will be possible in 10+ years, especially with anything technology related.

How are you going to be zero lag and zero power usage?

You don't need zero lag, you just need less lag than the user can perceive. I am told that people can not notice less than 20 milliseconds of lag... Olympus is now at 29ms with the OM-D EM-1... still not there but getting very close... I can't notice the delay on static objects but if I look hard and concentrate I can see it when I pan. ( I have not tried the OM-D EM-1.... that's with a PEN and the OV-4, allegedly the same viewfinder the OM-D EM-5 uses)

Also, an optical viewfinder is not zero lag, it is between 1.5 and 2 nanoseconds, depending on your camera :)

Zero power usage is a bit misleading too... the question should be how does the power usage of the EVF compare to the power usage of the shutter/mirror motors.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2013, 07:44:28 PM by Don Haines »
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Lee Jay

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #78 on: October 27, 2013, 07:43:41 PM »
This is pure speculation though...this is a rumor of a spec list, nothing confirmed....but you somehow feel that this sensor will be that much better than the mk3's?

Why is "dual pixel" speculation?

Don Haines

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #79 on: October 27, 2013, 07:47:12 PM »
This is pure speculation though...this is a rumor of a spec list, nothing confirmed....but you somehow feel that this sensor will be that much better than the mk3's?

Why is "dual pixel" speculation?
Because it might be quad :) :) :)
The best camera is the one in your hands

Lee Jay

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #80 on: October 27, 2013, 07:52:35 PM »
You don't need zero lag, you just need less lag than the user can perceive.

Nope.  This is a myth.  Any lag, at all, reduces closed-loop tracking bandwidth and therefore makes it harder to track subjects.  I tried a difficult tracking situation with a camera with 25ms of lag and it was entirely impossible, while I did it pretty easily with an SLR.

Quote
Zero power usage is a bit misleading too... the question should be how does the power usage of the EVF compare to the power usage of the shutter/mirror motors.

The mirror takes no power at all for viewfinder use.  I often use the viewfinder for hours and hours, taking only 1000-2000 shots during that time.  An EVF will generally deplete the battery in an hour of viewfinder use or so, even if you take no pictures.

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #81 on: October 27, 2013, 07:58:00 PM »
Quote
The mirror takes no power at all for viewfinder use.  I often use the viewfinder for hours and hours, taking only 1000-2000 shots during that time.  An EVF will generally deplete the battery in an hour of viewfinder use or so, even if you take no pictures.

that´s a good point.
i also look through the viewfinder for hours, with some breaks to relax my eyes, when doing wildlife shots.

even when the camera has a sensor that only activates the EVF when your eye is near the EVF it would not help much in such a case.

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #81 on: October 27, 2013, 07:58:00 PM »

Chuck Alaimo

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #82 on: October 27, 2013, 08:03:46 PM »
This is pure speculation though...this is a rumor of a spec list, nothing confirmed....but you somehow feel that this sensor will be that much better than the mk3's?

Why is "dual pixel" speculation?

the speculation part wasn't referring to dual pixel specifially...it was more in general that this is a cr1 rumor, so it can only be viewed as speculation. 
Owns 5Dmkiii, 6D, 16-35mm, 24mm 1.4, 70-200mm 2.8, 50mm 1.4, 85 mm 1.8, 100mm 2.8 macro, 1-600RT, 2 430 EX's, 1 video light

mkabi

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #83 on: October 27, 2013, 08:06:10 PM »
You can't compare 4K video to 5K stills produced by cameras like the 1DX.

8Mb... Please.... thats so one dimensional for you to think of it that way.
8Mb is a single frame. Movie quality is 24 frames per second.

Thats...192Mb per second
11.52Gb per minute
692.2Gb per hour

You want slow-motion? 60 fps or more.
Imagine if the RED can output 300fps at 4K...
Bah...

traveller

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #84 on: October 27, 2013, 08:09:47 PM »
You don't need zero lag, you just need less lag than the user can perceive.

Nope.  This is a myth.  Any lag, at all, reduces closed-loop tracking bandwidth and therefore makes it harder to track subjects.  I tried a difficult tracking situation with a camera with 25ms of lag and it was entirely impossible, while I did it pretty easily with an SLR.


How do video photographers cope with shooting action?

Let me guess, you own vinyl, right?  ;)

Don Haines

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #85 on: October 27, 2013, 08:14:10 PM »
You don't need zero lag, you just need less lag than the user can perceive.

Nope.  This is a myth.  Any lag, at all, reduces closed-loop tracking bandwidth and therefore makes it harder to track subjects.  I tried a difficult tracking situation with a camera with 25ms of lag and it was entirely impossible, while I did it pretty easily with an SLR.

Quote
Zero power usage is a bit misleading too... the question should be how does the power usage of the EVF compare to the power usage of the shutter/mirror motors.

The mirror takes no power at all for viewfinder use.  I often use the viewfinder for hours and hours, taking only 1000-2000 shots during that time.  An EVF will generally deplete the battery in an hour of viewfinder use or so, even if you take no pictures.

You must have a bugger of a time dealing with the delay in optical viewfinders caused buy the photons moving at only the speed of light.....

What I said is that the delay just has to be less than the user can perceive.... I am told the number is 20 milliseconds, even if we said it is 1 millisecond, all you have to be is faster than that.

The human body is incredibly slow at processing information.... our nerves conduct signals slowly.... our brains, although massively parallel, calculate slowly. Going faster than a human can perceive is a trivial task....
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mkabi

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #86 on: October 27, 2013, 08:16:04 PM »
How many MP is 4k?

2K video is 1920x1080
4K video is 3840x2160
8K video is 7680x4320

When I first saw 4K video (about 4 years ago) the quality of it just blew me away... even though we had to display it on a 2x2 matrix of monitors... 8K video is even better, you even have sharp detail right up close to the displays... but at this point we seem to be hitting the law of diminishing returns. Personally I would say 4K video is twice as good as 2K, but there is no way I would say 8K video is twice as good as 4K.... 4K seems to be the sweet spot...

Affordable cameras with 4K video? Keep in mind that a GoPro shoots 4K video at 15fps and stores it on a micro-sd card.... I wonder what a pair of Digic5+ can do....

lol... you will know why I laughed in a minute.
yes... the gopro shoots 4K @ 15fps...

But! the 1DX can shoot 5K @ 12fps and its RAW baby!
Bah...

ajfotofilmagem

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #87 on: October 27, 2013, 08:23:23 PM »
You don't need zero lag, you just need less lag than the user can perceive.

Nope.  This is a myth.  Any lag, at all, reduces closed-loop tracking bandwidth and therefore makes it harder to track subjects.  I tried a difficult tracking situation with a camera with 25ms of lag and it was entirely impossible, while I did it pretty easily with an SLR.


How do video photographers cope with shooting action?

Let me guess, you own vinyl, right?  ;)
Do not compare apples to pineapples... 8) A video frame frozen has much lower detailing than a JPEG photo with the same resolution. Try to capture a frame of video FULL HD and print on photo paper, and will see a 1 megapixel JPEG image will be waaaay better though with half the amount of pixel.

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #87 on: October 27, 2013, 08:23:23 PM »

Don Haines

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #88 on: October 27, 2013, 08:23:33 PM »
Quote
The mirror takes no power at all for viewfinder use.  I often use the viewfinder for hours and hours, taking only 1000-2000 shots during that time.  An EVF will generally deplete the battery in an hour of viewfinder use or so, even if you take no pictures.

that´s a good point.
i also look through the viewfinder for hours, with some breaks to relax my eyes, when doing wildlife shots.

even when the camera has a sensor that only activates the EVF when your eye is near the EVF it would not help much in such a case.

Every time a mirror moves or a shutter moves, it takes energy. You have to compare the total energy used..... you can not just look at energy use under certain conditions.... that would be like me saying that an EVF uses less energy because when you take a picture, for that 1/100th of a second the mirror and shutter use a thousand times more energy...

One has a pattern of constant drain at a slow rate, the other has a pattern of heavy drain for very short and infrequent intervals. The question of which is worse in total depends on the usage pattern. If you are firing pictures off quickly the mirror/shutter will be the least efficient but if you are taking time it will be the most efficient. I think that in general the mirror/shutter will be the most efficient, but the answer is not an absolute.
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Lee Jay

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #89 on: October 27, 2013, 08:23:56 PM »
You don't need zero lag, you just need less lag than the user can perceive.

Nope.  This is a myth.  Any lag, at all, reduces closed-loop tracking bandwidth and therefore makes it harder to track subjects.  I tried a difficult tracking situation with a camera with 25ms of lag and it was entirely impossible, while I did it pretty easily with an SLR.


How do video photographers cope with shooting action?

Loose framing.

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Re: EOS 7D Mark II Spec List Surfaces [CR1]
« Reply #89 on: October 27, 2013, 08:23:56 PM »