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Author Topic: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000  (Read 81142 times)

DarStone

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #75 on: September 25, 2010, 04:16:12 PM »
Okay here is a link to some quick reference shots taken with the 60D, nothing special I usually shoot leaves and ropes to get an idea of AF Accuracy and Clarity, plus I shot these with a Nifty Fifty 50mm 1.8 Canon Lens, and a Sigma 50-200mm HSM OS lens ($159.00 retail) to give you an idea of what options you might start off with.

http://picasaweb.google.com/dbharris3/Canon60DQuickReferenceShots#

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #75 on: September 25, 2010, 04:16:12 PM »

StepBack

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #76 on: September 27, 2010, 06:51:43 AM »
I'm not going to repeat the objections. But I will add that Canon is putting to rest the DIGIC 4. So for new buyers to this level of camera it may not be so important whether which camera has more AF points or which is qualitatively better based on specs alone. What Canon may be doing is saying to present midrange owners that the next gen of FF and prosumers will have a new processor. And that's where the difference comes in. The AF, metering and chip are what makes the thing go. You don't go anywhere w/o the engine. And no one is able to scientifically compare the chips because they don't have the equipment. The test shots I've seen are just for arguments sake. The argument is moot.

urkel

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #77 on: September 27, 2010, 11:54:15 AM »
The AF, metering and chip are what makes the thing go. You don't go anywhere w/o the engine. And no one is able to scientifically compare the chips because they don't have the equipment. The test shots I've seen are just for arguments sake. The argument is moot.
And whats the argument?

anthony11

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #78 on: September 27, 2010, 12:42:08 PM »
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Oh, im just griping about everything.  This is part of the decision process for me. :D

Been there, still doing that ;)

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Anyway, it looks like I may be sticking with Canon for another more generation. As much as I'm "willing" to switch, after doing the math on what it will cost to get me the equivalent Nikon setup then I'll stick with my more affordable Canon lenses.
Nikon 24-70 f2.8 - $1700 new / $1500 used
Nikon 50mm f1.4 - $425 new / $375 used
Hrrm, $350-ish (21%) more for the 24-70, $75 more for the 50.  Annoying, but adding up the percentage difference of a whole setup, I'm not so sure that the gap is a gating factor any more.  Before Canon's 20% yen/dollar markup it was bigger.

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BTW. One thing to note about the 60D's shortcomings is that several of these "missing features" are firmware fixable. So as much as people hate complainers, whining does serve a purpose here because 60D vs D7000 comparisons can swing back to Canon's favor if they unlock some of the stuff they intentionally crippled.

In theory, yeah, but yet the 5D2 still lacks a wider EC range than +/- 2 stops, lacks 5-exposure bracketing, lacks aperture bracketing.  Those are all straightforward to code, yet Canon can't be bothered.

neuroanatomist

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #79 on: September 28, 2010, 07:55:25 AM »
You can't just "add" +/-1 EV because things like the LCD screen on top and electronic display inside the viewfinder have +2..-2 hard coded into the device.

True.  But that wouldn't stop them from a firmware change to add my favorite new feature that's present in the T2i and 60D (and even in my PowerShot S95!), but not in the 7D...the ability to specify a maximum for Auto ISO.
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anthony11

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #80 on: September 28, 2010, 08:23:23 AM »
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The 5-shot thing is probably because most people with the 5D2 don't need/use bracketing because they prefer to "get the shot in one."
It's mainly championed by the HDR crowd.
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You can't just "add" +/-1 EV because things like the LCD screen on top and electronic display inside the viewfinder have +2..-2 hard coded into the device.
I could live with it blanking at +/- 3.  With bright backgrounds I find that +2 isn't always enough.
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But we don't need 5 exposure bracketing, just the +/-3 ... It's not hard to set the camera to a certain combination of settings and then just turn the dial 2 or 3 notches after every shot.
Sounds like you should be shooting film with all-manual bodies.  Turning the dial takes time, and can result in orientation changes.  The HDR people really like being able to get five exposures in minimum time, without dicking with the rig in the middle.

Osiris30

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #81 on: September 29, 2010, 02:22:04 AM »
Have you had a chance to play with high-iso on the 60D... I'm starting to really believe the rumours of a tweaked sensor.  I was playing around at 6400 tonight and my mind is literally blown out the back of my skull. 

Either my 60D is the 'golden copy' or Canon really did a few little things no one noticed to their core tech.  The AF has been flawless some 4000 shots in now... I can count AF misses on one hand regardless of lens (even the troublesome 50 1.8).. well maybe two hands, but really some of them are most likely my fault for getting sloppy. 

The 6400 iso stuff has a tonality to it that I can't believe (if I didn't see the EXIF and know what I shot it at I would have *sworn* it was 3200 iso tops).  Man I can't wait for proper reviews... For all the b*tching, moaning and complaining this is one hell of a little body.

Okay here is a link to some quick reference shots taken with the 60D, nothing special I usually shoot leaves and ropes to get an idea of AF Accuracy and Clarity, plus I shot these with a Nifty Fifty 50mm 1.8 Canon Lens, and a Sigma 50-200mm HSM OS lens ($159.00 retail) to give you an idea of what options you might start off with.

http://picasaweb.google.com/dbharris3/Canon60DQuickReferenceShots#

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #81 on: September 29, 2010, 02:22:04 AM »

ageha

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #82 on: September 29, 2010, 03:16:02 AM »
The 6400 iso stuff has a tonality to it that I can't believe (if I didn't see the EXIF and know what I shot it at I would have *sworn* it was 3200 iso tops).  Man I can't wait for proper reviews... For all the b*tching, moaning and complaining this is one hell of a little body.

I can only second that. So far I'm quite impressed too especially after I compared the results to a D700 side by side.

unexposure

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #83 on: September 29, 2010, 03:31:25 AM »
I'm starting to really believe the rumours of a tweaked sensor....
These aren't Rumors, this is an official Canon-Statement.

blufox

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #84 on: September 29, 2010, 06:12:50 AM »
Good to hear some positive impressions :).

I am just waiting for 5dMKII successor, till then let me collect few more lenses.

Oh did I mention getting a 70-200 f4L IS tomorrow.. yay, bodies can be changed, lenses are the real thing to keep :).

anthony11

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #85 on: September 29, 2010, 02:54:12 PM »
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If you're doing hand-held bracketing for HDR then unless your subject is evenly bright, you've got to shoot in "P" or shutter priority modes
Mind you, I don't shoot HDR (mostly my kinetic toddler), but I would think that Av would be in order for HDR bursts.

Edwin Herdman

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #86 on: September 29, 2010, 06:25:02 PM »
You don't need 5 shots to do HDR, nor do you need +/-3.  On the weekend, someone had me hold their iPhone with HDR software loaded that used 2 photos for HDR. Personally, I find that very very few HDR photos look ok. Some folks like to do HDR with 1 "negative."
I'm really tempted to say from this quote that you're seeing people doing it wrong, but you assume their methodology is right.

There's many different purposes for HDR, let's keep in mind.  One is to really blow colors out and exploit the tone mapping, another is to map more tones to a picture to mimic the natural wide dynamic range that you would perceive with your eyes (a lot of the "stunning" HDR photos out there you'd need to let your eyes adjust when viewing in real life - like looking at backlit mesas in a desert scene, with bright opaque clouds behind them).

I've tried pulling extra detail out of single exposures in Canon Digital Photo Pro for single-exposure HDR; it didn't work (for that instance...clouds became clipped).  I'm sure that'd work for some cases.  That is starting to sound like what I (poorly) understand Ansel Adams's zone method to have been partly about.  I think that you can get perfectly acceptable "HDR" photos that look natural with just an extra exposure, if the software is good enough and the scene is right.  One for more shadowy parts of the image, another for highlights.  I suppose people like midtones too.

For five-shot bursts, I'd start to worry more about moving objects and camera movement.  I have found that I've been able to do fairly well handholding even my T1i for three shot bursts with a heavy lens, but I wouldn't want to print the shadow tones too big (and thus the entire image's sharpness gets dragged down by that part of the image, though I suspect sharpness stands out more in highlights than shadows).

Osiris30

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #87 on: September 29, 2010, 09:27:00 PM »
I'm starting to really believe the rumours of a tweaked sensor....
These aren't Rumors, this is an official Canon-Statement.

Do you have a link (it would help settle other debates I have elsewhere).  TIA.


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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #87 on: September 29, 2010, 09:27:00 PM »

unexposure

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #88 on: September 30, 2010, 05:58:16 AM »
Do you have a link (it would help settle other debates I have elsewhere).  TIA.
It's stated on the announcement of 60D at heise.de, it's also stated in several Photography-Review-Magazines and it's stated by the press-person of canon who answered my e-mail. ;-)
I have already translated this (in my own words) somewhere in another thread in this forum. Here another Version, what Canon-Helpdesk said (in my own words regarding translation): "The sensor is an improvement over the 550D regarding light-sensivity. It has in addition received the improved filters used in 7D. Considering this, both, noise-behavior and light-sensivity should be improved when compared to 7D or 550D."
But, another thing worth mentioning is, in the german magazine "photo hits" they had reviewed a preprod model of 60D and say, that it has improved noise-behavior and light-sensivity but in exchange comes up with a slightly (pretty much not noticeable) loss in resolution when compared to 7D. Dunno whether it was because of the preproduction model or has another reason.

kubelik

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #89 on: September 30, 2010, 09:18:05 AM »
unexposure ... so basically, Canon's applying even more noise reduction on the sensor ... not unexpected, but still a little disappointing.  I'm still waiting for them to turn that corner.  that being said, it also sounds like a pixel-peeping thing ... probably won't bother 90% of users

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Re: Canon 60D v. Nikon D7000
« Reply #89 on: September 30, 2010, 09:18:05 AM »