November 28, 2014, 07:07:51 PM

Author Topic: Canon to Offer Dual Pixel CMOS AF Upgrade for the EOS C100 Digital Video Camera  (Read 9842 times)

paul13walnut5

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Once again, cool stuff for videographers.


Emm, it's a VIDEO CAMERA.

Canon have made VIDEO CAMERAS for many more years than they have made digital SLRs.

Dual Pixel appears to be a VIDEO CAMERA technology, but hey, like CMOS, like CCD, like LCD, like LIVE VIEW..

It may acutally benefit some photographers as well!

Yeah Canon, lay off our precious stills cameras, i'm quite happy with my EOS 1n.

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paul13walnut5

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And for what it's worth, I'm happy in principle that Canon are offering this upgrade.

I'm not happy that a serious video camera like the C100 has AF at all.  Leave the trinkets for the muppets.

AF has no place on a serious video camera. 

Lee Jay

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And for what it's worth, I'm happy in principle that Canon are offering this upgrade.

I'm not happy that a serious video camera like the C100 has AF at all.  Leave the trinkets for the muppets.

AF has no place on a serious video camera.

Think this was shot with fixed-focus?  (1:10 in)

http://youtu.be/_bVALAgpGYw?t=1m8s

paul13walnut5

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Think this was shot with fixed-focus?  (1:10 in)

http://youtu.be/_bVALAgpGYw?t=1m8s

Absolutely not. 

Do I think it was shot with autofocus?

Absolutely absolutely not.

Do I think it was shot with manual focus?

Yes.

Do I think it was shot with a parfocal video lens that lets you zoom in close and hold back focus?

Yes.

Do I think lenses give greater perception of depth of field and sharpness the wider the lens?

Yes.

Do I think it's video 101 to zoom in focus, and then zoom out at will knowing that the increase in apparent depth of field will usually save you from having to drastically refocus?

Yes.

Do I think racking focus slightly during a zoom is really easy with an MF lens, but impossible with lens set to AF?

Yes.

Do I think ENG pedastol cameras with superzooms have really slick focus wheels off camera?

Yes.

Do I think any competent ENG camera operator knows without thinking or looking what way they need to turn their focus to track a moving object?

Yes.

Circles of confusion are the video mans friend.  Knowing how to use the theory to your advantage is what seperates the pros from the uncle bobs.   And makes the shot at 1.10 childs play with a bit of experience.

AvTvM

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AF has no place on a serious video camera.

"Just don't use it. Just ignore it. Just put up with it. And no, it won't be cheaper without AF." 
same as video on each and every stills camera.
:P

Etienne

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is this news real or just some joke?

HOW can the C100 be upgraded to dual-pixel AF without putting in a new sensor and (some) new electronics and new firmware?

Even if they used a 50mm 1.8 this should'nt be a problem. I think no one using a C100 or higher uses the built-in mic. Does the C100 even have a built-in microphone? Same goes for the 70D, als long as you use external audio, no lens could be loud enough to appear on your auidotrack.

The C100 does have a mic built into the handle, and it is apparently very good. Some doc makers use it when the subject is quite close to the camera. see Jonah Kessel at NewsShooter.com

Etienne

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And for what it's worth, I'm happy in principle that Canon are offering this upgrade.

I'm not happy that a serious video camera like the C100 has AF at all.  Leave the trinkets for the muppets.

AF has no place on a serious video camera.

Some photographers used to say the exact same thing when AF was first introduced to stills cameras....

... Thank-god the innovators ignored them!

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paul13walnut5

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AF has no place on a serious video camera.

"Just don't use it. Just ignore it. Just put up with it. And no, it won't be cheaper without AF." 
same as video on each and every stills camera.
:P

Haha, yes.  Very good.

The pedant in me would point out that video adds virtually no cost to a live-view enabled DSLR, wheras adding AF to a video camera body requires extra components.  The C-Series must be one of the first professional camcorders to have in body AF.

At a professional level, which is where these cameras are pitched, AF is not required.   It really isn't.  I've chucked folk off my sets for using AF on hdv cameras. 

For shooting crappy family videos, AF makes them a bit less crappy.  If you know how to manually focus video and have a well set up video camera, then AF really is absolutely superflous.

Etienne

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AF has no place on a serious video camera.

"Just don't use it. Just ignore it. Just put up with it. And no, it won't be cheaper without AF." 
same as video on each and every stills camera.
:P

Haha, yes.  Very good.

The pedant in me would point out that video adds virtually no cost to a live-view enabled DSLR, wheras adding AF to a video camera body requires extra components.  The C-Series must be one of the first professional camcorders to have in body AF.

At a professional level, which is where these cameras are pitched, AF is not required.   It really isn't.  I've chucked folk off my sets for using AF on hdv cameras. 

For shooting crappy family videos, AF makes them a bit less crappy.  If you know how to manually focus video and have a well set up video camera, then AF really is absolutely superflous.

The C100 is aimed at documentary, news, run and gun. Often done by one man band, operating camera while interviewing a subject. As some have pointed out, this can help the videographer concentrate on the interview even while the subject wiggles all over town, instead of having to split attention to keep the subject in focus.

A tool is a tool. If it helps get a better result, then it's a good tool.

paul13walnut5

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And for what it's worth, I'm happy in principle that Canon are offering this upgrade.

I'm not happy that a serious video camera like the C100 has AF at all.  Leave the trinkets for the muppets.

AF has no place on a serious video camera.

Some photographers used to say the exact same thing when AF was first introduced to stills cameras....

... Thank-god the innovators ignored them!

Yes, thank god.  AF is great on my stills cameras.

May I draw your attention to the distinction I made, and that was 'serious' video cameras.

Stills AF works really well because you only show one single frame.  Video is contiguous.  Every frame has to be in focus, or the sequence is binned.  Add in moving subject to camera distance etc and AF, particularly AF hunting is just a killer.

AF is great, really is, for stills, for hobby video, family video, super.

I'm making a clear distinction here.  I'm not talking about those guys.  Those aren't the guys the C100 etc should be trying to please.  Those guys don't manually WB.  Those guys don't understand why you always need ND filters in your kit bag for video.  Those guys don't understand f-drop. 

I know how well car analogies go down here, so it's like putting an autobox in a, hmmm, jaguar xk120.  Except that cameras aren't british racing green,  and you cant change the tyre on a c100. 

paul13walnut5

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The C100 is aimed at documentary, news, run and gun. Often done by one man band, operating camera while interviewing a subject. As some have pointed out, this can help the videographer concentrate on the interview even while the subject wiggles all over town, instead of having to split attention to keep the subject in focus.

A tool is a tool. If it helps get a better result, then it's a good tool.

Yep.  I dig.  All the more reason to not think 'oh well I can trust the AF to look after it'  until AF decides it preferes the face on the poster behind the film star.  At f1.8.

All the more reason to read up on circles of confusion, to use zone focusing.  To keep an eye on the viewfinder and a finger on the focus ring.

AF is what gives run and gun a bad name.  I can't think of any excuse ever for any competent professional cameraman or woman to use AF.  I'm a zealot and a purist.  Directors and producers hate me but like my results.  And hey, I'm in full-time video work.  Go figure.

Etienne

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And for what it's worth, I'm happy in principle that Canon are offering this upgrade.

I'm not happy that a serious video camera like the C100 has AF at all.  Leave the trinkets for the muppets.

AF has no place on a serious video camera.

Some photographers used to say the exact same thing when AF was first introduced to stills cameras....

... Thank-god the innovators ignored them!

Yes, thank god.  AF is great on my stills cameras.

May I draw your attention to the distinction I made, and that was 'serious' video cameras.

Stills AF works really well because you only show one single frame.  Video is contiguous.  Every frame has to be in focus, or the sequence is binned.  Add in moving subject to camera distance etc and AF, particularly AF hunting is just a killer.

AF is great, really is, for stills, for hobby video, family video, super.

I'm making a clear distinction here.  I'm not talking about those guys.  Those aren't the guys the C100 etc should be trying to please.  Those guys don't manually WB.  Those guys don't understand why you always need ND filters in your kit bag for video.  Those guys don't understand f-drop. 

I know how well car analogies go down here, so it's like putting an autobox in a, hmmm, jaguar xk120.  Except that cameras aren't british racing green,  and you cant change the tyre on a c100.

You completely miss the point of the C100 ... it is a run and gun, news-gathering, documentary tool ... mostly for one-man bands, or very light crew. 

Have you ever tried to interview someone while operating the camera and focussing?  It is extremely difficult, and you risk not paying sufficient attention to the subject, and therefore not getting the best footage.

Sure if you are always working on a set, or you always have a dedicated cameraman for every shot.

BTW .. Formula 1 cars have used semi-automatic transmissions for quite a long time.

LetTheRightLensIn

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Some comments on other sites have complained about a firmware upgrade costing $500. However, just because they're not changing the sensor doesn't mean they aren't changing hardware, maybe a lot of it.

Also, the focusing may be smooth but I have to wonder how noisy constantly-focusing USM lenses are going to be. Shouldn't the 70D have the same problem?

Are you sure they are not changing the sensor? Because that is the place where the dual pixel AF hardware is found (although it might perhaps also need a dedicated extra processing chip on the mainboard, who knows). Unless they already had it produced with a dual pixel AF sensor but hadn't finished firmware support for it last year when the C100 came out???

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LetTheRightLensIn

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AF has no place on a serious video camera.

really?? Because not every type of video shooting scenario is exactly ideal for carefully set shooting with an extra focus puller. Just because you only shoot one particular type of thing doesn't mean that is the only thing everyone does. Sure the regular MF way with carefully pulling is best for lots of stuff but absolutely not for all stuff!

LetTheRightLensIn

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At a professional level, which is where these cameras are pitched, AF is not required.   It really isn't.  I've chucked folk off my sets for using AF on hdv cameras. 


Once again you've decided that since you shoot a certain type of thing on that, that all videos shot to professional standards are always shot under such a scenario.

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