November 29, 2014, 03:48:53 AM

Author Topic: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]  (Read 23381 times)

CarlTN

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #75 on: December 11, 2013, 02:47:32 AM »
Just a thought, but how many people (especially unhappy 17-40mm or 16-35mm owners complaining of soft corners) would be please if Canon replaced the 20mm f/2.8 USM with a 20mm f/2.8 IS or 18mm f/2.8 IS for around the same street price as the 17-40mm (not initially, but eventually drift down like the 24/28/35mm IS primes)?

I know 20mm is much longer than 16mm or 17mm, but I'm sure a new IS prime would be incredible sharp, and still fairly small.  Sounds like the perfect solution for video (widest stabilized lens in Canon EOS mount) and tripod-free nighttime landscape photography (theoretically handholdable at 0.8 sec).  What does the CR community think of such a replacement?

You can handhold a 24-105 IS for .8 seconds at 24mm, can't you?  I think I've done it...well at least for .5 seconds.  Of course that's an f/4 lens...One of the shots I posted in the "anything shot with a 6D" thread, was at 105mm handheld, I think for 1/8 or 1/5 of a second, ISO 5000...was during the "blue hour".

I think Zeiss should make an f/1.4 wide angle zoom that autofocuses, has tilt shift, along with IS, weather sealing, and magnesium/carbon fiber construction...for $500!  :P

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #75 on: December 11, 2013, 02:47:32 AM »

Rienzphotoz

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #76 on: December 11, 2013, 10:00:36 AM »
Just a thought, but how many people (especially unhappy 17-40mm or 16-35mm owners complaining of soft corners) would be please if Canon replaced the 20mm f/2.8 USM with a 20mm f/2.8 IS or 18mm f/2.8 IS for around the same street price as the 17-40mm (not initially, but eventually drift down like the 24/28/35mm IS primes)?

I know 20mm is much longer than 16mm or 17mm, but I'm sure a new IS prime would be incredible sharp, and still fairly small.  Sounds like the perfect solution for video (widest stabilized lens in Canon EOS mount) and tripod-free nighttime landscape photography (theoretically handholdable at 0.8 sec).  What does the CR community think of such a replacement?
I am not "unhappy" with my 16-35 but I really like the idea of a 18mm or 20mm IS prime (non-L) lens ... if it costs less than $800, I'm in.
Canon 5DMK3 70D | Nikon D610 | Sony a7 a6000 | RX100M3 | 16-35/2.8LII | 70-200/2.8LISII | 100/2.8LIS | 100-400LIS | 40/2.8 | 50/1.4 | 85/1.8 | 600EX-RTx2 | ST-E3-RT | 24/3.5 T-S | 10-18/4 OSS 16-50 | 24-70/4OSS | 55/1.8 | 55-210 OSS | 70-200/4 OSS | 28-300VR | HVL-F43M | GoPro Black 3+ & DJI Phantom

KyleSTL

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #77 on: December 11, 2013, 10:02:49 AM »
Just a thought, but how many people (especially unhappy 17-40mm or 16-35mm owners complaining of soft corners) would be please if Canon replaced the 20mm f/2.8 USM with a 20mm f/2.8 IS or 18mm f/2.8 IS for around the same street price as the 17-40mm (not initially, but eventually drift down like the 24/28/35mm IS primes)?

I know 20mm is much longer than 16mm or 17mm, but I'm sure a new IS prime would be incredible sharp, and still fairly small.  Sounds like the perfect solution for video (widest stabilized lens in Canon EOS mount) and tripod-free nighttime landscape photography (theoretically handholdable at 0.8 sec).  What does the CR community think of such a replacement?

You can handhold a 24-105 IS for .8 seconds at 24mm, can't you?  I think I've done it...well at least for .5 seconds.  Of course that's an f/4 lens...One of the shots I posted in the "anything shot with a 6D" thread, was at 105mm handheld, I think for 1/8 or 1/5 of a second, ISO 5000...was during the "blue hour".

I think Zeiss should make an f/1.4 wide angle zoom that autofocuses, has tilt shift, along with IS, weather sealing, and magnesium/carbon fiber construction...for $500!  :P
That is not what I was trying to say, at all.  Carl, you are one of the most argumentative and unreasonable people on this forum, your level of discourse brings the entire community down. 

It is not unreasonable to say that Canon will replace the 20mm f/2.8 in the near future with IS, if they are replacing the 85mm f/1.8 USM with an IS version.  Price should be pretty comparable to the 24/28/35mm IS primes.  My assumption of this future lens was in no way unrealistic.

Also, a stop faster lens means either: 1) a lower ISO for less noise, or 2) even lower light levels than the 24-105mm f/4L.  I'm sure you can get sharp pictures at 24mm at 0.8 sec with a somewhat acceptable keeper rate, but a wider, 20mm lens should in-theory increase that keeper rate (especially with the newest IS version and a fixed focal length lens that they can really optimized its effectiveness).  I'm not trying to convince you I'm right, but your tendency to denegrate fellow forum members is disturbing.

EDIT: Sorry if I misread the tone of your post, I just noticed the tongue smiley.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2013, 10:05:28 AM by KyleSTL »
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15mm f/2.8 Fisheye | 28mm f/1.8 USM | 50mm f/1.4 USM | 85mm f/1.8 USM | 3x 420EX | ST-E2 | Canon S90 | SD600 w/ WP-DC4

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #78 on: December 11, 2013, 12:42:56 PM »
Just a thought, but how many people (especially unhappy 17-40mm or 16-35mm owners complaining of soft corners) would be please if Canon replaced the 20mm f/2.8 USM with a 20mm f/2.8 IS or 18mm f/2.8 IS for around the same street price as the 17-40mm (not initially, but eventually drift down like the 24/28/35mm IS primes)?

I know 20mm is much longer than 16mm or 17mm, but I'm sure a new IS prime would be incredible sharp, and still fairly small.  Sounds like the perfect solution for video (widest stabilized lens in Canon EOS mount) and tripod-free nighttime landscape photography (theoretically handholdable at 0.8 sec).  What does the CR community think of such a replacement?

I like the idea.  I got the 28 f/2.8 IS and am impressed with it.  If Canon do get a similar result with the 20mm, then I'm all for it.  It would make me that much closer to getting rid of the 16-35 II.

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #79 on: December 11, 2013, 08:52:12 PM »
Just a thought, but how many people (especially unhappy 17-40mm or 16-35mm owners complaining of soft corners) would be please if Canon replaced the 20mm f/2.8 USM with a 20mm f/2.8 IS or 18mm f/2.8 IS for around the same street price as the 17-40mm (not initially, but eventually drift down like the 24/28/35mm IS primes)?

I know 20mm is much longer than 16mm or 17mm, but I'm sure a new IS prime would be incredible sharp, and still fairly small.  Sounds like the perfect solution for video (widest stabilized lens in Canon EOS mount) and tripod-free nighttime landscape photography (theoretically handholdable at 0.8 sec).  What does the CR community think of such a replacement?

I would take a 17 or 18mm prime with IS or not if it was available and then sell my 17-40. I see that lens as a 17-24mm lens in reality as over 24mm IQ starts to fade. I would gladly take a non L 17mm f/4 prime under $1000.

20mm is a tiny bit longer than I like but if it was in the same league as the other IS primes I could see it being very popular as a travel WA lens. It would also make a close to 35mm lens on crop bodies.
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KyleSTL

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #80 on: December 12, 2013, 01:24:52 PM »
Just out of curiosity, I ran the numbers for these rumored lenses for 'hand-holdability'. Here's the breakdown:

The 50mm f/1.8 IS would tie the 35mm f/2 IS for 'most handholdable':
EV 0 = 35mm | f2 | 0.4 sec | ISO 1000
EV 0 = 50mm | f1.8 | 0.5 sec | ISO 1000

A 50mm f/1.4 IS would be the new 'most handholdable' lens:
EV 0 = 50mm | f1.4 | 0.5 sec | ISO 640

The 85mm f/1.8 IS would be
EV 0 = 85mm | f1.8 | 1/6 sec | ISO 2000

And 135mm f/1.8, 2 and 2.8 would be
EV 0 = 135mm | f1.8 | 1/10 sec | ISO 3200
EV 0 = 135mm | f2 | 1/10 sec | ISO 4000
EV 0 = 135mm | f2.8 | 1/10 sec | ISO 8000

Nothing important, just thought I'd share what I found.
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CarlTN

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #81 on: December 15, 2013, 03:58:44 AM »

That is not what I was trying to say, at all.  Carl, you are one of the most argumentative and unreasonable people on this forum, your level of discourse brings the entire community down. 

It is not unreasonable to say that Canon will replace the 20mm f/2.8 in the near future with IS, if they are replacing the 85mm f/1.8 USM with an IS version.  Price should be pretty comparable to the 24/28/35mm IS primes.  My assumption of this future lens was in no way unrealistic.

Also, a stop faster lens means either: 1) a lower ISO for less noise, or 2) even lower light levels than the 24-105mm f/4L.  I'm sure you can get sharp pictures at 24mm at 0.8 sec with a somewhat acceptable keeper rate, but a wider, 20mm lens should in-theory increase that keeper rate (especially with the newest IS version and a fixed focal length lens that they can really optimized its effectiveness).  I'm not trying to convince you I'm right, but your tendency to denegrate fellow forum members is disturbing.

EDIT: Sorry if I misread the tone of your post, I just noticed the tongue smiley.

Frankly I am offended by your personal attack, just a bit...it seems like you just couldn't wait to lambast me.  You were saving up obviously.  The little tack on at the end, since you still left the rest in, is obviously just you trying to cover your ass a bit, while still letting me have both barrels.  I'm not sure where your anger is coming from, and I don't recall saying you were being unrealistic...nor why you should take such a thing so personally in any case, even if that is how you took it.  This is all just speculation about these lenses anyway!

Regarding the last comment about the Zeiss lens, that was definitely me JOKING...because it's about as realistic as resurrecting Marilyn Monroe from the grave, and attempting to make her forget all about JFK!  (That's meant as a joke too, so don't go telling me he was your uncle or something!!)  What I mean with all this is, I can wish for things too...I'd like a Zeiss lens, and then that carbon fiber hood that someone DIY'ed popped into my head, so I just threw it all together...and laughed.

I come here to learn, and to share.  I've learned a lot!  Sometimes I get into arguments with people.  But that's life.  I don't come here with the idea that I'm going to get along with, or please everyone.  That's just not me.  If I feel a certain way, then I defend how I feel, if it seems important.  I do try to be polite, until given a reason not to.

To say "your level of discourse brings the entire community down"...is just harsh, uncalled for, and a lie...it really is.  GO BACK AND READ ALL OF MY POSTS BEFORE YOU SAY SOMETHING LIKE THAT.  You are in dire need of getting the hell over yourself...you are taking yourself too seriously!  My level of discourse is appropriate at least over half the time, and especially here now.  Sometimes I've been inappropriate and I apologized for it.  But nobody's perfect, my God man!!  Not even you... 

If I have brought the entire CR "community" down in this thread, then wow I do apologize...but I just don't see it!  You proclaiming it does not make it so, not by a mile...

I think my main interest in this thread was speculating, selfishly, about which of the lenses I would be interested in (85mm f/2 IS).  There's no telling what 2014 holds, but I have a feeling there could be disappointment, along with gratitude...towards Canon.  I don't claim to have any inside info though, just my two cents!

At some point it becomes time to sell and consolidate lenses, cameras, etc.  I'm trying to do a bit of that now.  There's not any one lens that's going to magically transform my photographic life...
« Last Edit: December 15, 2013, 04:07:57 AM by CarlTN »

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #81 on: December 15, 2013, 03:58:44 AM »

Ellen Schmidtee

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #82 on: December 15, 2013, 09:50:11 AM »
It is not unreasonable to say that Canon will replace the 20mm f/2.8 in the near future with IS, if they are replacing the 85mm f/1.8 USM with an IS version.  Price should be pretty comparable to the 24/28/35mm IS primes.  My assumption of this future lens was in no way unrealistic.

I agree with you that it is realistic, but here's another way to look at it: the 20mm f/2.8 is apparently selling well enough to stay in production for many years. Canon could make a new non-L 20mm, and have one 20mm prime lens in production, or a new 20mm L prime and keep on selling the non-L as well.

Then again, maybe Canon never made a 20mm L because 20mm f/2.8 sales are too low to justify two primes at that focal length, in which case it might be too low to justify a new 20mm f/2.8 IS USM.

clartephoto

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #83 on: January 02, 2014, 02:23:09 AM »
I have the 14LII, 24LII, 35L, 50L, 85LII and 180L and reckon all of them need IS.

My personal opinion is anyone who claims fast primes don't need IS has (fortunately) not had to push their lenses into service in truly low light situations.

The amount of times I have had to contend with camera shake because of using the 85L at 1/20, 1/30 etc. is very frustrating.

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #84 on: January 02, 2014, 02:41:38 PM »
I have the 14LII, 24LII, 35L, 50L, 85LII and 180L and reckon all of them need IS.

My personal opinion is anyone who claims fast primes don't need IS has (fortunately) not had to push their lenses into service in truly low light situations.

The amount of times I have had to contend with camera shake because of using the 85L at 1/20, 1/30 etc. is very frustrating.

Agree 100%.  I'm a handheld, available light shooter who often ends up in the ISO 3200 - 6400 range on my 5D3.  I'll take IS on everything.

In low light / non-moving subject scenes, IS simply buys you speed and options.  IS lets you either bring the ISO down to something more reasonable or lets you stop the lens down to gain more DOF and sharpness. 

Remember, a huge aperture lens like an F/1.4 might seem a creative opportunity, but lack of IS on it will make that F/1.4 a light-driven necessity that punishes you when you don't want a small DOF.   Put differently, an F/1.4 lens might seem better than (say) an F/2.8 IS lens, but if you always have to slam the F/1.4 wide open to net a long enough shutter, your shots will be soft and have a limited DOF.   Stopping the F/2.8 down to F/4 will net sharper shots with more working DOF, so in low light, and for what I shoot, I'd choose the F/2.8 IS over the F/1.4 every time.

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Zv

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #85 on: January 02, 2014, 10:15:13 PM »
I have the 14LII, 24LII, 35L, 50L, 85LII and 180L and reckon all of them need IS.

My personal opinion is anyone who claims fast primes don't need IS has (fortunately) not had to push their lenses into service in truly low light situations.

The amount of times I have had to contend with camera shake because of using the 85L at 1/20, 1/30 etc. is very frustrating.

Agree 100%.  I'm a handheld, available light shooter who often ends up in the ISO 3200 - 6400 range on my 5D3.  I'll take IS on everything.

In low light / non-moving subject scenes, IS simply buys you speed and options.  IS lets you either bring the ISO down to something more reasonable or lets you stop the lens down to gain more DOF and sharpness. 

Remember, a huge aperture lens like an F/1.4 might seem a creative opportunity, but lack of IS on it will make that F/1.4 a light-driven necessity that punishes you when you don't want a small DOF.   Put differently, an F/1.4 lens might seem better than (say) an F/2.8 IS lens, but if you always have to slam the F/1.4 wide open to net a long enough shutter, your shots will be soft and have a limited DOF.   Stopping the F/2.8 down to F/4 will net sharper shots with more working DOF, so in low light, and for what I shoot, I'd choose the F/2.8 IS over the F/1.4 every time.

- A

Exactly, I agree with that summary. More dof in moderate to dim light is more important to me than shallow dof in low light. It makes perfect sense why Canon made the newer IS primes slower. I can't recall the last time I actually wanted to use f/1.4 for any reason. I find myself shooting at f/8 and f/11 more to get sharpness front to back. When you're walking about in the evening pics look really nice with more dof as it is "unusual" and not expected. I also don't want to carry an extra 2 or 3Kg of weight in the shape of a tripod when I'm traveling around South East Asia. There's no room for tripods on those narrow, broken dusty streets anyway!

IS is my most loved fearure of all. Can't wait for the 50 IS!
« Last Edit: January 02, 2014, 10:17:07 PM by Zv »
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dgatwood

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #86 on: January 04, 2014, 11:19:56 AM »
Exactly, I agree with that summary. More dof in moderate to dim light is more important to me than shallow dof in low light. It makes perfect sense why Canon made the newer IS primes slower. I can't recall the last time I actually wanted to use f/1.4 for any reason.

If I had to choose one or the other, sure, but I'd rather have an f/1.2 or f/1.4 IS so that I have the stabilization with the wider DoF for 95% of the shots, and also can dial in that great subject isolation of a fast lens for the other 5%.

I'll readily admit that I've never owned or used a lens quite that fast—the closest I have is a full-manual 58mm f/2.0 lens—but I'd like to.  I just can't justify spending hundreds or thousands of dollars on a lens that I can't use for day-to-day shooting because of the lack of IS.

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #87 on: January 04, 2014, 01:14:25 PM »
Exactly, I agree with that summary. More dof in moderate to dim light is more important to me than shallow dof in low light. It makes perfect sense why Canon made the newer IS primes slower. I can't recall the last time I actually wanted to use f/1.4 for any reason.

If I had to choose one or the other, sure, but I'd rather have an f/1.2 or f/1.4 IS so that I have the stabilization with the wider DoF for 95% of the shots, and also can dial in that great subject isolation of a fast lens for the other 5%.

I'll readily admit that I've never owned or used a lens quite that fast—the closest I have is a full-manual 58mm f/2.0 lens—but I'd like to.  I just can't justify spending hundreds or thousands of dollars on a lens that I can't use for day-to-day shooting because of the lack of IS.

Yeah that's true both are desireable in a lens really.

I tend to get most of my subject isolation shots using a telephoto lens. Even at f/4 you can get lovely background blur at 200mm. It becomes harder to get that look I guess with the wider focal lengths so you would need f1.4 in that case. It would be awesome to have a 50 1.4 with IS but I don't think that will happen.

There is one point I also hadn't considered and that's APS-C users. I think for those users fast lenses still play an important role since high ISO stinks and the crop factor takes away the really shallow dof capability. My f/4 zooms are fairly limiting on the 7D.

The only fast I have now is the 135L which on crop really needs IS! You have to use it at at least 1/250s if you want any chance of avoiding camera shake. And with flash sync at 1/250s on the 7D options get real limited quickly.
6D | 17-40L | 24-105L | 70-200 f4L IS | 135L | SY 14 2.8 | Sigma 50 1.4

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #87 on: January 04, 2014, 01:14:25 PM »

StudentOfLight

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #88 on: January 05, 2014, 06:00:24 AM »
I find the 50mm focal length quite boring. I'd rather shoot wider or longer. Canon please skip the 50mm IS and just make a 40mm F/1 IS cupcake (because f/1 wont fit into a pancake)
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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #89 on: January 05, 2014, 10:22:04 AM »
I find the 50mm focal length quite boring. I'd rather shoot wider or longer. Canon please skip the 50mm IS and just make a 40mm F/1 IS cupcake (because f/1 wont fit into a pancake)
I think a hypothetical 40mm F1.0 Image Stabilizer would be more like a jar of juice. :P

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Re: IS Versions of the 50mm, 85mm & 135mm Coming? [CR1]
« Reply #89 on: January 05, 2014, 10:22:04 AM »