August 20, 2014, 05:05:58 AM

Author Topic: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries  (Read 14209 times)

Skirball

  • 7D
  • *****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2013, 11:31:33 AM »
They do have a valid point about protecting their customers from poor quality counterfeits.  There's a story going round in cycling world this week about Specialized pulling up a bike shop called Cafe Roubaix, Roubaix being a name used by Specialized.  One of the issues Specialized has had to deal with was when they had a bike returned after it snapped causing significant injuries to the rider, only to find that the bike itself was a counterfeit.  Since then they've paid a law firm to track down counterfeiters - the Cafe Roubaix owner got caught up in the cross fire a bit.  As long as Canon continues to allow you to use a 3rd party battery, after clicking 'OK' to continue I'm fine with it.  They're warning you that your camera might get fried - but leaving it up to you to make the decision.  I still use a 3rd party battery as a spare, but use the original Canon as my primary battery.

There’s a big difference between third party components that are labeled as such, and plain out selling counterfeit wares.  Especially when your counterfeit is replacing an expensive process like carbon fiber manufacturing with a cheaper and inferior process, and when that has safety concerns.  Lithium Ion battery technology isn’t exactly rocket science, Canon just puts an over-inflated premium on theirs to milk some more money out of consumers.  Third party component manufacturing is a legitimate business model and helps keep manufactures honest (less dis-honest?).  If the quality of the product manufacturers components truly are better,  or the price is marginally more, people will buy them because it gives us a warm fuzzy feeling to see that name brand printed on the side.  You only need these kind of tactics when you’re trying to force people to buy your overpriced product.

canon rumors FORUM

Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2013, 11:31:33 AM »

Rat

  • Canon 70D
  • ****
  • Posts: 269
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2013, 11:51:44 AM »
No offense or insult intended, but who is "Jon" on Amazon 's review and how reliable is this only single review?  I would like to see others report success with this battery before I get any.

I'm less inclined to be nice. I read this article as an advertisement for this particular seller and his particular batteries. I strongly doubt these are the only batteries to register correctly - Wasabi has been mentioned. Given that we just had another D&B T-shirt ad, I'm curious how much CR guy is making on this post. If nothing, it's terribly naive journalism.
5DIII, 17-40, 24-105, 70-200/4IS, 50/1.8II, 85/1.8 and a truckload of gimmicks and bits.

dgatwood

  • 5D Mark III
  • ******
  • Posts: 636
  • 300D, 400D, 6D
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2013, 12:01:30 PM »
They do have a valid point about protecting their customers from poor quality counterfeits.

No, not really.  Not like this.  Their anti-counterfeiting technology is unreliable, and sporadically fails even for the Canon-branded batteries that come with the cameras.  And it does nothing to deter other companies from building batteries, and does nothing to deter customers from buying them, because even if they have to replace all of their batteries, they would still pay less than they would for Canon-branded batteries.  Besides, those batteries are eventually going to fail no matter what.  As long as the users don't update their cameras' firmware too frequently, odds are good that they'll be ready for new batteries by the time they have to replace them anyway.

In other words, Canon's approach is completely ineffectual as a measure for preventing people from choosing third-party batteries.  These "safety" checks do nothing but piss off Canon's paying customers—people who spent thousands of dollars on Canon camera gear.  And why?  Because they dared to save a few bucks on a disposable, consumable commodity.

The way Canon is playing the game is like Ford deciding to regulating car tire safety by having police officers randomly confiscate non-OEM tires, or legitimate tires if they can't clearly make out the certificate of authenticity printed on the side, leaving the drivers on the side of the road with a non-drivable car.  Nobody sane would ever buy a Ford automobile if they did this, and lots of us are actively boycotting several printer manufacturers for such dirty tricks.  So why are people so willing to tolerate this abuse from a camera manufacturer?

If Canon actually cared about protecting customers from poor quality counterfeits, they would simply license access to their platform.  License access to their battery protocol and the chips required to support it.  License access to their lens protocol.  And so on.  Mandate compliance checks by Canon prior to first sale as part of the licensing requirements.  And make the licensing costs low enough per unit to ensure that third-party manufacturers are universally willing to to "go legit".  That way, when Canon's paying customers buy a battery that works, they will have reasonable assurance that Canon actually vetted the product, that is safe, that it will not harm their camera, and that Canon promises not to deliberately break it.  That's what competent electronics manufacturers do when they want to ensure product compatibility and reliability.  By contrast, deliberately sabotaging people's ability to use their cameras with a particular battery is dirty, it's sleazy, and whatever Canon exec approved it should be thrown out on his or her @$$.

Just saying.

airfxca

  • SX50 HS
  • **
  • Posts: 4
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2013, 12:03:27 PM »
i have not heard of anyone that have damaged their 5dmk2 with third party batteries

but with my experience... when i was filming with my 5dmk2 i would not use third party batteries as their higher voltage would HEAT up the camera much faster.
and on my 60D i'm experiencing slower FPS in continuous shooting mode with third party batteries.

however i do not know if these issues would affect the the newer cameras


PS. sony NEX camera have no drop in FPS and heat issues when used with third party batteries, they have the same voltage rating as sony batteries
« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 12:06:37 PM by airfxca »

Rockets95

  • PowerShot G1 X II
  • ***
  • Posts: 59
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2013, 12:13:20 PM »
The third party manufacturer's reverse engineer their stuff to work with Canon's equipment. IMO, it's not up to Canon keep the third party guys happy. I've got nothing someone trying to save a few dollars, but you're taking a chance.
7D, WFT-E5A, 70-200 F/2.8L IS II, 24-105 F/4.0L, 10-22 F/3.5-4.5, 580EX-II, Wife has: 5D2, 70-200 4.0L IS, 100 2.8L IS macro, 24-105 F/4.0L IS, 17-40 F/4.0L

unfocused

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1986
    • View Profile
    • Unfocused: A photo website
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2013, 12:17:22 PM »
No offense or insult intended, but who is "Jon" on Amazon 's review and how reliable is this only single review?  I would like to see others report success with this battery before I get any.  And, of course, Canon may issue a firmware update in the future that with eliminate communication with these newer non-Canon batteries.

Yeah, I'm trying to figure out who the heck "Jon" is as well. Is it the same "Jon"as the guy on Amazon or is this another "Jon." And, where's the full story? Is this a CR0 or a CR1 story?
pictures sharp. life not so much. www.unfocusedmg.com

WPJ

  • EOS M2
  • ****
  • Posts: 237
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2013, 12:19:03 PM »
How are you taking a chance if you buy a battery from a good company you should be fine.  Now the cheap 5$ china version I would not touch.

this however would be solved is canon charges a normal fee and,not 5 times what the battery is worth.

canon rumors FORUM

Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2013, 12:19:03 PM »

kphoto99

  • PowerShot G1 X II
  • ***
  • Posts: 57
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2013, 12:28:18 PM »
Next step for Canon is to make sure that the SD/CF card is manufactured by Canon. After all the other brands can damage the camera.

WPJ

  • EOS M2
  • ****
  • Posts: 237
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2013, 12:32:22 PM »
Next step for Canon is to make sure that the SD/CF card is manufactured by Canon. After all the other brands can damage the camera.

after that, you will have to ensure that there,is a canon logo in your exposure or it won't capture the raw file to the card. Hahaha

RustyTheGeek

  • Buy and Sell
  • 1D Mark IV
  • ********
  • Posts: 828
    • View Profile
    • Images I've Shot...
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2013, 12:32:50 PM »
I noticed this new phenomenon when I got my new 6D last year.  And I posted comments on it then.  In general, I pretty much agree with dgatwood.  Using an expensive piece of technology like a 5D3 to punish the buyer for choosing a 3rd party battery is sleazy and an abuse of the manufacturer's power.

I also feel like noncho has the best point about Canon simply making their OEM batteries more affordable to begin with.  That would solve everything.  (Hmm, Canon battery for $35 or cheap Chinese knock-off for $20?  Easy choice!)  Instead Canon has decided to spend more R&D time, money and lose customer good will over protecting what amounts to unfair profit in the first place.  And in the process, use of genuine batteries potentially is affected.  I had this same attitude in the 80's with VHS tape copy protection that didn't work and ruined the picture for everyone and then in the 90's when MP3 files started taking off and the record companies started suing teenagers for downloading MP3 files.  Really?  If the movie/music companies, (aka: the most greedy/sleazy entities on the planet) had simply made their movies/music more affordable from the beginning, no one would have wanted to go to all the trouble to copy or download inferior music files to get around the high cost.  As of today, they still haven't learned their lesson even after many have gone bankrupt trying to fight a losing battle.  And let's not forget how Apple treats people that try to circumvent their controls.  Anyone remember all the BRICKED IPHONES Apple intentionally damaged with an update back in 2007 when folks tried to jailbreak their phones?  Hope Canon doesn't try THAT!!  But I digress...

I agree slightly with the counterfeit protection excuse simply because there are many examples of true counterfeit Canon batteries out there that are almost perfect copies, cost more than established 3rd party batteries and are crap.  So I'm all for some kind of message that tells me it's not a true Canon battery but don't punish me by shutting off all the battery data exchange and/or crippling the camera performance.  That's just crappy.

Also, let's not forget that in 5+ years when Canon stops making these batteries or making them in enough quantity, you'll be stuck with 3rd party batteries as your only choice and won't that be lovely?

So in summary, Canon needs to stop with the battery gestapo crap, make their batteries more reasonably priced to begin with (thus solving the problem entirely) and just stick to making good cameras instead of trying to piss everyone off with stupid ideas they learned from the movie/music industry and Apple.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 12:43:29 PM by RustyTheGeek »
Yes, but what would  surapon  say ??  :D

Skirball

  • 7D
  • *****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2013, 12:35:30 PM »
IMO, it's not up to Canon keep the third party guys happy.

Agreed, it’s not, but this isn’t about keeping the third party guys happy, it’s about spending dollars researching (futile) ways to force them out of the game.  You could write up a laundry list of firm ware fixes that people would like to see, but when they finally getting around to pushing out a release what’s in it?  A speedbump for third party battery manufactures.

RustyTheGeek

  • Buy and Sell
  • 1D Mark IV
  • ********
  • Posts: 828
    • View Profile
    • Images I've Shot...
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2013, 12:38:41 PM »
Next step for Canon is to make sure that the SD/CF card is manufactured by Canon. After all the other brands can damage the camera.

If Canon really cared about us as they say with their battery scheme in the firmware, they would add a feature to test the media card in camera for bad memory sectors and transfer rate.  Counterfeit memory is a big problem and Canon could help.  "Media Verify" would be a welcome feature to have a way to verify media anytime someone wanted to in the field.  But noooo, let's just focus on the possibility that a battery could cause trouble since that has been such a big problem for soooo many people over the past 10 years.
Yes, but what would  surapon  say ??  :D

RustyTheGeek

  • Buy and Sell
  • 1D Mark IV
  • ********
  • Posts: 828
    • View Profile
    • Images I've Shot...
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2013, 12:42:05 PM »
IMO, it's not up to Canon keep the third party guys happy.

Agreed, it’s not, but this isn’t about keeping the third party guys happy, it’s about spending dollars researching (futile) ways to force them out of the game.  You could write up a laundry list of firm ware fixes that people would like to see, but when they finally getting around to pushing out a release what’s in it?  A speedbump for third party battery manufactures.

Totally agree Skirball.  Exactly what I was thinking. Of all the things we want, need and Canon should feel obligated to address, this is what they focus on.  Pathetic.  Meanwhile, other things like having a red focus confirmation indicator in the viewfinder while in AiServo goes unchanged.  Thanks heaps Canon and Merry Christmas to you too.
Yes, but what would  surapon  say ??  :D

canon rumors FORUM

Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2013, 12:42:05 PM »

Skirball

  • 7D
  • *****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2013, 12:46:22 PM »
If the movie/music companies, (aka: the most greedy/sleazy entities on the planet) had simply made their movies/music more affordable from the beginning, no one would have wanted to go to all the trouble to copy or download inferior music files to get around the high cost. 

As much as I’d like to bash the record companies, I’m going to have to disagree.  People steal music because it’s free and easy.  People steal crap music that they’ll hardly listen to, because they can.  People steal music that they’ll hardly listen to, because like all their specialty lenses camera components that they hardly use, people get into collecting useless crap because they want to have a big collection they can tell people about.  People can definitely afford to buy the songs that they really enjoy listening to, but they don’t, because people don’t see it as stealing from these big bad record companies.

Cost doesn’t have much to do with it.  I see kids at Starbucks getting $5 coffees, on iPhones with unlimited data plans, driving fancy cars that they can afford to fill at $4 a gallon.  They can afford a $15 album or $1 song if they wanted, but why pay when you can just steal it for free.  Sorry to digress, but lets compare apples to apples.

Skirball

  • 7D
  • *****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2013, 12:47:22 PM »
Next step for Canon is to make sure that the SD/CF card is manufactured by Canon. After all the other brands can damage the camera.

I was just going to say that.  What if Canon bought out Lexar and made it so only their cards worked.  Certainly people would have a problem with that?

canon rumors FORUM

Re: EOS 5D Mark III & Third Party Batteries
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2013, 12:47:22 PM »