December 20, 2014, 03:14:42 AM

Author Topic: "Pro" mythbusting  (Read 5541 times)

eli452

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2014, 04:05:04 AM »
This one reminds me of the Chuck Norris aphorisms countless sites.
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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2014, 04:05:04 AM »

mackguyver

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2014, 11:31:11 AM »
Pros do not find the time to waste energy upon internet-forums like you and I do.
+1,000,000,000, though they pop up every now and then to post questions or work-related items.

privatebydesign

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2014, 12:04:43 PM »
Pros do not find the time to waste energy upon internet-forums like you and I do.

I do, I am a full time working pro photographer, but I have a keen interest in dispelling photographic untruths and offering unbiased gear advice based on personal experience. I also seem to be printing more and more so spend more time at the computer which enables me to have a browser window open here. I don't post or look  any other forums though I look at many photographers work and have another window open at Creative Live almost all the time.

One of my observations with pros is that many of them are good at what they do, and professional photography is a business with never ending niches, but many have no educational basis for teaching, indeed many do not understand even basic concepts like "lens compression", perspective, equivalence, crop factors, exposure square for flash and ambient balancing etc etc. In this day and age of easy access I truthfully wish there were some sort of standard, or grading, of educators, you can learn a huge amount of stuff from people that are actually doing something, be that techniques, inspiration, business practices, etc, and it is all valuable, but anybody speaking publicly should be much more aware of correct use of terminology and the impact their words can have.

Oh, and generally photographers outside interests are not photography, they spend too much time hanging out and posting on climbing, skiing, diving, hifi and cooking forums  ;)
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 12:07:25 PM by privatebydesign »

fatmanmedi

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2014, 09:50:26 PM »
pros never use filters
pros always use filters

Fats

Ripley

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2014, 01:32:53 PM »
pro·fes·sion·al   \prə-ˈfesh-nəl\
: relating to a job that requires special education, training, or skill
: done or given by a person who works in a particular profession
: paid to participate in a sport or activity
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AcutancePhotography

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #20 on: March 27, 2014, 12:31:07 PM »
offering unbiased gear advice based on personal experience.

If it is based on your personal experience, by definition it is biased.   ;D

That's what biased means.   :D

Of course advice can be both biased and valuable. 
I shoot with a Camera Obscura with an optical device attached that refracts and transmits light

privatebydesign

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2014, 04:19:55 PM »
offering unbiased gear advice based on personal experience.

If it is based on your personal experience, by definition it is biased.   ;D

That's what biased means.   :D

Of course advice can be both biased and valuable.

Not if we are talking English
Experience
Biased
If I used my experiences to present ideas in an unfair way, then I could be called biased, similarly you can have entirely biased opinions without any experience at all. Bias and experience are totally unrelated.

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #21 on: March 27, 2014, 04:19:55 PM »

IMG_0001

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #22 on: March 28, 2014, 11:18:03 AM »
offering unbiased gear advice based on personal experience.

If it is based on your personal experience, by definition it is biased.   ;D

That's what biased means.   :D

Of course advice can be both biased and valuable.

Not if we are talking English
Experience
Biased
If I used my experiences to present ideas in an unfair way, then I could be called biased, similarly you can have entirely biased opinions without any experience at all. Bias and experience are totally unrelated.

I like to take part in a debate in which i was not invited so I'll add:

Sorry Private, but I think that Acutance is right from a fundamental perspective. I even think that it is evidenced in the wiki page you linked by :

'' In judgment and decision making
Main article: Cognitive bias

A cognitive bias is the human tendency to make systematic decisions in certain circumstances based on cognitive factors rather than evidence. Bias arises from various processes that are sometimes difficult to distinguish. These processes include information-processing shortcuts, motivational factors, and social influence.[1] Such biases can result from information-processing shortcuts called heuristics. They include errors in judgment, social attribution, and memory. Cognitive biases are a common outcome of human thought, and often drastically skew the reliability of anecdotal and legal evidence. It is a phenomenon studied in cognitive science and social psychology. A cognitive bias also has the tendency to make systematic decisions in certain situations.''

And further supported in the link to 'cognitive bias'.

If your advice are based only on your personal experience, they are not accounting for a significant part of user experiences and are thus biased and anecdotal. However, as stated earlier, they may still be quite valuable as they are from a knowledgeable and well intentioned individual.

No offense intended.
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dgatwood

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #23 on: May 09, 2014, 06:08:59 PM »
* pros use at least 5d series camera bodies

I use a 6D, and 6 > 5, so I'm good.  I feel sorry for those folks who spent all that money on those non-pro 1DX cameras, though.

sagittariansrock

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #24 on: May 09, 2014, 08:30:13 PM »
offering unbiased gear advice based on personal experience.

If it is based on your personal experience, by definition it is biased.   ;D

That's what biased means.   :D

Of course advice can be both biased and valuable.

Not if we are talking English
Experience
Biased
If I used my experiences to present ideas in an unfair way, then I could be called biased, similarly you can have entirely biased opinions without any experience at all. Bias and experience are totally unrelated.

I like to take part in a debate in which i was not invited so I'll add:

Sorry Private, but I think that Acutance is right from a fundamental perspective. I even think that it is evidenced in the wiki page you linked by :

'' In judgment and decision making
Main article: Cognitive bias

A cognitive bias is the human tendency to make systematic decisions in certain circumstances based on cognitive factors rather than evidence. Bias arises from various processes that are sometimes difficult to distinguish. These processes include information-processing shortcuts, motivational factors, and social influence.[1] Such biases can result from information-processing shortcuts called heuristics. They include errors in judgment, social attribution, and memory. Cognitive biases are a common outcome of human thought, and often drastically skew the reliability of anecdotal and legal evidence. It is a phenomenon studied in cognitive science and social psychology. A cognitive bias also has the tendency to make systematic decisions in certain situations.''

And further supported in the link to 'cognitive bias'.

If your advice are based only on your personal experience, they are not accounting for a significant part of user experiences and are thus biased and anecdotal. However, as stated earlier, they may still be quite valuable as they are from a knowledgeable and well intentioned individual.

No offense intended.

That's a fair attempt, but your overall interpretation isn't accurate..
Note two key phrases in the highlighted text:
1. Cognitive rather than empirical (based on evidence): If your conclusions are based on what you think/feel rather than what you objectively observe- that leads to bias. However, if it is based on objective evaluation, then it might not be biased. e.g., You use a 3rd party flash a few times, under a specific condition when you have never used a Canon flash- and it doesn't work. You say it sucks. That's bias. You test a Canon in the same exact condition and it reliably fires. You say the 3rd party flash is unreliable. That's unbiased observation.
2. Systematic: Cognitive bias is not random. It consistently follows a pattern. In the above example, you say the flash sucks without testing the Canon one because it is cheap and made by a small company. You wouldn't have made the same observation if it was a Canon flash that didn't fire.

Personal observations can very well be unbiased if based on evidence. If not, there would never be a scientific article published unless every scientist in that discipline chimed in.
I have a bit of formal training to back this up, by the way :)






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privatebydesign

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2014, 05:17:19 PM »
Thanks sagittariansrock,

Anybody that has read my various comments on the YN-E3-RT and the ST-E3-RT will know my comments come from "objective observation" not feelings. The notion that no experience can produce unbiased observation is patently rediculous.

Speculative comments on why there are or are not differences are not my mo either. Indeed I am often critcised for pointing out that there is no difference between different things, just look at the recent Sigma 1.4 vs Canon 1.2 thread.

dickgrafixstop

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #26 on: May 11, 2014, 01:06:38 PM »
Being a "pro" is a mindset - and anyone with a $10.00 box of business cards can declare himself/herself one.

jrista

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #27 on: May 11, 2014, 01:35:03 PM »
LOL

These things seriously sound like Chuck Norris jokes. :P

Here's a bit more satire:

 * Pro's don't even need to press the shutter button, the camera takes pictures for the photographer out of sheer fear.
 * A pro doesn't use flash! The camera illuminates itself by absorbing then emitting the pure awesomeness exuded by the pro photographer.
 * A pro could care less about frame rate! Because the camera takes photos for them out of fear, all they have to do is imagine the exact moment that the camera needs to photograph...and it just happens.
 * Pro's don't need to find action...action finds them.
 * A pro can shoot subjects at infinite distance without the need for a telephoto lens. The camera will subdivide it's sensor pixels on the fly according to the photographers impressive will.

:P What a crackup. Pro photographer-norris jokes. :D

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Re: "Pro" mythbusting
« Reply #27 on: May 11, 2014, 01:35:03 PM »