September 19, 2014, 10:18:10 PM

Author Topic: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?  (Read 10792 times)

LetTheRightLensIn

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #75 on: January 08, 2014, 02:52:10 PM »
If you want to compare all Canon bodies to all Nikon bodies over the past 10 years...oh, wait, we've done that - and more people chose Canon, every one of those years.  The rest is just DRoning.

No, it's you building up everything anyone but Nikon doesn't do the best and minimizing, trivializing, and making fun of everything that Canon doesn't do 100% the best, as usual without letting ten seconds go by before the sacred honor of Canon is defended by yourself.

And once we are into 10-12-14fps range 2fps means a lot less than in the 1-8fps range. Of course more is always nicer, but it's funny that you make a HUGE deal out of 12fps vs 14fps and make fun of 1-3 stops more DR at low ISO.

Quote
Back to the topic at hand: "Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?"  Well, Canon could follow Nikon's lead with a 1D XN, where the main 'upgrade' is improved AF algorithms.  Oh, wait - they're giving that to us for free with the v.2 firmware.  8)

perhaps, it remains to be seen what the D4s does. (and don't forget the 1D4 fix for the 1D3)


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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #75 on: January 08, 2014, 02:52:10 PM »

LetTheRightLensIn

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #76 on: January 08, 2014, 02:53:59 PM »
not a whole lot of info there other than improved AF

I wonder what they mean by HD-SLR?

geez, the "HD" buzzword is so dated, why even go there?  re-reading the announcement reminds me of all those products featured in the 00's that were "HD". 

Remember those "HD" night driving sunglasses?  ::)

hah I do!

and yeah these days the buzz is all UHD now

(can't wait for the UHD sunglasses  :D)

LetTheRightLensIn

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #77 on: January 08, 2014, 02:56:39 PM »


If the autofocus gives you a blurry image, isn't that the fault of the shooter? Or was there some other problem that explained why Rob Gilbraith was reporting lots of issues with the Canon 1D3 AF that Canon never seemed to be able to fix?



Canon couldn't repeat Galbraith's "issue", not really surprising when Galbraith couldn't repeat his issues when Canon sent factory staff to work with him either, they even went to Mexico or somewhere because he said he could only get it to do it at certain temperatures, so they took him to the temperature he said, and he still couldn't get consistent repeatable "issues".

And where is Mr Galbraith in the photo world now? Ah yes, no longer a pro photographer, no updated website, but a teacher in Canada.

In sharp contrast (pun intended) to the D800 AF issues that were 100% verifiable, and repeatable, in any temperature, by a chimpanzee.

If it was all fake why did the sidelines turn from white to dark gray around that time? Why did you read a lot of blogs pre-Beijing about fed up, big time PJs swapping to Nikon because they were sick of missing so many shots?

Yes, the color of the sidelines has reversed a good deal since then though, but don't pretend it didn't happen back then.

Why can like ZERO Canon users, on this forum far and away in particular, ever admit that anything about Canon that isn't the best matters at all and can never admit when people were going to Nikon but go crazy about every little thing Canon does better and whenever anyone switches back to Canon. What is the freaking big deal. Admitting when something in your system isn't the best is the fastest way to make sure that it soon will be the best, sticking your sand in the head and playing silly fanboy games helps nobody. They are just cameras. Just brands. Instead you just tease and make fun of anything brought up and anyone who does, like some kool-aid drinking gang. When Nikon sensors were falling behind way back when I seem to recall Nikon users not being afraid to admit it and getting on Nikon and soon enough they ended up with much better sensors. If everyone just praised the initial 1D3 and all the other Canon AF at that time as pefect I doubt we'd have had the 1DX/5D3 AF project.

Maybe some do make a bit too much of a big deal about things, but maybe that's because it's the only way to get past all the rabid fanboys and maybe some got sick of seeing people driven away for even the most delicately put and fair points early on an don't bother to put things delicately any more (and because making a huge deal is about the only way for enough notice to ever be taken for anything to change).

anwyay back on topic, who knows, since the D4s hints tells us nothing, a bit of an AF tweak? I don't see why that would make one expect anything in particular in response from Canon.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2014, 03:07:37 PM by LetTheRightLensIn »

Eldar

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #78 on: January 08, 2014, 03:47:15 PM »

Why can like ZERO Canon users, on this forum far and away in particular, ever admit that anything about Canon that isn't the best matters at all and can never admit when people were going to Nikon but go crazy about every little thing Canon does better and whenever anyone switches back to Canon. What is the freaking big deal. Admitting when something in your system isn't the best is the fastest way to make sure that it soon will be the best, sticking your sand in the head and playing silly fanboy games helps nobody. They are just cameras. Just brands. Instead you just tease and make fun of anything brought up and anyone who does, like some kool-aid drinking gang. When Nikon sensors were falling behind way back when I seem to recall Nikon users not being afraid to admit it and getting on Nikon and soon enough they ended up with much better sensors. If everyone just praised the initial 1D3 and all the other Canon AF at that time as pefect I doubt we'd have had the 1DX/5D3 AF project.

Maybe some do make a bit too much of a big deal about things, but maybe that's because it's the only way to get past all the rabid fanboys and maybe some got sick of seeing people driven away for even the most delicately put and fair points early on an don't bother to put things delicately any more (and because making a huge deal is about the only way for enough notice to ever be taken for anything to change).

anwyay back on topic, who knows, since the D4s hints tells us nothing, a bit of an AF tweak? I don't see why that would make one expect anything in particular in response from Canon.
I bought my first Canon probably before the majority of this forum´s readers were born. I have been loyal to Canon all these years. Currently I am very happy with the performance of my 1DX and 5DIII. And I believe they represent the best 2 body combo for my shooting at the moment.

But to prove that it is not Zero Canon users (ref. above), I can confirm that I am really impatient to get my hands on the 800/800E trasher. I think Canon should have released a body with better low ISO DR a long time ago and it irritates me to see some of the low ISO/high DR/high resolution images my Nikon 800E buddy shows, shot with the 14-24 lens I can´t get.

I don´t need everything in one body. I´d be happy to have a low ISO flagship next to my 1DX, especially after I got the Zeiss Otus. I think their initial 1D/1Ds concept was OK and I would welcome a 1DsX.

And for the record, I don´t have a clue what we will see with the D4s and I don´t think many others do either, so to see the number of posts grow towards a hundred on pure speculation is a bit ..... (fill in the blank) ;)
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mackguyver

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #79 on: January 08, 2014, 04:27:48 PM »
Maybe some do make a bit too much of a big deal about things, but maybe that's because it's the only way to get past all the rabid fanboys and maybe some got sick of seeing people driven away for even the most delicately put and fair points early on an don't bother to put things delicately any more (and because making a huge deal is about the only way for enough notice to ever be taken for anything to change).

anwyay back on topic, who knows, since the D4s hints tells us nothing, a bit of an AF tweak? I don't see why that would make one expect anything in particular in response from Canon.
Agreed, fanboys, Canon or otherwise, suck.  I love my Canon products along with many other brands, but no camera, lens, or other product is perfect and what works best for you may not work best for someone else.  If so much of your ego is wrapped up in a brand, you should really question your priorities and self-esteem, and seek some help for your insecurities.  That kind of groupthink is gold to marketers, but sad for humanity.
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Synkka

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #80 on: January 08, 2014, 05:43:41 PM »
Can't talk about swaps to Canon without mentioning Andy Rouse

http://www.arwpstore.com/index.php?mode=ipage&page=17

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #81 on: January 08, 2014, 05:45:19 PM »


If the autofocus gives you a blurry image, isn't that the fault of the shooter? Or was there some other problem that explained why Rob Gilbraith was reporting lots of issues with the Canon 1D3 AF that Canon never seemed to be able to fix?



Canon couldn't repeat Galbraith's "issue", not really surprising when Galbraith couldn't repeat his issues when Canon sent factory staff to work with him either, they even went to Mexico or somewhere because he said he could only get it to do it at certain temperatures, so they took him to the temperature he said, and he still couldn't get consistent repeatable "issues".

And where is Mr Galbraith in the photo world now? Ah yes, no longer a pro photographer, no updated website, but a teacher in Canada.

In sharp contrast (pun intended) to the D800 AF issues that were 100% verifiable, and repeatable, in any temperature, by a chimpanzee.

If it was all fake why did the sidelines turn from white to dark gray around that time? Why did you read a lot of blogs pre-Beijing about fed up, big time PJs swapping to Nikon because they were sick of missing so many shots?

Yes, the color of the sidelines has reversed a good deal since then though, but don't pretend it didn't happen back then.

Why can like ZERO Canon users, on this forum far and away in particular, ever admit that anything about Canon that isn't the best matters at all and can never admit when people were going to Nikon but go crazy about every little thing Canon does better and whenever anyone switches back to Canon. What is the freaking big deal. Admitting when something in your system isn't the best is the fastest way to make sure that it soon will be the best, sticking your sand in the head and playing silly fanboy games helps nobody. They are just cameras. Just brands. Instead you just tease and make fun of anything brought up and anyone who does, like some kool-aid drinking gang. When Nikon sensors were falling behind way back when I seem to recall Nikon users not being afraid to admit it and getting on Nikon and soon enough they ended up with much better sensors. If everyone just praised the initial 1D3 and all the other Canon AF at that time as pefect I doubt we'd have had the 1DX/5D3 AF project.

Maybe some do make a bit too much of a big deal about things, but maybe that's because it's the only way to get past all the rabid fanboys and maybe some got sick of seeing people driven away for even the most delicately put and fair points early on an don't bother to put things delicately any more (and because making a huge deal is about the only way for enough notice to ever be taken for anything to change).

anwyay back on topic, who knows, since the D4s hints tells us nothing, a bit of an AF tweak? I don't see why that would make one expect anything in particular in response from Canon.

It wasn't all fake, some 1D MkIII's had AF issues in some situations. And we have come to demand ever more of our AF. Initially an awful lot of dissatisfaction with the MkIII was due to people not taking the time to set it up fully.

As for Canon's many other issues, I am no apologist, they have been stupid re a top class ultra wide angle zoom, the lack of a really world class 14/16-24/35 has cost them way more photographers than the years it took them to answer Nikon's 200-400 f4, sure the answer was demonstrative, but the wait was painful and the resources it used could have been directed to far more pressing lens issues. Their ideas on body updates has often had us gasping, how in the hell is a dial that goes all the way round, or locks, a new camera? Where is the answer for people who want more than 25MP? Where is the answer to other manufacturers improved sensors? Why did they shoot the 5D MkII in the foot with that AF when they could have slaughtered Nikon FF efforts?

Sure, as a system, Canon suits me best, and I can live with any perceived limitations for the sake of continuity and my personal ease and comfort, but were somebody else to make as compelling a system with "better" metrics, I'd certainly look at it. The trouble is, for photographers who do use a system, fast primes, flashes, unusual lenses, etc. it really is a two horse race, Sony will never invest in one system long enough to bring out everything many pros want or need, and at this  point Nikon seem to be reeling from one miss-marketing blunder to another. Nikon have come out with some fine lenses in recent years, but they can only really be considered to be closing the gulf that was between them and Nikon rather than pulling ahead on that lens front, their body offerings are in complete disarray.
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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #81 on: January 08, 2014, 05:45:19 PM »

unfocused

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #82 on: January 08, 2014, 05:59:40 PM »
Maybe some do make a bit too much of a big deal about things, but maybe that's because it's the only way to get past all the rabid fanboys and maybe some got sick of seeing people driven away for even the most delicately put and fair points early on an don't bother to put things delicately any more (and because making a huge deal is about the only way for enough notice to ever be taken for anything to change).

anwyay back on topic, who knows, since the D4s hints tells us nothing, a bit of an AF tweak? I don't see why that would make one expect anything in particular in response from Canon.
Agreed, fanboys, Canon or otherwise, suck.  I love my Canon products along with many other brands, but no camera, lens, or other product is perfect and what works best for you may not work best for someone else.  If so much of your ego is wrapped up in a brand, you should really question your priorities and self-esteem, and seek some help for your insecurities.  That kind of groupthink is gold to marketers, but sad for humanity.

Agreed. But honestly, I think the criticism is a bit off the mark.

Yes, there are a handful of outspoken persons on this forum who defend everything Canon does and denigrate anyone who says otherwise. But, honestly, I find most of the people here, while loyal to their brand of choice, not all that fanatical about it.

I think some of this also comes from people reacting to the very tiny handful of people who insist on assigning personal motives to everything Canon does, as though the company is purposely trying to deny them a product they want. Often this translates into silly statements about how Canon better do this or do that or the company is going to go broke. Which always prompts more rational people to point out that the company is doing just fine in terms of profits and market share.

Similarly we have the conspiracy theorists who are dead certain that Canon and/or Nikon have some perfect technology boxed away in a super secret location and are refusing to unveil it. `They are probably right, it is hidden away in that same storehouse where the fake moon landing set is kept, right next to the secret CIA papers that show John Kennedy was shot by multiple assassins and just down the hall from the black helicopters.

I also find is discouraging that some people have been driven off this forum by being baited and ridiculed into extreme reactions that get them banned, while the ones who pushed them over the edge walk away and pretend innocence. Personally, I found some of the "crazies" on the forum kind of interesting if tiresome.

But, all in all, there are enough rational and knowledgeable persons on this forum to make it worthwhile (and addictive) to stick around.
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Northstar

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #83 on: January 08, 2014, 06:33:22 PM »


Quote
But, all in all, there are enough rational and knowledgeable persons on this forum to make it worthwhile (and addictive) to stick around.


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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #84 on: January 08, 2014, 06:46:08 PM »
geez, the "HD" buzzword is so dated, why even go there?  re-reading the announcement reminds me of all those products featured in the 00's that were "HD". 

Remember those "HD" night driving sunglasses?  ::)

hah I do!

and yeah these days the buzz is all UHD now

(can't wait for the UHD sunglasses  :D)

buy 2 "HD" D4s' fitted with yet to be revealed "U" ND filters, one for each eye!
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sagittariansrock

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #85 on: January 08, 2014, 07:06:15 PM »
Both Canon and Nikon have their individual strengths and weaknesses. It might be that some people's efforts to portray Canon as inferior triggers the indignation and loyalty in some others to defend Canon, sometimes rationally, sometimes over zealously. I am sure hidden within Canon's successful bottom line is countless bad decisions, as will be whenever one has to second guess what the consumer will want.
It's unfortunate that sometimes these debates turn personal. I used to take offense earlier but now I've realized that anonymous online forums are great vehicles for people to vent the frustration of their day, so one shouldn't take these too seriously. At the end of the day, neither are we responsible for Canon's good or bad decisions, nor do we get anything by attacking or defending them.
Having said that, a super vague development announcement seems like a desperate move. Not that I am saying there's any reason for it- undoubtedly D4 and D800/E are exceptional cameras and I'd have loved to have one if I had the money (the D800 that is, I'm too weak for pro dSLRs :) )
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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #86 on: January 09, 2014, 03:35:53 AM »
It's funny when Nikon and Canon trolls go to war over announced cameras. I just sit back with some pop corn and watch the fire works...or I get out and do some shooting :D
My first camera was a Canon AV-1 (manual focus, and Av only). I chose Canon becuase that's what my Dad used and I could borrow his lenses. I've stuck with the brand for my whole life and I've never looked back. For me operate a lecia, Sony or Nikon is like handling aline technology....I mean after all, their dials go the wrong way :D

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #87 on: January 15, 2014, 10:38:56 AM »
Can't talk about swaps to Canon without mentioning Andy Rouse

http://www.arwpstore.com/index.php?mode=ipage&page=17
+1 I did enjoy his review on the 1 DX... ;) ;) ;) ;)
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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #87 on: January 15, 2014, 10:38:56 AM »

ewg963

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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #88 on: January 15, 2014, 10:40:25 AM »
It's funny when Nikon and Canon trolls go to war over announced cameras. I just sit back with some pop corn and watch the fire works...or I get out and do some shooting :D
My first camera was a Canon AV-1 (manual focus, and Av only). I chose Canon becuase that's what my Dad used and I could borrow his lenses. I've stuck with the brand for my whole life and I've never looked back. For me operate a lecia, Sony or Nikon is like handling aline technology....I mean after all, their dials go the wrong way :D
+1 ;)
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Re: CES 2014. Nikon D4s is a fact. What can be expected from Canon?
« Reply #88 on: January 15, 2014, 10:40:25 AM »