December 22, 2014, 02:59:29 AM

Author Topic: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]  (Read 15360 times)

traveller

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2014, 12:06:49 PM »
Yes, it's likely that the next camera is launched T6i. I just hope it has the same sensor 70D.

Canon is shrewd when it comes to milking profits from sensors.  Consider that the T5i/700D did not get the latest version of the 18 MP APS-C sensor.  The T5i's sensor has Hybrid CMOS AF (same sensor as the T4i and the EOS M), whereas the sensor used in the SL1/100D and the EOS M2 has Hybrid CMOS II AF (where the phase AF area covers 80% of the frame vs. just the central portion).  That allows Canon to release another T#i-series body with a 'new' (to the line) sensor (but not the 70D's sensor).  Put Digic 6 in there, and they're good to go with the T6i/750D.

I was being factious because of my frustration with Canon.  In truth I think 2014 will be a good year for new hardware.  I know that Canon has cited the 5DIII as one of their current success stories so I don't expect much there.  This might be the 1DX going to 24MP or it might finally be the first of the new sensors.
 I'm probably wrong but I think that the Nikon 800e caught Canon flat footed.  Their sensors ruled the roost for a long time and the 800 was  the point where they knew their current sensors could not continue to compete with the Sony's. Perhaps they were working a new line for a while but the Nikon's with Sony sensors really got their attention.  I'm sure that it takes years and years before a sensor goes from design to profitable production.  Hopefully, Canon is near then end of that cycle and we will see some significant new sensor technology.  Canon has made real improvements everywhere but in sensors. Fortunately, they have held their market share but that can't last forever.  Sony probably has another generation in the pipeline already.

Canon's sensor advantage came from their early adoption of the CMOS type sensor; they have fallen behind as other manufacturers also adopted this technology. Canon fabricate their own (large) sensors, which represents a considerable capital investment, and are therefore understandably keen to recapture the maximum value back from this. I think that Sony has an advantage here, because they sell so many sensors to other camera manufacturers, they can afford to move their sensors forward a fabrication generation more often than Canon. As much as I understand Canon's reluctance to invest in new fabrication technology at a time of recession and market contraction, I think that they've reached the end of the road with what they can squeeze out of their current technology. Either they will have to change their fabrication foundries over to newer sub-0.18 micron (or even sub-0.11 micron) process generation architectures, or they'll have to start subcontracting the manufacture of their sensor out to a third party foundry partner.

Sony does seem to have established itself as the dominant player in CMOS sensors at the moment, but it doesn't have the field all to itself; apart from Canon, Aptina have shown they can produce and Toshiba sensors have found their way into the Nikon line-up. Even the vaunted Olympus EM1, which everyone thought had a Sony sensor, turns out to be using a Panasonic sensor -another manufacturer that people were starting to question.

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2014, 12:06:49 PM »

tron

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2014, 12:29:05 PM »
The replacement to the EOS 7D Mark II and a third camera that is currently unknown.
I'm happy to see that they'll be replacing the non-existent 7D Mark II :o
Darn! I waited 4 years for the camera, and then one morning it came and went and I missed it! Darn!
;D Aren't you happy that you will finally get 7D mark III ? ;D
« Last Edit: February 19, 2014, 05:51:34 PM by tron »

tron

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2014, 12:30:03 PM »
I think they will announce a high end body. I have just ordered my 2nd 5DMkIII  ;D

SwampYankee

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2014, 12:39:04 PM »
Yes, it's likely that the next camera is launched T6i. I just hope it has the same sensor 70D.

Canon is shrewd when it comes to milking profits from sensors.  Consider that the T5i/700D did not get the latest version of the 18 MP APS-C sensor.  The T5i's sensor has Hybrid CMOS AF (same sensor as the T4i and the EOS M), whereas the sensor used in the SL1/100D and the EOS M2 has Hybrid CMOS II AF (where the phase AF area covers 80% of the frame vs. just the central portion).  That allows Canon to release another T#i-series body with a 'new' (to the line) sensor (but not the 70D's sensor).  Put Digic 6 in there, and they're good to go with the T6i/750D.

I was being factious because of my frustration with Canon.  In truth I think 2014 will be a good year for new hardware.  I know that Canon has cited the 5DIII as one of their current success stories so I don't expect much there.  This might be the 1DX going to 24MP or it might finally be the first of the new sensors.
 I'm probably wrong but I think that the Nikon 800e caught Canon flat footed.  Their sensors ruled the roost for a long time and the 800 was  the point where they knew their current sensors could not continue to compete with the Sony's. Perhaps they were working a new line for a while but the Nikon's with Sony sensors really got their attention.  I'm sure that it takes years and years before a sensor goes from design to profitable production.  Hopefully, Canon is near then end of that cycle and we will see some significant new sensor technology.  Canon has made real improvements everywhere but in sensors. Fortunately, they have held their market share but that can't last forever.  Sony probably has another generation in the pipeline already.

Canon's sensor advantage came from their early adoption of the CMOS type sensor; they have fallen behind as other manufacturers also adopted this technology. Canon fabricate their own (large) sensors, which represents a considerable capital investment, and are therefore understandably keen to recapture the maximum value back from this. I think that Sony has an advantage here, because they sell so many sensors to other camera manufacturers, they can afford to move their sensors forward a fabrication generation more often than Canon. As much as I understand Canon's reluctance to invest in new fabrication technology at a time of recession and market contraction, I think that they've reached the end of the road with what they can squeeze out of their current technology. Either they will have to change their fabrication foundries over to newer sub-0.18 micron (or even sub-0.11 micron) process generation architectures, or they'll have to start subcontracting the manufacture of their sensor out to a third party foundry partner.

Sony does seem to have established itself as the dominant player in CMOS sensors at the moment, but it doesn't have the field all to itself; apart from Canon, Aptina have shown they can produce and Toshiba sensors have found their way into the Nikon line-up. Even the vaunted Olympus EM1, which everyone thought had a Sony sensor, turns out to be using a Panasonic sensor -another manufacturer that people were starting to question.

I presume that Sony would sell them sensors but at something of a markup.  Nikon was able to absorb the cost and put at good cameras, although the 800 is not flying off the shelves and the 600 is headed towards a class action lawsuit.  Dispite the outcry it was a really god day for Apple when they got in bed with Intel.
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tron

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2014, 01:31:43 PM »
I own a 5DIII and love it but I shot with a Sony 7R this weekend and the images were just better.  Sharper by a wide margin.  I make big prints and it really shows there.  Maybe I just had a good day and the camera had nothing to do with it?
Interesting! Although I do not intend to change my hardware (I just ordered a second 5DIII) could you care to elaborate please? (for example did you focus using LV in both models, you used same lens, same aperture, tripod, same PP?)

 I always wondered why the 22mp raw processing of 5D3 is so slower than the 21mp raw processing of 5D2. Combining this with old case where DPP was not producing sharp pictures - THAT HAS BEEN CORRECTED WITH AN UPDATE - I wonder whether a possibly strong AA filter has something to do with it (just wondering, NOT knowing...)


wsmith96

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #20 on: February 19, 2014, 05:32:02 PM »
The replacement to the EOS 7D Mark II and a third camera that is currently unknown.
I'm happy to see that they'll be replacing the non-existent 7D Mark II :o
Darn! I waited 4 years for the camera, and then one morning it came and went and I missed it! Darn!

something about oil or grease on the sensor/mirror... they pulled it from the shelves  :) 
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scyrene

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2014, 06:09:31 PM »
Yes, it's likely that the next camera is launched T6i. I just hope it has the same sensor 70D.

Canon is shrewd when it comes to milking profits from sensors.  Consider that the T5i/700D did not get the latest version of the 18 MP APS-C sensor.  The T5i's sensor has Hybrid CMOS AF (same sensor as the T4i and the EOS M), whereas the sensor used in the SL1/100D and the EOS M2 has Hybrid CMOS II AF (where the phase AF area covers 80% of the frame vs. just the central portion).  That allows Canon to release another T#i-series body with a 'new' (to the line) sensor (but not the 70D's sensor).  Put Digic 6 in there, and they're good to go with the T6i/750D.

I was being factious because of my frustration with Canon.  In truth I think 2014 will be a good year for new hardware.  I know that Canon has cited the 5DIII as one of their current success stories so I don't expect much there.  This might be the 1DX going to 24MP or it might finally be the first of the new sensors.
 I'm probably wrong but I think that the Nikon 800e caught Canon flat footed.  Their sensors ruled the roost for a long time and the 800 was  the point where they knew their current sensors could not continue to compete with the Sony's. Perhaps they were working a new line for a while but the Nikon's with Sony sensors really got their attention.  I'm sure that it takes years and years before a sensor goes from design to profitable production.  Hopefully, Canon is near then end of that cycle and we will see some significant new sensor technology.  Canon has made real improvements everywhere but in sensors. Fortunately, they have held their market share but that can't last forever.  Sony probably has another generation in the pipeline already.

Here we go again...

I own a 5DIII and love it but I shot with a Sony 7R this weekend and the images were just better.  Sharper by a wide margin.  I make big prints and it really shows there.  Maybe I just had a good day and the camera had nothing to do with it?

Oh I don't dispute it. But yet another thread has turned into people 'worrying' that Canon is facing ruin because their sensors aren't as good as Sony's. Now, the real world scenarios where the difference would be worth buying a new body (for those of us with a fairly recent Canon body) will be a subset of all situations - maybe (probably) a minority for most. And the autofocus speed, and native lens range (let's not get into using adaptors) and form factor of the body... those are important too - more important for some (maybe many?) users.

My point is, Canon is doing okay. Some other companies are doing better in *some areas*. Good for them. Competition is good. If you like the A7(r), good - get one. Use it, enjoy it. But try not to get caught up in the 'newer sensors are EVERYTHING' bandwagon that I've only seen here and in dpreview comments. I've no doubt something new will come along. Be patient.

(And I'm sure Neuro can tell you the relative sales of D800(E) bodies versus the Canon equivalents).
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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2014, 06:09:31 PM »

preppyak

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #22 on: February 19, 2014, 08:36:09 PM »
Where are the lenses in a so-called Year of the Lens for Canon? Sigh
Yeah, its gonna into March of "the year of the lens" before we even have a shot at a new lens. Which probably means no possible availability until April or May.

Is Canon really going to go a year and a half between announcing lenses (200-400 not withstanding)?

Richard8971

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #23 on: February 19, 2014, 09:17:03 PM »
I can understand Canon "reusing" the 18mp sensor over and over again as Nikon has done the same with their 16mp sensor and now new 24mp sensor. It makes good marketing sense, in a way. I just think that it has been more noticeable with Canon as the last 5 years and 9 camera bodies have been 18mp even though there have been some small changes between certain sensor designs. Noise levels have not gotten noticeably better either, so naturally, people have become frustrated.

The 7D is 5 years old and I still think it is one hell of a camera body that is very capable. All crop sensors have noise so if your job demands noise free images, you are not looking at crop bodies anyway, you are shooting full frame.

I think the last couple great cameras from Canon were the 5D3 and 1DX and other than that nothing has been released (in MO) from Canon that is ground-breaking or anything that would make me want to give up my 7D and 40D backup. I still use my 40D and the images are stellar, I will never give up my 40D!

Hopefully, IF Canon makes a 7D replacement, it will show the "world" what a great crop body can do!

D
Canon 6D, 5D2, 7Dv2.03, 50D, 40D, T1i, XTi...XT (& lenses, flahses), various powershots... You get the idea... I have a problem. :)

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dilbert

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #24 on: February 19, 2014, 09:29:47 PM »
So an unspecific rumor that ...

Really, this is a rumor about vaporwear to keep people interested in Canon and stop them from thinking about what other brands are doing. This type of rumor doesn't have to be anything - all that it needs to do is offer Canon owners the prospect of something better so that they all think "Well, if I want just a bit longer, maybe Canon will have something newer and better".

Clever rumor seeding.

mkabi

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #25 on: February 19, 2014, 09:35:02 PM »

Hopefully, IF Canon makes a 7D replacement, it will show the "world" what a great crop body can do!

D

Yeah, I don't think they are going to release a 7D replacement...
Canon Photographers are in for a dissappointing year, Cinematographers on the other hand....

Okay, look at the rumors...
3 DSLRs for 2014:
-One down, introduced as the T5.
-We all know the T6i is going to be next, a rebel is released every year.
-Last one will be a cinema DSLR, a DSLR is a DSLR whether its under a Cinema EOS category or not. But no worries, its going to have the same sensor as the 70D (thats my prediction).

EDITTED TO ADD: If this rumor:
http://www.canonrumors.com/2014/01/canon-to-offer-global-shutter-for-2-5k-video-on-an-upcoming-dslr-cr1/
has any merit, I expect it to be in the next Cinema EOS DSLR. In which case it is a 7D replacement, because if you follow the developments by Magic Lantern, they already have enabled the current 7D to do 2.5K:
https://www.google.ca/?gfe_rd=ctrl&ei=Wk0FU_m0AoKN8QeFvYH4Cg&gws_rd=cr#q=2.5K+by+7D
Its only natural to add it in the next iteration without the help of Magic Lantern :D
« Last Edit: February 19, 2014, 09:55:22 PM by mkabi »
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Richard8971

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #26 on: February 19, 2014, 10:04:18 PM »
Yeah, I don't think they are going to release a 7D replacement...

I think it's very possible you are right, for 2 more reasons in addition to the ones you already mentioned,

1) The 2.0 firmware update unlocked some very cool features to an already great camera giving it more "life" and,

2) The Nikon "king-of-the-crop-sensor" body is the D7100. My wife shoots with one and the images are fantastic. Nikon really doesn't have a 7D equivalent and the 70D is lined up to compete with the D7100. I still think the 7D is the better choice (for a couple of reasons) but the 70D and D7100 are very, very nice cameras. I don't shoot video so I can't base my choices on anything other than still shooting and as such I could care less what video features any of these cameras have, but many people do care about video features.

I see tons of 7D's when I go shooting, however I am seeing more Nikon D7000's and D7100's out there. Nikon has a real winner with these two cameras and I think Canon might have realized that they don't need a high performance crop body other than the 70D.

Canon may feel that keeping the 7D around for a couple of more years will keep the budget minded sports and wildlife photographiers happy and the 70D will make the rest happy. I really won't believe anything regarding a 7D2 until I actually can buy one for myself.

Fortunately for me, the 7D suits my shooting needs and I really don't feel the need to upgrade unless the FF bug finally hits me and I buy a 5D3.

D
« Last Edit: February 19, 2014, 10:23:20 PM by Richard8971 »
Canon 6D, 5D2, 7Dv2.03, 50D, 40D, T1i, XTi...XT (& lenses, flahses), various powershots... You get the idea... I have a problem. :)

Wife shoots Nikon, D7000, D7100, (lenses and flashes)... we constantly tease each other that our cameras are better than each others!

scottburgess

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #27 on: February 19, 2014, 10:30:00 PM »
And the third Canon camera of 2014 is....

::drum roll::

The EOS My, a rerelease of the EOS M in sunshine yellow!

 :P


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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #27 on: February 19, 2014, 10:30:00 PM »

Zv

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #28 on: February 19, 2014, 11:39:11 PM »
I can understand Canon "reusing" the 18mp sensor over and over again as Nikon has done the same with their 16mp sensor and now new 24mp sensor. It makes good marketing sense, in a way. I just think that it has been more noticeable with Canon as the last 5 years and 9 camera bodies have been 18mp even though there have been some small changes between certain sensor designs. Noise levels have not gotten noticeably better either, so naturally, people have become frustrated.

The 7D is 5 years old and I still think it is one hell of a camera body that is very capable. All crop sensors have noise so if your job demands noise free images, you are not looking at crop bodies anyway, you are shooting full frame.

I think the last couple great cameras from Canon were the 5D3 and 1DX and other than that nothing has been released (in MO) from Canon that is ground-breaking or anything that would make me want to give up my 7D and 40D backup. I still use my 40D and the images are stellar, I will never give up my 40D!

Hopefully, IF Canon makes a 7D replacement, it will show the "world" what a great crop body can do!

D

I agree the 7D is still a great camera, capable of taking amazing pictures in good light. It suffers a bit in low light though. I think a 7D replacement isn't out of the question but I am starting to doubt if it will be this year.

If Canon put in a completely new sensor, dual Digic 5, with DPAF, perhaps wifi and and touchscreen plus a higher burst rate and 4K video a lot of folk will be happy. Even without the 4K video (which I think is a stretch) this would be a great camera. Improvements to ISO noise are prob not going to be groundbreaking but hopefully better than what it is now.

Also, I think the 6D should be in the category of something great released recently. For the price you are getting superb IQ and features. It pretty much brought FF to the masses. Before that the only cheap options were the dated 5D cameras. For the same price as the 5D2 used you get a similar spec'd camera but more modern and with insane high ISO usability. Four years ago that was unheard of at that price point.

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Tugela

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #29 on: February 20, 2014, 01:50:10 AM »
Yes, it's likely that the next camera is launched T6i. I just hope it has the same sensor 70D.

Canon is shrewd when it comes to milking profits from sensors.  Consider that the T5i/700D did not get the latest version of the 18 MP APS-C sensor.  The T5i's sensor has Hybrid CMOS AF (same sensor as the T4i and the EOS M), whereas the sensor used in the SL1/100D and the EOS M2 has Hybrid CMOS II AF (where the phase AF area covers 80% of the frame vs. just the central portion).  That allows Canon to release another T#i-series body with a 'new' (to the line) sensor (but not the 70D's sensor).  Put Digic 6 in there, and they're good to go with the T6i/750D.

I doubt it. A 70D body already costs barely more than the current rebel when it is released. What is more likely to happen is that the rebel line will not be updated and the 70D will take that place in the lineup, since it is about the same price point. The top end APS-C will be taken by the new 7D2 (or whatever they call it), and will probably have advanced video features that would allow it to compete in the same space as the GH4. The last of the three speculated DSLRs would then be a full frame camera, replacing either the 6D or 5D3 (probably they would do the 6D first). Full frame cameras have not been updated for some time and are due, if they are to remain competitive.

Canon is in the business of making money, they need their revenue stream flowing and the way to do that is to convince people that it is time to update their bodies. An iterative update will not cut it in that regard, so we can expect something substantial in higher end cameras. Since they have already said that they are going to be focussing on video, what will probably happen are a set of new cameras will incremental upgrades in still capabilities and large upgrades in video capabilities. That is where the growth potential is, and (unless they are stupid) they will capitalize on the current interest in 4K and high quality output to drive that process. While the average Joe might not care about 4K and video quality, the target group that buys their high end cameras most certainly is.

So, at the low end the new Rebel T5 will provide good quality stills for the average Joe (who doesn't care that much about video quality). The 70D will fill the spot in the lineup previously occupied by the Rebel Txi series, with a price drop of 200-300 dollars to get it in the sweet spot. The high end of the consumer market will be targeted by the 7D2 which will have excellent APS-C stills capability and high quality camcorder like capabilities for 1080p video. The prosumer market will be targeted by something like a 6D2/5D4 which will provide excellent full frame stills and high quality 4K capabilities (similar to the GH4). That way they could revamp the entire line and provide something for each of the four main market segments to drive growth.

At the professional level they introduce the new cinema EOS models to address the dedicated film makers. There will be a high end model (8-10K range) for the real professionals, and a lower end model (3-4K range) for the wannabe amateurs.

In addition, in the camcorder segment there will be new 4K camcorders, a semi professional model similar to the HA 20/25 and a consumer model similar to the Vixia HFG30. One or two professional big bucks camcorders will be introduced to address that market segment as well.

If they do this over the course of the next 9-12 months they will revamp pretty much every market segment and keep them competitive, particularly with respect to the changes that video is currently undergoing.

That is my prediction of what will happen.

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Re: Canon DSLR Announcement in March? [CR1]
« Reply #29 on: February 20, 2014, 01:50:10 AM »