August 23, 2014, 09:27:46 AM

Author Topic: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?  (Read 5233 times)

pedro

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Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« on: February 25, 2014, 01:38:47 AM »
Hi, now that the D4s is a fact, what is to be expected by Canon?
We are living in a crazy age. ISO 409600. Looking forward to see some RAW samples...
http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikon-d4s
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J.R.

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2014, 05:10:59 AM »
This new camera is continuing with the same 16.2MP sensor and 11fps vs. 10fps. Apparently the other changes are also cosmetic in nature.

The ISO 409600 is expanded ISO, let's see what gives
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CarlTN

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2014, 06:04:35 AM »
Hi, now that the D4s is a fact, what is to be expected by Canon?
We are living in a crazy age. ISO 409600. Looking forward to see some RAW samples...
http://www.dpreview.com/previews/nikon-d4s

Wow I didn't know it was going to go up on the ISO capability.  I must now sell all my Canon gear and buy Nikon!  Seriously though, I like seeing that...I should read more.  Thanks for posting it!

They claim the sensor is “newly designed”…hmm I should rent one of these with their 200 f/2, and see what it can do in the twilight…but I bet the body will cost $400 for just a 4 day rental!  LR doesn’t list it as “pre-order” yet, I wonder which rental place will get it first?

The standard ISO range still stops at 25,600…so that sucks.  1DX has been up to 52k in the "normal range" for a long time now! 

The D4s has a “small raw size” of 8 megapixel…assuming that is a “crop”…again that’s something Canon might not ever do.  Yet Nikon have done it since the D3, or earlier?  Didn't the D4 also have it?

3020 shots per charge.  What cells go into these batteries?  I know the 1DX uses three 18650…I just assumed Nikon did the same.  How are they getting so much more battery life?  I know the 1DX probably consumes a lot more power, even than this new D4s…but I don’t know if Nikon use the same cells.  (I could google it but I don't feel like it right now!)

The mirror has a shorter travel distance…interesting.  And yet they didn't increase the fps, perhaps due to other factors such as processing, shutter...I don't know?

“Another small change is the camera’s ability to use the Auto ISO feature while in manual exposure mode.”  But…but…but I thought all you “experts” had told me that was already available on the “old” D4…what’s up with that?

And what’s up with not being able to copy and paste dpreview’s text?  I had to type that quote myself!!
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 06:19:32 AM by CarlTN »

expatinasia

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2014, 06:12:14 AM »
Reading in a lot of the Nikon forums that a lot were hoping for more of a bump in FPS. The 1D X is being praised a fair bit.

If I read it correctly what is important with regards to the ISO is that now a picture that was taken at 1,600 would look as if it was taken at 800 or something (over a D4). So the benefits are really lower down the ISO scale. I did not really get why they need 409600, but it is a Nikon!

« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 06:14:42 AM by expatinasia »
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CarlTN

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2014, 06:20:39 AM »
Reading in a lot of the Nikon forums that a lot were hoping for more of a bump in FPS. The 1D X is being praised a fair bit.

If I read it correctly what is important with regards to the ISO is that now a picture that was taken at 1,600 would look as if it was taken at 800 or something (over a D4). So the benefits are really lower down the ISO scale. I did not really get why they need 409600, but it is a Nikon!

Probably true, but if the benefits are only below ISO 1600...well that kind of sucks too.  Maybe I won't rent one after all!

Other things I am just now learning.  The D4 and D4s had buttons with backlighting?  That's a good idea.  But the viewfinder...wow it's literally a hair larger than my 6D.  That's no good, since it costs so much more.  I want a bigger viewfinder view than the 1DX!  Not smaller...

I suspect only the most well-healed Nikon pros will buy one of these early on.  The rest might wait a bit longer, depending on how much they've used their D4 already.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 06:42:47 AM by CarlTN »

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2014, 07:10:25 AM »
the D4s is out and it´s..... meh!

canon has not to do much to make the 1D X Mk2 better at all points in the feature list.

so i expect a minor upgrade from canon. :(

Lightmaster

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2014, 07:10:56 AM »
This new camera is continuing with the same 16.2MP sensor and 11fps vs. 10fps. Apparently the other changes are also cosmetic in nature.

The ISO 409600 is expanded ISO, let's see what gives

nope nikon says it´s a new developed 16.2 MP sensor... whatever that means.
but it´s not the same.

Quote from: CarlTN
The mirror has a shorter travel distance…interesting.  And yet they didn't increase the fps, perhaps due to other factors such as processing, shutter...I don't know?

actually they did. from 10 to 11fps.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 07:15:39 AM by Lightmaster »

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2014, 07:14:50 AM »
If I read it correctly what is important with regards to the ISO is that now a picture that was taken at 1,600 would look as if it was taken at 800 or something (over a D4). So the benefits are really lower down the ISO scale. I did not really get why they need 409600, but it is a Nikon!

well no.. i doubt that nikon has doubled ISO performance just so.   ;D
if they really claim that im curious to check that in detail.

that the max native ISO is only 25600 speaks against it i think.


maybe JPG noise reduction.. a bit more smear... a bit less noise? :)




« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 07:49:57 AM by Lightmaster »

iron-t

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2014, 08:42:36 AM »
A truly yawn-worthy release by Nikon.  Canon will feel zero pressure to respond.

I guess at a certain point, though, it's fair to ask how much better digital cameras are going to get.  The innovations are bound to do as they've been doing, getting slower and more incremental.  Let's say Canon takes a 1D X, pops in a 36 MP dual-pixel AF sensor and touch screen and crams it into a 5D-size body.  Would you ever need to upgrade?

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2014, 10:12:08 AM »
Will the screen still be green?   

This does nothing to the 1dx or Canon...it would piss me off if I was a Nikon guy and I had bought a D4 anytime in the past year. 

1DXii doesn't become available until late 2015.

also...it's a clear sign that the 1dX was the better camera...and Nikon had to do something to keep it's pros from switching, and to keep the first time buying a pro body "upgraders" from switching.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 10:27:07 AM by Northstar »
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drjlo

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2014, 10:24:56 AM »

maybe JPG noise reduction.. a bit more smear... a bit less noise? :)

I suspect Nikon is talking about jpeg noise improvement, kind of like how Canon hyped jpeg improvement when 5D III came out. 

D4s is yawn city, but perhaps people who wanted D4 can get one cheaper now. 
Instead of D4s, the camera Canon needs to respond to is Nikon D5300, which really makes the current Rebels look embarrassing  :-[

rs

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2014, 11:03:14 AM »
This looks like the higher ISO's are mostly down to a jpeg processing change, in other words stronger noise reduction. The 'new' 16.2 MP sensor is probably the mild refresh it received when it was dropped in the Df.

The frame rate merely halves the gap between the D4 and the 1D X - nothing to make Canon sweat. And the other changes seem fairly minor for an all new higher priced replacement. Auto ISO in manual? A free of charge firmware update did that on that Canon side.

Canon's flagship model announced way back in 2011 is looking pretty good right now with its higher MP, frame rate and more AF points. The D5 might eventually trump it, but Canon will no doubt have a new model out around then. Or will the D5 just bridge the gap to the 1D X a little more?
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Chuck Alaimo

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2014, 01:03:27 PM »
so, shortly after the announcement, Here are some thoughts from 2 of my nikon shooting friends...

"-No jump in mp from D4. 20 would have been nice
-Can't stand XQD. Not so much because it's flawed but because two different kinds of cards in the same device is just stupid and illogical. Why not just stop dicking around and make both slots XQD if it's so great? Two kinds if cards. Two kinds if readers. Pain in the ass desk cluter.
-$500 jump in price.
-Might as well stick with D3s for action and buy a D800 for landscape and studio.
D3s fullfills high ISO needs and speed needs.

Suck it, Nikon."

"Agreed wholeheartedly, and this probably is going to push a lot of people to jump ship to Canon too i bet. Nikon raising the price point for insignificant changes year after year, the market is only going to tolerate that for so long"


LOL...grass is always greener .....

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Chuck Alaimo

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2014, 01:11:19 PM »
the D4s is out and it´s..... meh!

canon has not to do much to make the 1D X Mk2 better at all points in the feature list.

so i expect a minor upgrade from canon. :(

why would you expect that?  I can picture the canon imaging board room where they debate the future of each line.  They have their plan that they'd rather stick too (which is not rush a new 1 series to market, take their time to make something truly awesome), and their emergency plan (reaction strategy, a less thought out more marginal refresh to compete if the competition does something that warrants reacting)

The d4s doesn't look much different from the d4.  I'm sure people will buy it, butI think the 1dx stands in competition.  We'll see, the proof is in the pudding  - and as we know, you can't 100% judge a camera on a spec sheet.  How will the early adopters feel and will the images from it rock the photography world, that will in the end determine what canon does.

Personally I think this will lead canon to staying the course...
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CarlTN

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Re: Now that the D4s is introduced, what's next at Canon?
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2014, 08:37:36 PM »
This new camera is continuing with the same 16.2MP sensor and 11fps vs. 10fps. Apparently the other changes are also cosmetic in nature.

The ISO 409600 is expanded ISO, let's see what gives

nope nikon says it´s a new developed 16.2 MP sensor... whatever that means.
but it´s not the same.

Quote from: CarlTN
The mirror has a shorter travel distance…interesting.  And yet they didn't increase the fps, perhaps due to other factors such as processing, shutter...I don't know?

actually they did. from 10 to 11fps.

But the D4 could do 11 in crop mode couldn't it?