July 24, 2014, 04:10:08 PM

Poll

What will be Canon's approach to the second line of Speedlite flashes?

Stick with 430EX II and have the single RT-enabled flash, 600EX-RT
7 (29.2%)
Bring out an RT-enabled replacement for the 430EX II
17 (70.8%)
Bring out a non-RT enabled replacement for the 430EX II
0 (0%)
Other
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 24

Voting closed: March 14, 2014, 04:51:14 PM

Author Topic: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement  (Read 6313 times)

sagittariansrock

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RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« on: March 07, 2014, 03:51:14 PM »
I have seen speculations and rumors on this forum since a year back regarding replacements to the 430EX II, but nothing has materialized. On the other hand, there are significant rebates on the 600EX-RT, which makes me wonder if Canon wants to abolish this second line of Speedlites altogether? What do you guys think? What are the relative merits of having a cheaper 600EX-RT vs a smaller 430EX replacement.
EOS 5DIII, EOS 5D | Rokinon 14mm f/2.8, TS-E 17mm f/4L, EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II USM, EF 35mm f/1.4L USM, EF 40mm f/2.8 STM, EF 50mm f/1.4 USM, EF 135mm f/2L USM, EF 70-200 f/2.8L IS II USM, 1.4x III, 2x III | 600-EX-RT x3

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RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« on: March 07, 2014, 03:51:14 PM »

privatebydesign

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2014, 04:07:24 PM »
Having been using the 600-EX-RT's, the ST-E3-RT, and the YN-E3-RT for a while now and I can say I will only buy 600's, I thought I'd be interested in 450-EX-RT's but there is no doubt they would have some restrictions over the 600's and I am very happy with the performance of the RT system as it is.

So no, I am not interested in a 400 series RT, a YN-600-RT or pretty much anything else RT, just 600's and ST's are good for me.

Others I am sure will want studio flash integration, but that is not a serious issue for me, I have never found the need for constantly altering my studio style setups so don't have the need for remote control as much as with speedlites.
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Jim Saunders

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2014, 10:42:30 PM »
A 4xx-RT flash?  I'd give up strobe, optical triggering, and a linear tradeoff between reduced GN and reduced price.  I could take or leave using it as a master, but provision for an external battery is a must.  I could see using them for background fill, for a shot like the one attached.  Gorram black-hole arenas...

Jim
I'd probably do better to invest more time and less money.

RLPhoto

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2014, 10:58:34 PM »
I'd like a 440rt. If it's the same price as the 430exII, I wouldn't look at many third party options if I was starting out again. Canon will eventually release it and it will sell like hotcakes.

Marsu42

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2014, 02:37:57 AM »
Canon will eventually release it and it will sell like hotcakes.

By this point, I somehow doubt that. Yn will have their clone 600ex flashes out by then (if you want to have more flash power @lower price and probably reliability) and is going ahead with other rt equipment. Unless they completely bomb Canon has a problem: The 600rt price has dropped some, and the 440rt will be most introduced at the usual higher starting price - so except bulk/weight there will be the usual long list of disadvantages of the "small brother".

My guess is that Canon will wait until they release a new camera body with integrated rt controller to have a slave-only 440rt go along with it. 7d2 anyone :-p ?

RLPhoto

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #5 on: March 08, 2014, 03:42:40 AM »
Canon will eventually release it and it will sell like hotcakes.

By this point, I somehow doubt that. Yn will have their clone 600ex flashes out by then (if you want to have more flash power @lower price and probably reliability) and is going ahead with other rt equipment. Unless they completely bomb Canon has a problem: The 600rt price has dropped some, and the 440rt will be most introduced at the usual higher starting price - so except bulk/weight there will be the usual long list of disadvantages of the "small brother".

My guess is that Canon will wait until they release a new camera body with integrated rt controller to have a slave-only 440rt go along with it. 7d2 anyone :-p ?

Even with the yn versions of the 580II and the 430II, they still sold like hotcakes. (Even though much more expensive. ) So I'm sure the new RT versions will also.

digital paradise

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2014, 11:31:22 AM »
I voted keep the 600, no 430 update. Unless Canon goes to RT in the body you need another flash or the STE3 to make RT worth it. If you are going off camera then you are looking at modifiers down the road that require more power. I think serious off camera shooters will want more power. YN will not come not come out with a smaller version of the 600 clone (whenever it comes out) just because it will be reasonably priced and there will be competition from others one day. Besides if Canon comes out with a 430 RT why would people buy it when they can get a YN 600 for the same price.

I think Canon will keep the 430 non RT for you basic single flash on camera photog. They may update it to make it sound more fancy. Heck they may even just drop that line one day which would make the 320 the basic intro flash. I could be wrong but YN came out with their own transmitter within 2 years of Canon's STE3 which is ½ the price. As a business you have to think about R&D and manufacturing change costs vs return on investment. I'd focus on pricing current RT products more competitively. They are going to feel it when YN comes out with the RT flash. Others like Godox are around the corner.                 
« Last Edit: March 14, 2014, 11:33:52 AM by digital paradise »

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2014, 11:31:22 AM »

privatebydesign

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2014, 11:55:15 AM »
I voted keep the 600, no 430 update. Unless Canon goes to RT in the body you need another flash or the STE3 to make RT worth it. If you are going off camera then you are looking at modifiers down the road that require more power. I think serious off camera shooters will want more power. YN will not come not come out with a smaller version of the 600 clone (whenever it comes out) just because it will be reasonably priced and there will be competition from others one day. Besides if Canon comes out with a 430 RT why would people buy it when they can get a YN 600 for the same price.

I think Canon will keep the 430 non RT for you basic single flash on camera photog. They may update it to make it sound more fancy. Heck they may even just drop that line one day which would make the 320 the basic intro flash. I could be wrong but YN came out with their own transmitter within 2 years of Canon's STE3 which is ½ the price. As a business you have to think about R&D and manufacturing change costs vs return on investment. I'd focus on pricing current RT products more competitively. They are going to feel it when YN comes out with the RT flash. Others like Godox are around the corner.                 

I don't believe so. People with >$2,000 cameras and $450 flashes are not as concerned about saving $100 on a trigger, and the YN-E3-RT is only $100 less than the ST-E3-RT. The YN-E3-RT's big/only selling point is the added functionality primarily for pre 2012 bodies, if the YN-600-RT is only $100 less than the 600-EX-RT then I don't see it being the run away success so many forum posters do, the Phottix Mitros+ is $399, a mere $46 less than a 600-EX-RT!

The choice of third party flash systems and functionality is a big and growing area, but like tripods, after all the headlines and excitement have died down the reliable and solid performers win through. Canon flashes will always work on Canon cameras, Yongnuo/Godox/Phottix flashes might work on Canon cameras if you have a copy of Windows 7, the latest firmware, and Yongnuo/Godox/Phottix are still supporting it, though their MkII versions might not and are unlikely to work with their MkI versions anyway. For most people in the >$2,000 cameras and $450 flash market that unknowable current and future compatibility and untested configuration reliability is worth way more than $50-100.
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digital paradise

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2014, 12:28:00 PM »
If you are right you will make a lot of people happy. Personally if I am going to go off camera flash I go big or go home :D  I have 3 600's and the STE3. Love it.

privatebydesign

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2014, 12:36:11 PM »
If you are right you will make a lot of people happy. Personally if I am going to go off camera flash I go big or go home :D  I have 3 600's and the STE3. Love it.

Exactly, that is the feeling of many people with modern cameras and $450 flashes, the third party savings are just not worth it unless you are using older cameras or need a very specific differentiating feature.
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digital paradise

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2014, 03:05:58 PM »
I guess I'm getting mixed vibes at other sites. Mostly POTN and DPreview. People don't want to pay Canon prices. There was quite a long thread at POTN when YN RT was announced. Lot people of waited for the YNE3 release. I read the AF assist is sketchy on cameras like the 5D3 and I don't miss second curtain sync. Very happy with the Canon product.           

GMCPhotographics

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2014, 03:32:16 PM »
I bought a pair of 600RT's an a trigger. They work and were worth every penny....naturally I found a great UK seller who wanted £315 for the flashes...which was about half what the RRP and every other seller was selling them for! I sold my 430 and 580, which paid for one flash. The versatility, the ease of use and the recycle time have more than paid for them selves in a professional capacity.
If you want the best, then it's worth saving for the Canon kit...everything else is 2nd rate for a reason.

unfocused

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2014, 03:43:22 PM »
While I might be interested in a lower cost strobe to supplement the 600 RT, I am certain it won't be able to use an external battery pack, which is a deal breaker for me.

The 600 RT has come down enough in price that for a savings of $100 or so, it's just not worth it. Also, I'm not interested if the menu system isn't identical (which it probably wouldn't be). I really don't want to learn yet another set of buttons.

Frankly, my biggest concern is what happens when the next generation comes out. I'm heavily invested now in the system: five 600 RTs plus the ST-R3 and not looking forward to having to start afresh again if Canon comes out with some super new technology.
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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2014, 03:43:22 PM »

ajfotofilmagem

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2014, 03:47:31 PM »
In this matter I am jealous of my friends Nikon shooters. ??? The mid-range flash SB700 can also serve as Master Wireless. It is true that flash Nikon does not use radio as Canon RT, but has variety of models to serve as Master. ::) I think the Canon 600EX RT great, but too big and heavy (and expensive). Why Canon can not offer a 430EX RT model, which also serves as Master? :-[
« Last Edit: March 14, 2014, 03:49:10 PM by ajfotofilmagem »

privatebydesign

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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2014, 04:02:20 PM »
In this matter I am jealous of my friends Nikon shooters. ??? The mid-range flash SB700 can also serve as Master Wireless. It is true that flash Nikon does not use radio as Canon RT, but has variety of models to serve as Master. ::) I think the Canon 600EX RT great, but too big and heavy (and expensive). Why Canon can not offer a 430EX RT model, which also serves as Master? :-[

Get a $150 550EX, or a $240 580EX. Plenty of cheap Canon controllers out there if you look. I used 550EX's for many years (until I got the 600's last year) and had no reliability issues with them, they are cheap, they work with every EOS ever and always will, they are controllers, they have basically the same power as the 600 they just don't zoom as far, what's to not love?
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Re: RT-enabled 430EX II replacement
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2014, 04:02:20 PM »