October 20, 2014, 04:10:53 AM

Author Topic: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????  (Read 4389 times)

jdramirez

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2014, 11:43:17 PM »
I too was looking at buying a new DSLR but not now.  I just sold a 40D and T3i in anticipation of snagging a 6D or 5DMK III.

Have you looked into Canon USA's refurbed units with 1 year factory warranty and 20% off MAP?  6Ds are available last time I checked.

Call Canon and ask about they loyalty program.  You send in an old film canon camera that you bought off craigslist for $10 (or I'll sell you one for $10), and they give you 20% off the refurb price.  Not all bodies are available... but I think the mkiii and the 6d are now... but I havne't really checked in a while because I have my body and I hopefully won't be upgrading for many years now.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L->85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm ->100L & 85L

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2014, 11:43:17 PM »

jdramirez

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2014, 11:50:08 PM »
Didn't get in the door fast enough on that great deal?  Too bad, maybe next time.  Forget to mail in your rebate?  Tough. 

They were pushing cell phones, cases, bags, frames, anything but cameras and lenses.  If they don't want to give the big retailers larger bulk discounts, then don't.  But quit playing games with the pricing to the consumer.

If you see a deal... and you don't buy... then that is kinda your fault.  I worked in a retail setting and the buyers would negotiate prices with the manufacturers for sales... and during that time frame, the cost to the retailer would be lowered (or at least that is the crap management fed us).  So if the price was $1000 last week during the July 4th sale... and it is $1500 this week without a sale... the cost went from $900 to $1300... so the absolute best the retailer could do without taking a bath is sell it for $1300...

As for Cell phones... the retailer I worked for got $200 in profit for one new line.  So if you consider that the profit margin for some items is 10%... then that means that the retailer has to sell a $2000 item to a customer to equal the profit, which is a tougher pill to swallow than paying $70 per month for 24 months... and is about $1700.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L->85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm ->100L & 85L

JonAustin

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2014, 11:55:20 PM »
It's also not just about getting the best price.  Many products available from online retailers simply aren't available in local stores.

Exactly. Which came first, the trend among brick and mortar camera stores to stock a narrower range of merchandise, or their dwindling numbers? It's probably one of those "chicken and egg" things, but the reality is that in most areas, your only resources for higher end or less mainstream gear are the online retailers.
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Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #18 on: April 18, 2014, 01:54:48 AM »
Our local dealer says his Markup for Canon runs 7%.  There may be a rebate for meeting sales targets, but a small dealer can't sell millions of dollars worth a month.
 
The salesmen are all photographers and give good advice.  I buy from them frequently, and from Adorama / B&H for something they can't easily get due to manufacturers requiring large purchases.
 
I've found that they can get cameras and lenses from Canon even when the big stores are out, so Canon does take care of small dealers.

neuroanatomist

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #19 on: April 18, 2014, 08:19:32 AM »
I think I understand why they try to enforce MAP pricing. They are trying to protect their dealer network; not necessarily the large retailers, but the smaller shops that can't compete on volume and can't stay in business on the small margins that internet dealers accept.


...MAP pricing does not affect the manufacturer's price to the retailer. When Canon or Nikon or Sony enforce MAP pricing, they aren't earning any additional profit, the higher margin goes to the retailer. They continue to sell the product to the retailer at the price they've always sold it.

I don't think Canon really cares about a 'dealer network' including smaller shops.  According to the owner of a local store (not a chain) I was talking to a bit over a year ago, in addition to Canon's MAP policy, they also cut margins (i.e., raised wholesale prices), adding back via 'discounts' for volume and for pre-payment, both of which are hard for an independent shop to meet, but benefit large online retailers.

He said that was pretty much the last straw for him. In fact, that was what brought me in. He was liquidating much of his photo gear and shutting down his print lab, leaving just the broadcast side of his business - essentially B2B with no effort on the consumer end. He said he'd still sell Canon video-oriented dSLR gear (5DIII and up, fast lenses), and he's not expecting a significant profit from those sales. 
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jdramirez

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #20 on: April 18, 2014, 09:06:22 AM »
Our local dealer says his Markup for Canon runs 7%.  There may be a rebate for meeting sales targets, but a small dealer can't sell millions of dollars worth a month.
 
The salesmen are all photographers and give good advice.  I buy from them frequently, and from Adorama / B&H for something they can't easily get due to manufacturers requiring large purchases.
 
I've found that they can get cameras and lenses from Canon even when the big stores are out, so Canon does take care of small dealers.
In my dalliance in retail, the cost was pretty close to the sale price.  If we sold a package for $1000, there was maybe 50 bucks in profit, so we would get $15 for the sale.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L->85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm ->100L & 85L

lilmsmaggie

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #21 on: April 18, 2014, 06:50:56 PM »
Hmm ... I have an ELAN 7E that I was hoping to sell alongside the 40D & T3i but that didn't happen.  Maybe I was asking too much (body w/ manual + BP-300 battery grip + 50mm 1.8 II for $230). 
I was more than willing to negotiate but the only item people were interested in was the 50mm 1.8 II.


There are only two brick & mortar camera stores in my area aside from BestBuy, and I avoid them like the plague.  Retail price + 8.5% sales tax eats a big hole in your camera budget.  When I do visit the store, very few customers are actually in the store.  Gee - I wonder why?  Weird market here in Sacramento. 

I could drive a couple hours to the SF-Bay area and MAYBE find a lower price but sales taxes there are even higher plus there's the gas, time and wear & tear on your vehicle which may not be worth the drive just to save a few bucks.

Although, I built a computer about 18 months ago.  Sourced and bought most of the parts in Santa Clara (the rest I got from Newegg).  Saved quite a bit even though I had to make that 2 hour (4 hrs. round-trip) drive to the Bay area to purchase the parts.  Got a sweet deal on a motherboard/CPU bundle.



I too was looking at buying a new DSLR but not now.  I just sold a 40D and T3i in anticipation of snagging a 6D or 5DMK III.

Have you looked into Canon USA's refurbed units with 1 year factory warranty and 20% off MAP?  6Ds are available last time I checked.

Call Canon and ask about they loyalty program.  You send in an old film canon camera that you bought off craigslist for $10 (or I'll sell you one for $10), and they give you 20% off the refurb price.  Not all bodies are available... but I think the mkiii and the 6d are now... but I havne't really checked in a while because I have my body and I hopefully won't be upgrading for many years now.
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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #21 on: April 18, 2014, 06:50:56 PM »

Chisox2335

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #22 on: April 18, 2014, 07:43:44 PM »
I too was looking at buying a new DSLR but not now.  I just sold a 40D and T3i in anticipation of snagging a 6D or 5DMK III.

Have you looked into Canon USA's refurbed units with 1 year factory warranty and 20% off MAP?  6Ds are available last time I checked.

Call Canon and ask about they loyalty program.  You send in an old film canon camera that you bought off craigslist for $10 (or I'll sell you one for $10), and they give you 20% off the refurb price.  Not all bodies are available... but I think the mkiii and the 6d are now... but I havne't really checked in a while because I have my body and I hopefully won't be upgrading for many years now.

Loyalty discount is only 10% on the 6D and 5D3. I called a couple months back. They also charge sales tax in all but 4 states I believe.

dilbert

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #23 on: April 19, 2014, 05:38:39 AM »
I too was looking at buying a new DSLR but not now.  I just sold a 40D and T3i in anticipation of snagging a 6D or 5DMK III.

Have you looked into Canon USA's refurbed units with 1 year factory warranty and 20% off MAP?  6Ds are available last time I checked.

Call Canon and ask about they loyalty program.  You send in an old film canon camera that you bought off craigslist for $10 (or I'll sell you one for $10), and they give you 20% off the refurb price.  Not all bodies are available... but I think the mkiii and the 6d are now... but I havne't really checked in a while because I have my body and I hopefully won't be upgrading for many years now.

Loyalty discount is only 10% on the 6D and 5D3. I called a couple months back. They also charge sales tax in all but 4 states I believe.

So if you're in CA, it is refurb - 10% + 8.5% (varying), meaning a whole lot of pain to effectively get the advertised price without tax. Probably easier just to buy from some online ship in NY...

Quasimodo

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #24 on: April 19, 2014, 10:21:00 AM »
I do not say that I have the answer to the original question, but as very often in this forum, the discussion tends to focus around the US. The US customers have had, and still have really cheap prices offered for Canon gear.  I just got back from NYC and bought two 600ex rt plus a st e3 at full price at B&H, and that price is two thirds of the price in Norway. Before the limit on price was put in effect, a professional nature photographer could get the 800mm for approx 3000 USD less than in Norway, which meant that you could fly over and have a weekend there, and still save money. Thus I argue that the camera stores catering to the professionals in other countries than the US had a really hard time staying in business when B&H decided to lower the prices.
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neuroanatomist

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #25 on: April 19, 2014, 11:16:20 AM »
I do not say that I have the answer to the original question, but as very often in this forum, the discussion tends to focus around the US. The US customers have had, and still have really cheap prices offered for Canon gear.  I just got back from NYC and bought two 600ex rt plus a st e3 at full price at B&H, and that price is two thirds of the price in Norway. Before the limit on price was put in effect, a professional nature photographer could get the 800mm for approx 3000 USD less than in Norway, which meant that you could fly over and have a weekend there, and still save money. Thus I argue that the camera stores catering to the professionals in other countries than the US had a really hard time staying in business when B&H decided to lower the prices.

Does Norway have import duties?  I could have driven from Boston to Toronto in a few hours, and bought a 600 II for a couple thousand less than at B&H.  But the import duties when bringing the lens back into the US would have been significant.
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Quasimodo

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #26 on: April 19, 2014, 03:23:16 PM »
I do not say that I have the answer to the original question, but as very often in this forum, the discussion tends to focus around the US. The US customers have had, and still have really cheap prices offered for Canon gear.  I just got back from NYC and bought two 600ex rt plus a st e3 at full price at B&H, and that price is two thirds of the price in Norway. Before the limit on price was put in effect, a professional nature photographer could get the 800mm for approx 3000 USD less than in Norway, which meant that you could fly over and have a weekend there, and still save money. Thus I argue that the camera stores catering to the professionals in other countries than the US had a really hard time staying in business when B&H decided to lower the prices.

Does Norway have import duties?  I could have driven from Boston to Toronto in a few hours, and bought a 600 II for a couple thousand less than at B&H.  But the import duties when bringing the lens back into the US would have been significant.

Once you pass approx 35 USD you have to pay tax. Tax is 25% , so that would still be better. I am still happy as the kit I bought costs 12.300 NOK, and I got it for approx 7.700 plus NYC taxes :)

But my first post was because I spoke to a few people working in the relatively big stores in Norway, and B&H (never seen Adorama have anything cheaper than B&H) would drive the prices down, thus running the risk of driving them out of business.
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Chisox2335

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #27 on: April 19, 2014, 11:56:03 PM »
I too was looking at buying a new DSLR but not now.  I just sold a 40D and T3i in anticipation of snagging a 6D or 5DMK III.

Have you looked into Canon USA's refurbed units with 1 year factory warranty and 20% off MAP?  6Ds are available last time I checked.

Call Canon and ask about they loyalty program.  You send in an old film canon camera that you bought off craigslist for $10 (or I'll sell you one for $10), and they give you 20% off the refurb price.  Not all bodies are available... but I think the mkiii and the 6d are now... but I havne't really checked in a while because I have my body and I hopefully won't be upgrading for many years now.

Loyalty discount is only 10% on the 6D and 5D3. I called a couple months back. They also charge sales tax in all but 4 states I believe.

So if you're in CA, it is refurb - 10% + 8.5% (varying), meaning a whole lot of pain to effectively get the advertised price without tax. Probably easier just to buy from some online ship in NY...

You misunderstood. The refurb price is 20% off of map. Then you get 10% off of the refurb price.

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #27 on: April 19, 2014, 11:56:03 PM »

dilbert

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2014, 12:18:00 AM »
I too was looking at buying a new DSLR but not now.  I just sold a 40D and T3i in anticipation of snagging a 6D or 5DMK III.

Have you looked into Canon USA's refurbed units with 1 year factory warranty and 20% off MAP?  6Ds are available last time I checked.

Call Canon and ask about they loyalty program.  You send in an old film canon camera that you bought off craigslist for $10 (or I'll sell you one for $10), and they give you 20% off the refurb price.  Not all bodies are available... but I think the mkiii and the 6d are now... but I havne't really checked in a while because I have my body and I hopefully won't be upgrading for many years now.

Loyalty discount is only 10% on the 6D and 5D3. I called a couple months back. They also charge sales tax in all but 4 states I believe.

So if you're in CA, it is refurb - 10% + 8.5% (varying), meaning a whole lot of pain to effectively get the advertised price without tax. Probably easier just to buy from some online ship in NY...

You misunderstood. The refurb price is 20% off of map. Then you get 10% off of the refurb price.

No, I didn't but you seemed to miss the point that once you take into account all of the local sales taxes, the 10% discount disappears pretty quickly to make it a questionable benefit. Do you also have to pay to ship the old camera back to Canon?

jdramirez

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2014, 07:19:57 AM »
Were they ever 20% off the refurb price?  10% is weak.  But tax does blow.  It is only 6% for me, but I think about all the other stuff I could get with that 6%...
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L->85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm ->100L & 85L

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Re: "MAP" pricing....How long will it last????
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2014, 07:19:57 AM »