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Author Topic: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300  (Read 9122 times)

Meh

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2011, 12:05:15 PM »
A $20,000 C300 with 1080p vs a $10,000 Scarlet-X with 4K resolution...did someone at Canon forget to do the math? Personally, if the C300 were more reasonably priced at 7-8 grand, then Canon would have something and I'd consider buying it. But with the Scarlet-X and its better resolution and sporting an EF mount, why would you pick the Canon. As it turns out, I will probably purchase the Scarlet-X in the future.

I suppose Canon is, whether right or wrong, claiming by virtue of their design choices and pricing that the C300's 4k sensor that uses pixel binning to produce a final 1080p image will have better image quality than competing cameras.

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2011, 12:05:15 PM »

Meh

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2011, 12:10:06 PM »
I don't know who Canon is competing with a $20K price range, the Sony F3? It certainly isn't the Scarlet-X. Why pay more for a video system that performs poorly against its cheaper rival? Only an idiot would do that.

Perhaps that's exactly the answer... that Canon sees the C300 competing against the other similarly priced cameras.  Or they believe the overall image quality, build quality, the Canon name, service, support, etc. is somehow superior to Red?  Just posing the question, I don't presume to have that answer.

daniel charms

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2011, 01:59:09 PM »
I don't know who Canon is competing with a $20K price range, the Sony F3? It certainly isn't the Scarlet-X. Why pay more for a video system that performs poorly against its cheaper rival? Only an idiot would do that.
Here's an article from Canon Digital Learning Center that, I think, gives a nice explanation of what exactly were the people at Canon smoking when they designed the C300 and who they think they're selling this thing to. What they're basically claming is that this camera performs well enough for most people potentially interested in buying one and it's way easier and faster to work with than any of the current 4K cameras. It would appear that they've done their research and discovered that there's plenty of "idiots" out there to justify the R&D costs.

HurtinMinorKey

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #18 on: November 07, 2011, 08:38:44 PM »
I don't know who Canon is competing with a $20K price range, the Sony F3? It certainly isn't the Scarlet-X. Why pay more for a video system that performs poorly against its cheaper rival? Only an idiot would do that.
Here's an article from Canon Digital Learning Center that, I think, gives a nice explanation of what exactly were the people at Canon smoking when they designed the C300 and who they think they're selling this thing to. What they're basically claming is that this camera performs well enough for most people potentially interested in buying one and it's way easier and faster to work with than any of the current 4K cameras. It would appear that they've done their research and discovered that there's plenty of "idiots" out there to justify the R&D costs.

And these people are idiots because?

Whats with the 4k obsession?   Is there anyone out there gonna even use it?   If the this camera (C300) does a better job rendering color than the Red cameras, than it might be worth it. 

Ya know, the new i-phone has a 8 mpix camera, does that make it as good as the 1D mkii?   :o
« Last Edit: November 07, 2011, 08:40:43 PM by HurtinMinorKey »

Jedifarce

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2011, 01:44:38 AM »


And these people are idiots because?

Whats with the 4k obsession?   Is there anyone out there gonna even use it?   If the this camera (C300) does a better job rendering color than the Red cameras, than it might be worth it. 

Ya know, the new i-phone has a 8 mpix camera, does that make it as good as the 1D mkii?   :o

4K is the future, even though most people won't have the computer power to really harness it yet. With that being said, I'd rather work with 4k resolution than 1080, just because the latitude it gives when you're tweaking video. It's similar to photography, raw vs jpeg. Raw will give greater dynamic range when compared to jpeg. Canon tries to make up for these weaknesses by utilizing picture styles such as Cinestyle and other flat styles, while Red records videos in raw.

The folks at Red must be laughing their asses off at the C300 announcement.

HurtinMinorKey

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #20 on: November 08, 2011, 01:36:54 PM »
People want tech that looks good right now. And there is reason to believe that the C300 looks better than the red at 1080, so it can still compete in the format that's currently most in demand.  Clearly there are problems with Red's sensor if directors need to adjust makeup and set design to account for it, and it doesn't seem to be a problem that can be fixed in post, even in RAW.

I like the Red concept. But I've been disappointed at the quality of the feature films I've seen shot on it.

Also, I think the people working at RED certainly were not laughing, and their actions support this notion. Because at the end of the day, the Red Scarlet is just a nerfed version of the old Red Epic. After all that time, that's their new technology??????  That should have taken them 2 days, not two years.

Lets face it, RED knew Canon was jumping into the game;  but Red was nowhere close to feasible new technology, so they decided to rename old technology and just throw it out there. 



 
« Last Edit: November 08, 2011, 01:40:13 PM by HurtinMinorKey »

docrender

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2011, 02:48:26 PM »
...I like the Red concept. But I've been disappointed at the quality of the feature films I've seen shot on it...

Which one is the most disappointing? :) I think RED ONE is already almost 30% of mainstream productions. EPIC will be a good successor than. 1080P useless for feature no matter what, but OK we can shoot descent video with iPhone 4s as well :))) And it is 1080P.

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2011, 02:48:26 PM »

docrender

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2011, 02:52:06 PM »
CANON completely obsolete PRO market for last 3 years. They suppose to be way farther then they are now. They do have everything to be not just the best imagine company but like way beyond that. At least they start looking again in this direction. This is great for everyone :)

HurtinMinorKey

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #23 on: November 08, 2011, 03:28:21 PM »
Which one is the most disappointing? :) I think RED ONE is already almost 30% of mainstream productions.

You think wrong then...

As I said on another thread. Compare the "Social Network"(RED) to "Fight Club"(FILM).
It's the same Director, and same DP on both. The Social Network looks like sh*t in comparison.


docrender

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2011, 04:31:09 PM »
Agreed. Social Network looks not that nice - maybe it lack of post production? Don't you think they want it to be the way it is? And it is a lots of nice looking movies on market anyway :) Shoot on RED.

Jedifarce

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #25 on: November 09, 2011, 01:25:47 PM »

You think wrong then...

As I said on another thread. Compare the "Social Network"(RED) to "Fight Club"(FILM).
It's the same Director, and same DP on both. The Social Network looks like sh*t in comparison.

That's a bit of a simplistic comparison is it not? Just looking at production costs alone, the Fight Club when adjusted for inflation in 1999 cost close to 30 million dollars more than the price tag to put out the Social Network.

HurtinMinorKey

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #26 on: November 09, 2011, 05:52:08 PM »

You think wrong then...

As I said on another thread. Compare the "Social Network"(RED) to "Fight Club"(FILM).
It's the same Director, and same DP on both. The Social Network looks like sh*t in comparison.

That's a bit of a simplistic comparison is it not? Just looking at production costs alone, the Fight Club when adjusted for inflation in 1999 cost close to 30 million dollars more than the price tag to put out the Social Network.

I don't think it is.

1. Sure, shooting on RED can save you a bunch of money(especially since Fincher likes to do 100 takes for everything), but my point was that even thought RED is 4K, the picture doesn't look so hot, especially when compared to film.  So since they haven't proved they can make 1080p look like film yet, let's not get ahead of ourselves and call anything that doesn't output in 4k "obsolete".

2. The budget disparity is exaggerated by the fact that Fight Club had Brad Pitt and Edward Norton, whereas the Social Network had Jessie Whatshisname and Mara Whatsherface.  :)

docrender

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2011, 09:45:43 PM »
Same sensor as DSLR (less pixels, actually), older GPU, no mechanical shutter, no Lens Reflex mechanism? At least suppose to be just a fraction of D1 X price, like 3-4 K$

W H Y 20K$ ????!!!! W T F???

Because it looks so sexy :)

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Re: Mobius by Vincent Laforet on the EOS C300
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2011, 09:45:43 PM »