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Author Topic: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October  (Read 71804 times)

fox40phil

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2014, 10:32:00 AM »
I say Sigmas AF in the new lenses is pretty good for the money....
If I can't trust it, it's worthless.
That was how I felt with the erratic and occasionally brilliant old model Sigma 50mm f/1.4.
My two copies got used for some personal work, endless testing but simply couldn't be trusted for client work. Therefore ultimately worthless.

I truly hope Sigma finds an AF fix for the new lenses deliverable via firmware. The optics are clearly awesome, but without dependable AF they're a commercial no-go.

-pw

I can totaly sign this!

the AF is the main thing and it need to work to 85-95% perfect...(for lens > 800€/1000$) I think..
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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2014, 10:32:00 AM »

Etienne

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #31 on: April 23, 2014, 10:35:52 AM »
Canon really does need to update the 50mm 1.4.

Depends on what you mean by update.  I wonder which will generate more revenue - the Sigma 50/1.4 A at $950, or the Canon 50/1.4 at $400?   I think it might be the latter…and the 50/1.8 at $125 will generate more revenue than both. 

I do think Canon will bring out a 50mm IS prime (f/1.8 or f/2) in the relatively near future.  It will be priced lower than Sigma's 50/1.4, and if it has the IQ of the 35/2 IS it will outsell the Sigma 50/1.4A.

I bought the Canon 35 f/2 IS over the sigma and love it. It is compact, light weight, great IQ, and hand-held video is amazingly stable, almost looks tripod mounted sometimes. Far superior to my non-stabilized 16-35 at 35mm handheld.

I've use the Canon 50 f/1.4 for video. Even with a shoulder support, it's tough to keep it steady. I'll buy the Canon 50 IS, if it's at least f/2, but I'm still hoping it will be a 50 f/1.4 IS .

sanj

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #32 on: April 23, 2014, 10:36:19 AM »
Canon really does need to update the 50mm 1.4.

Depends on what you mean by update.  I wonder which will generate more revenue - the Sigma 50/1.4 A at $950, or the Canon 50/1.4 at $400?   I think it might be the latter…and the 50/1.8 at $125 will generate more revenue than both. 

I do think Canon will bring out a 50mm IS prime (f/1.8 or f/2) in the relatively near future.  It will be priced lower than Sigma's 50/1.4, and if it has the IQ of the 35/2 IS it will outsell the Sigma 50/1.4A.

It does not bother you a bit that (according to YOU) Canon has not updated 50mm for >20 years?

kubelik

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #33 on: April 23, 2014, 10:38:00 AM »
if coma, astig, and vignetting are good I'd happily buy this over the Canon 24 L II. all of the canon offerings make a very poor showing of the corners when doing wide-field astrophotography.

mackguyver

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #34 on: April 23, 2014, 10:44:27 AM »
if coma, astig, and vignetting are good I'd happily buy this over the Canon 24 L II. all of the canon offerings make a very poor showing of the corners when doing wide-field astrophotography.
That's true, I forgot about the coma (I don't shoot the dark sky much).  The new 50 Art has pretty good coma correction, so that's an area that could be improved.
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neuroanatomist

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #35 on: April 23, 2014, 10:52:52 AM »
It does not bother you a bit that (according to YOU) Canon has not updated 50mm for >20 years?
Nope, but then 1) I have no interest in the 50/1.4 or 50/1.8 II, and 2) if I were to buy a 50mm lens it would be the 50/1.2L which was released 8 years ago, in 2006.

Having said that, the design age of the 50/1.8 II and 50/1.4 certainly don't seem to bother the buyers on Amazon.com, where the Canon 50/1.8 II is the #1 selling lens and the Canon 50/1.4 is the #3 selling lens.  You need to go to #36 on their Top 100 list to find the first Sigma lens, and the Sigma 35mm f/1.4 Art isn't on the list at all.
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Rudeofus

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2014, 11:18:52 AM »
Having said that, the design age of the 50/1.8 II and 50/1.4 certainly don't seem to bother the buyers on Amazon.com, where the Canon 50/1.8 II is the #1 selling lens and the Canon 50/1.4 is the #3 selling lens.  You need to go to #36 on their Top 100 list to find the first Sigma lens, and the Sigma 35mm f/1.4 Art isn't on the list at all.

That list contains quite a few oddities which makes me wonder how accurate it is:
  • The 24-105 L IS is listed twice, once at rank 13, then again at rank 25. Given that it comes as kit lens to many ff cameras, I wonder how many people buy it later on. In the used market it is sold at fire sale prices ...
  • Even stranger is the high volume reported for the various 18-55 F/3.5-5.6 lenses. These usually come as kit lenses for crop cameras, why would anyone buy these separately?
  • I see lots and lots of people running around with crop camera plus superzoom, yet these don't seem to show up in the higher ranks.
  • The 16-35 shows up higher in rank than the 17-40. Sounds bogus if you ask me.
  • The 70-200 F/4 showing up lower in rank compared to the 70-200 F/2.8 also strikes me as odd. All people I know with a 70-200 F/2.8 have the IS version, either Mk I or Mk II.

Obviously I don't have any insight into Amazon's sales numbers, and I don't run or work in a photo store to provide real world numbers, but I think Amazon's reported numbers raise more questions than they answer.

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2014, 11:18:52 AM »

sanj

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #37 on: April 23, 2014, 11:47:09 AM »
Having said that, the design age of the 50/1.8 II and 50/1.4 certainly don't seem to bother the buyers on Amazon.com, where the Canon 50/1.8 II is the #1 selling lens and the Canon 50/1.4 is the #3 selling lens.  You need to go to #36 on their Top 100 list to find the first Sigma lens, and the Sigma 35mm f/1.4 Art isn't on the list at all.

That list contains quite a few oddities which makes me wonder how accurate it is:
  • The 24-105 L IS is listed twice, once at rank 13, then again at rank 25. Given that it comes as kit lens to many ff cameras, I wonder how many people buy it later on. In the used market it is sold at fire sale prices ...
  • Even stranger is the high volume reported for the various 18-55 F/3.5-5.6 lenses. These usually come as kit lenses for crop cameras, why would anyone buy these separately?
  • I see lots and lots of people running around with crop camera plus superzoom, yet these don't seem to show up in the higher ranks.
  • The 16-35 shows up higher in rank than the 17-40. Sounds bogus if you ask me.
  • The 70-200 F/4 showing up lower in rank compared to the 70-200 F/2.8 also strikes me as odd. All people I know with a 70-200 F/2.8 have the IS version, either Mk I or Mk II.

Obviously I don't have any insight into Amazon's sales numbers, and I don't run or work in a photo store to provide real world numbers, but I think Amazon's reported numbers raise more questions than they answer.

I am in the minority here but these 'facts' do not impress me. What would impress me is that Canon uses its might and releases new lenses with better technology in less than 20 years. But that is MY thinking, the guys in commercials at Canon are way smarter than me.

jdramirez

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #38 on: April 23, 2014, 11:51:06 AM »
I'm very curious to see how this compares to the 24L II.  Unlike the 50L, it's a very sharp lens and won't be so easy to beat, at least in terms of sharpness.  The biggest issue with the 24L II is the vignetting so that might be where they try to outdo Canon.

Also, I really don't get the, "Why not a 85 stuff"?  They just release their latest 85mm in 2010 (to a lot of good reviews), while they don't even have a 24 f/1.4 lens.  They have a 24 f/1.8, but from the reviews, it looks to be terrible on full frame cameras.

They'll beat it in the price tag.  I'd guess another sub $1000 offering.  If matches image performance... And at that focal length where depth of field is typically less of a concern... it will be fine. 
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

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BLFPhoto

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #39 on: April 23, 2014, 12:13:44 PM »
I don't know how TDP conducted the test other than the layman's description that he posted, but I'm highly skeptical that there are serious issues with the AF.  First, we know nothing of the pre-configuration of the lens and/or camera system.  Was it properly calibrated for AFMA?  Was it calibrated and checked with the Sigma dock?  I would not draw any conclusion about any lens, OEM or otherwise, for which I didn't do some basic configuration and calibration with my equipment that it is interfacing with. 

We also know little of the lighting conditions under which the photos were taken. 

I'm not doubting a reasonable effort to see what would happen when the lens was mounted on a camera body.  He does decent work.  But these results are more anecdotal than any serious evidence of a focusing issue.  The 35 1.4 was initially reported to have issues as well.  But those simply aren't bearing out in reality.  I can report having run my own Sigma 35 1.4 as well as two from local friends through the full gamut of Reikan FoCal calibration and performance tests.  These were run on multiple bodies, both my own and others.  Focus consistency for all three of these Sigma 35 1.4 copies always measured in the 97-98% range for all bodies which had AFMA available and which was performed.  For reference, all three of the Sigmas tested more consistent than my own Canon 35mm 1.4.  Aperture sharpness curve was superior to my Canon on all three copies.  Focal point consistency was equivalent between the Sigmas and my Canon.  In short, I see no evidence of a shortfall in AF performance on the Sigma 35 1.4 compared to my Canon version based on empirical evidence on fairly well-controlled tests given the sample community I have access to test.  And my experience in shooting my Sigma 35 1.4 in the real world bears these "lab" tests out.    I have had zero focusing issues in any conditions that were notably different from anything I experience with the Canon version on a given body. 

Part of my day job is engineering developmental and operational test and evaluation design and execution.  There is far more involved in properly testing an item than most people give credit for.  I trust what Roger at LensRentals says about lenses more than most any others out there.  He has a vested, financial interest in establishing a watertight, repeatable test protocol for the thousands of lenses they own.  They have invested in the right kinds of equipment and established clearly repeatable conditions under which to evaluate lenses.  If Roger, at some point, comes out with an AF performance delta between the Sigmas and their Canon counterparts, I would be inclined to then hang my hat on that.  Certainly it will be based upon a test sample far larger than anything we, TDP, DPReview, or others might have access to. 

I am not hesitating one bit to invest in this new Sigma 50mm 1.4. 

My only concern with these new Sigmas is longevity.  Will they still maintain their performance after a decade or more of service?  My Canon 35 1.4 is far more than a decade old in my hands and has given not a single hiccup.  It has been cleaned and serviced by Canon once during that period.  Are these Sigmas constructed and capable of the same level of reliability?  I don't know.  But I'm going to invest in the opportunity to find out.  At these prices, both the 35 and 50 Sigmas together cost about the same as a new Canon 35 1.4 alone.  Seems like a reasonable risk proposition to me.  And I'm known in my day job as risk-averse!


Edit:  Oh, and when they come out with this 24 1.4...sign me up. 

And, full disclosure, I did own Sigma's newest 70-200 f/2.8 OS briefly as a replacement to my aging old Canon 80-200 f/2.8L.  I quickly rejected it after a few months specifically for sub-par focus consistency and distracting bokeh, particularly with a 1.4x teleconverter.  The Canon 70-200 f/2.8L IS II I have now is so much better as to be in a completely different league.  All of which is to say that I'm not unfamiliar with Sigma products AF issues and unfavorable performance relative to similar Canon products.  I am simply astounded on what I've found with the 35 1.4 so far.  So much so that it has right of way in my bag at the moment.

« Last Edit: April 23, 2014, 12:23:55 PM by BLFPhoto »
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9VIII

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #40 on: April 23, 2014, 12:26:29 PM »
At 200mm and beyond AF is a big deal, at 50mm it's not a big deal for me, and at 24mm it's half as important as that.

I really, really hope Sigma can produce a decent body to go along with their new lenses. Having a complete system with the Sigma name on it would put the company in an entirely new league.
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mackguyver

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #41 on: April 23, 2014, 12:37:42 PM »
dilbert, last time I checked this site is called Canonrumors, and we're all Canon users/fans here.  I think some fanboy attitude is to be expected and to put Canon and "Canon shooters" down here, of all places, seems a little ridiculous.  Why don't you head on over to Alpharumors and Nikonrumors if you want to trash Canon.  I'm sure you'd find a lot of friends there, but your statements aren't going to be too welcome here.
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westr70

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #42 on: April 23, 2014, 12:40:30 PM »
Yup. Too bad it won't auto focus good enough to hit the broad side of a galaxy ;D

Must wait for the 85...


   

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #42 on: April 23, 2014, 12:40:30 PM »

AcutancePhotography

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #43 on: April 23, 2014, 12:57:07 PM »
Why don't you head on over to Alpharumors and Nikonrumors if you want to trash Canon. 

Except that posts on Nikonrumors don't badmouth Canon anywhere near what Canonrumor posts trash anything not Canon.  I haunt both sites regularly. There is a significant difference in the attitudes of each site's members.

Hop on both sites and do a search for a third party piece of equipment  Sigma, Sony, even Pentax and read the posts.  You will see a signficiant difference in attitude.

It is one of the things I wish were better on Canonrumors.  But I still come here for the entertainment.  :)
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Random Orbits

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #44 on: April 23, 2014, 12:59:46 PM »
I don't know how TDP conducted the test other than the layman's description that he posted, but I'm highly skeptical that there are serious issues with the AF.  First, we know nothing of the pre-configuration of the lens and/or camera system.  Was it properly calibrated for AFMA?  Was it calibrated and checked with the Sigma dock?  I would not draw any conclusion about any lens, OEM or otherwise, for which I didn't do some basic configuration and calibration with my equipment that it is interfacing with. 

We also know little of the lighting conditions under which the photos were taken. 

What does AFMA have to do with it?  AFMA might improve the accuracy (zero mean the error) but it will not affect precision.  LensRentals has noted that the newest lenses and the 5D3/1DX have better accuracy/precision than other combinations.  Software is software, and Sigma's reverse engineering of the software is not good enough.  Until they do, this will always potentially be an issue.  They can probably update the software using the dock, but who knows when that will be done.

One of the reasons why I like TDP so much is his experience in using a wide array of lenses/bodies.  Using it in real world scenarios gives a better overall evaluation than shooting test charts on walls where AF is not used at all.

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Re: Sigma 24mm f/1.4 DG HSM Art Coming in October
« Reply #44 on: April 23, 2014, 12:59:46 PM »