July 31, 2014, 07:51:26 PM

Author Topic: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?  (Read 4388 times)

Lightmaster

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2014, 09:53:31 AM »
sounds like a stupid art filter.

to at least calculate good looking DOF in post you need a depth map.
and it takes some time on a average desktop pc (like a i7 2600K) to calculate the DOF from a depth map.

i have to do it every day, for videos and stills.
i render out images and a special z-buffer image for the depth information.
from that depth map (a grayscale image that show distance information in shades of grey) i can then calculate and move the focus point in PS, after effects or nuke to my liking.

even the good rosenman DOF plugin or the lenscare DOF plugin for photoshop need a lot of time/processing power and still the results are often not 100% perfect (antialiasing issues because of differences in depth map and image informations).

fast processing in camera for JPG`s .... i don´t see how a rebel camera can do it so that the quality would satisfy me.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 10:06:43 AM by Lightmaster »

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2014, 09:53:31 AM »

HurtinMinorKey

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #16 on: May 05, 2014, 10:03:24 AM »
Really Canonrumors, you've gotten so desperate that you are going to publish something that is so obviously false?

There is 0.0% light field is coming to the EOS line.  If you did any research on it[light field] whatsoever you'd know why this is the case.

Lightmaster

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #17 on: May 05, 2014, 10:12:19 AM »
Really Canonrumors, you've gotten so desperate that you are going to publish something that is so obviously false?

There is 0.0% light field is coming to the EOS line.  If you did any research on it[light field] whatsoever you'd know why this is the case.


it does not have to be lightfield technology.
the rumor is very vague.. could be about adding bokeh in post.

it could be possible that the dual pixel AF can deliver enough depth information to create a depth map. when i first read about dual pixel technology i instantly thought about this.

normaly the depth maps i create have a distance information for every image pixel.
the more roughly the image is approximated in the depth map image the more fake looks the post production DOF.

and maybe it´s possible to readout the relative distance informations for every pixel on (future) dual pixel sensors.

you could then use this information to do a fake bokeh in post.
but as i said such calculations are normaly slow (or they are fast but look bad).

but done right you can´t (99% of the people anyway) say for sure if it´s postproduction or real.
it all depends on how correct your depth map is and how good the algorithm to calulate the DOF.


EDIT:

of course this will not help to get out of focus parts into focus after the image was taken.

it only would help to simulate a f1.2 lens when you only have a f5.6 lens. :)
more like alienskin bokeh on steroids.


« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 10:26:05 AM by Lightmaster »

Woody

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2014, 10:39:21 AM »
Sounds like something ALL the manufacturers (Nikon, Sony, Pentax, Olympus, Panasonic) will offer sooner or later

mroffbeat

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #19 on: May 05, 2014, 10:55:10 AM »
i actually care about new camera's coming out. I am about to buy a 5D M3 and wish the price would drop more :)

Sabaki

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #20 on: May 05, 2014, 11:01:07 AM »
If it's as "epic" (read as highly sarcastic) as the Smart Sharpen function in Photoshop CC, I hope it doesn't make its way to the DSLR bodies.
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Albi86

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #21 on: May 05, 2014, 11:03:31 AM »

the rumor is very vague..

+1

A lot of heat for something that we don't even have a clue of what it is.

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #21 on: May 05, 2014, 11:03:31 AM »

jdramirez

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #22 on: May 05, 2014, 11:42:25 AM »

the rumor is very vague..

+1

A lot of heat for something that we don't even have a clue of what it is.

There was a guy advertising for photography services a few years back on Craig's list.  His sample images looked like a mobile phone with some really bad bokeh filters applied.

I'm not saying everyone needs full frame and an f1.2 prime, but the assertion that comparable professional results can come from such techniques are so asinine.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

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sanj

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #23 on: May 05, 2014, 11:50:02 AM »

the rumor is very vague..

+1

A lot of heat for something that we don't even have a clue of what it is.

Absolutely. Canon people may be slow but they are not idiots. If they bringing something on, they must have reasons.

jdramirez

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #24 on: May 05, 2014, 11:59:57 AM »

Absolutely. Canon people may be slow but they are not idiots. If they bringing something on, they must have reasons.

I feel that Canon has enough misses to make a credible challenge to your idiot claim.  :p
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

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East Wind Photography

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #25 on: May 05, 2014, 12:30:21 PM »
Sounds to me like a mode in which the camera determines the subject near and far distance and sets aperture to ensure all subjects are in focus.

take for example a shot of a group of people.  face detection could be used to determine the distance to the subject closest to the camera and the suject farthest from the camera, then select the aperture that mathmatically satisfies the DOF with that lens.

Sounds like a cool feature for consumer level cameras or even for shooting video if it was dynamic enough to adapt to the changing environment in real time.

mrsfotografie

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #26 on: May 05, 2014, 12:51:45 PM »
Many of Canon EOS film bodies had a "Depth" mode, so this is kind of a "Back to the Future" event!


Yes, my 50e (ElanIIe) had this already (camera Date introduced = September 1995):

Quote
DEP is for depth of field auto exposure mode. It allows the camera to decide the
appropriate aperture and focus position to provide enough depth of field to keep two
selected distances sharply in focus. The easiest way to use it is to turn the Command
Dial to DEP, and use the center auto focus sensor, point the camera at the first subject
and press the shutter button half way to autofocus. Let the button up and then point the
same AF sensor on the top of the second subject and press the shutter half way again
to allow the lens to autofocus on the second subject. Then reframe your camera and
take the picture. The camera will select a focus distance between the subject distances,
then select an aperture small enough to keep both subjects in focus and then select a
shutter speed that will provide proper exposure. If you select the same subject distance
twice, the camera will select the widest aperture available to keep depth of field very
shallow. The lens must be set to AF for DEP mode to work and if you are using a zoom
lens, you must not change its zoom setting during the entire procedure. You can also
manually or eye control select the side AF sensors, but I think it just adds confusion.
A blinking aperture indicated that sufficient depth of field (DOF) can not be achieved.
You must focus on subjects that are closer to the same distance apart or use a wider angle
lens.
(ref: http://www.google.nl/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCkQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fgraphics.stanford.edu%2F~niloy%2FmiscDocs%2FelanIIe.pdf&ei=2sBnU7iiDcn-PPi8gOAL&usg=AFQjCNFcpLQfmpOPCiZ99ceN_esrVc9bDw)

Maybe Canon will now also bring back the eye controlled autofocus feature!!!  8)
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Don Haines

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #27 on: May 05, 2014, 12:56:21 PM »

Absolutely. Canon people may be slow but they are not idiots. If they bringing something on, they must have reasons.

I feel that Canon has enough misses to make a credible challenge to your idiot claim.  :p

Of course they have reasons.... why else would they do it.

As to if the reasons pass the test of time or if those reasons are accepted by the marketplace, that is a completely different problem.....
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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #27 on: May 05, 2014, 12:56:21 PM »

AvTvM

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #28 on: May 05, 2014, 12:59:02 PM »
could be anything ... from a really lousy "art filter" to add artificial blur ... to "A-DEP revisited" ... all the way to what Lighmaster wrote (depth map based on dual-pixel info from sensor) ... 

It definitely will NOT be true peloptic/lightfield imaging (along the lines of Lytro) sice that would represent "change and innovation" in the magnitude of a million times Canon's boldest possible imagination. :-)

Whatever it may be ... I just hope the disease will be tightly confined to Powershots and Rebels. :-)

jdramirez

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #29 on: May 05, 2014, 01:03:21 PM »
Sounds to me like a mode in which the camera determines the subject near and far distance and sets aperture to ensure all subjects are in focus.

take for example a shot of a group of people.  face detection could be used to determine the distance to the subject closest to the camera and the suject farthest from the camera, then select the aperture that mathmatically satisfies the DOF with that lens.

Sounds like a cool feature for consumer level cameras or even for shooting video if it was dynamic enough to adapt to the changing environment in real time.

That's a cool feature and I think it would be perfect for a consumer level camera. 
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100 f/2.8L->85mm f/1.8 USM->135L -> 8mm ->100L

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Re: New PowerShot & EOS Cameras to Offer DOF Control?
« Reply #29 on: May 05, 2014, 01:03:21 PM »