July 30, 2014, 08:14:32 PM

Author Topic: 430 RT  (Read 1311 times)

Sabaki

  • Rebel T5i
  • ****
  • Posts: 137
    • View Profile
430 RT
« on: May 15, 2014, 08:06:00 PM »
Has anybody heard or seen anything regarding a series 400 RT flash?

I'm kind of amazed that Canon haven't released one yet and I'm sure there's many out there who would appreciate a cheaper alternative to the fantastic yet expensive 600RT-EX.

Canon 500D | 100mmL f/2.8 IS Macro | 24-70mmL f/2.8 mk II | 70-200mmL f/4.0 | 400mmL f/5.6 | 50mm f/1.8 | EF-S 10-22mm | Canon 600 RT |

canon rumors FORUM

430 RT
« on: May 15, 2014, 08:06:00 PM »

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ********
  • Posts: 13616
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #1 on: May 15, 2014, 08:14:09 PM »
One will likely be along eventually.  I'm sure it'll be slave-only. 
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

BL

  • 7D
  • *****
  • Posts: 380
  • Great gear is good. Good technique is better.
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2014, 08:42:19 PM »
with bundled deals for 2x 600EXs and the ST-E3 for $1019, I've completely dropped the idea of using any RT version of the 430EX.  Even if all you wanted was the transmitter, you can sell off what you don't need and get any single component for very little.

http://www.adorama.com/CA600EXUWK.html
M, 5Dc, 1Dx, some lenses, a few lights

Mt Spokane Photography

  • Canon EF 600mm f/4L IS II
  • ********
  • Posts: 8277
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2014, 01:20:02 AM »
I just ordered one of the $61  90 EX flashes to use as a controller on the G1 X my wife uses.  It will control multiple canon flashes by optical signaling.  A expensive RT for a camera that cost me just over $100 new seems unbalanced.  Yes, that's right, a G1 X for just over $100.  I bought it from Adorama 1-1/2 years ago on one of their one day specials when they were cleaning out inventory.  I'm thinking its time to sell it and upgrade to the MK II, which has some features I'd use a lot.  I'm still looking for a deal on it.  When I find one, I'll jump on it, in the meantime, I have too many cameras and am actively selling my DSLR's that get little use.  (My 5D MK III gets almost all the use).

Marsu42

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 4357
  • ML-66d / 100L / 70-300L / 17-40L / 600rts
    • View Profile
    • 6D positive spec list
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2014, 06:05:51 AM »
One will likely be along eventually.

Did Canon indicate anything like this? At this point in time, I'm really starting to wonder if there are (also) technical aspects for the delay, maybe they have problems cramming in rt+ir connectivity in a smaller flash? As for "slave only", I guess this is simply a software crippling and if the flash can receive it could also send the commands.

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ********
  • Posts: 13616
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2014, 06:25:19 AM »
One will likely be along eventually.

Did Canon indicate anything like this? At this point in time, I'm really starting to wonder if there are (also) technical aspects for the delay, maybe they have problems cramming in rt+ir connectivity in a smaller flash? As for "slave only", I guess this is simply a software crippling and if the flash can receive it could also send the commands.

Nothing from Canon, that's the norm until an announcement (kinda the point of a rumor site!).  I donut technical issues - a radio transceiver is small.  Yes, it'll be a firmware cripple, same as the current optical version (the optical control signals are sent by the main flash tube).
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

Marsu42

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 4357
  • ML-66d / 100L / 70-300L / 17-40L / 600rts
    • View Profile
    • 6D positive spec list
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2014, 05:13:20 PM »
Yes, it'll be a firmware cripple, same as the current optical version (the optical control signals are sent by the main flash tube).

On the other hand, maybe producing a transmitter that is able to communicate with 5 flash groups in parallel is more expensive or needs more calibration than a slave radio unit that just sits there and talks to one single master.

As for the technical aspects: No doubt you can cram in a rt slave in a 430ex body, but the question is if the performance/distance is the same as with a large 600rt unit. Seeing Yongnuo struggle with their rt clones, there might be more difficulties there than we know, esp. if you try to combine it with an optical fallback (as Canon also didn't do on their st-e3).

canon rumors FORUM

Re: 430 RT
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2014, 05:13:20 PM »

Chuck Alaimo

  • 1D Mark IV
  • ******
  • Posts: 908
    • View Profile
    • Chuck Alaimo Photography
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2014, 06:02:29 PM »
I'd welcome a 430 RT with open arms!  I am in a pickle right now with off cam lighting - currently i have 1 600 Rt and a pair of 430's (and cheap cactus triggers).  I'd love to add 1-2 flashes and am in the deciding stage as to how to proceed.   Spend a whole crap ton of $$$ on going all RT, or, spend a whole lot less and go with cheaper flashes and cheaper triggers..

Pros to going all 600 -

one system that is good
ability to control the power of all flashes from the camera

cons -

expensive
worth repeating, expensive!!!
And again - expensive - I am not just thinking initial cost - as these would be mostly used off camera, on lightstands, in location environs (what happens when you have a stand in the water, set low, tide is coming in as your shooting and the flash gets dunked ---flash on stand but it's windy...TIMBER!!!!!!)  I have watched my lightstands fall on enough locations that the idea of $600 flashes scares me.

With all that said, the 430 option would still be close to $400....uggg...thinking cheaper manual flashes will be my future for a while...but the 600 system is really tempting 
Owns 5Dmkiii, 6D, 16-35mm, 24mm 1.4, 70-200mm 2.8, 50mm 1.4, 85 mm 1.8, 100mm 2.8 macro, 1-600RT, 2 430 EX's, 1 video light

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ********
  • Posts: 13616
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2014, 06:18:50 PM »
Yes, it'll be a firmware cripple, same as the current optical version (the optical control signals are sent by the main flash tube).

On the other hand, maybe producing a transmitter that is able to communicate with 5 flash groups in parallel is more expensive or needs more calibration than a slave radio unit that just sits there and talks to one single master.

As I pointed out, there's no technical reason the 430EX II can't be a master, heck onboard flashes and the 90EX are optical masters.  But it wasn't given that capability, to upsell buyers to the 580.  The same reasoning applies to an RT version.

As for the technical aspects: No doubt you can cram in a rt slave in a 430ex body, but the question is if the performance/distance is the same as with a large 600rt unit. Seeing Yongnuo struggle with their rt clones, there might be more difficulties there than we know, esp. if you try to combine it with an optical fallback (as Canon also didn't do on their st-e3).

The iPhone that I am posting from can transmit and receive live video, and it's interior volume is far smaller than that of a 400-series flash.  I don't think the complexity of the signal is an issue. 

As for Yongnuo, their issues almost certainly result from their attempt to reverse-engineer Canon's RF protocols.
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

FunPhotons

  • 7D
  • *****
  • Posts: 405
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2014, 09:49:01 AM »
The iPhone that I am posting from can transmit and receive live video, and it's interior volume is far smaller than that of a 400-series flash.  I don't think the complexity of the signal is an issue. 

The two problems with an RF flash is signal reliability and latency. It's actually easier on the smart phone because there you can have huge amounts of slop, all that matters is bandwidth which is physics limited. Getting tight synchronization over RF is tricky because of all the components and the necessary driver stack, and of course you have to deal with a messy analog flashbulb, capacitor and batteries. Notice that trigger lines are simple TTL lines for this reason; anything more complicated gets hard (but still doable).

Anyhow the only possible physical issue with the 400 would be antenna I expect, they can certainly have a FPGA even with room for a SMA to the antenna. Certainly they won't make it a master from a product line standpoing.

AvTvM

  • 1D Mark IV
  • ******
  • Posts: 891
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #10 on: May 22, 2014, 10:02:29 AM »
there are no technical issues involved whatsoever for Canon to make a 430EX-RT.

They just hope, everyone will eventually loose patience and buy a 600EX-RT. As I did last week. 3x 600EX-RT plus ST-E3 ... at a total cost of Euro 1487,- [=USD 2,100] AFTER Canon Cashback [€ 70 per 600EX-RT].

I therefore expect the 430EX-RT to be announced next week at the latest.  :P 

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ********
  • Posts: 13616
    • View Profile
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2014, 10:28:29 AM »
Certainly they won't make it a master from a product line standpoing.

That's my point.  They could easily do so from a technical standpoint, as they could have with the 430EX II, but they didn't and they won't.
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

Marsu42

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 4357
  • ML-66d / 100L / 70-300L / 17-40L / 600rts
    • View Profile
    • 6D positive spec list
Re: 430 RT
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2014, 11:58:55 AM »
That's my point.  They could easily do so from a technical standpoint, as they could have with the 430EX II, but they didn't and they won't

Let's hope someone codes an inofficial fw update for the 440rt flashes :-) ... some people at least managed to add an external power connector to the 430ex, also seems to be no real problem.

canon rumors FORUM

Re: 430 RT
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2014, 11:58:55 AM »