December 21, 2014, 07:01:51 PM

Author Topic: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?  (Read 3119 times)

9VIII

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2014, 04:44:39 PM »
Nikon already has a patent on matching lenses to bodies, hopefully that wouldn't stop Canon from implementing something similar.

If you (digitally) lock lenses to bodies and have to input a code every time you turn the camera on (and then leave it on for the rest of the afternoon) that would be pretty secure.
Just require the code again before you flash it. If all goes wrong send it to Canon with a proof of purchase.

Initially it wouldn't be a deterrent, but after a few years people would catch on. It wouldn't make fencing stuff impossible, but with all the extra effort involved it would be far less appealing (going from a one man operation with no skill required to two or more with special equipment).
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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2014, 04:44:39 PM »

jdramirez

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2014, 04:53:09 PM »
they could even rebrand l lenses as well as ls lenses.. the L would still stand for luxury and the s would stand for security
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L-> 85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm -> 85mm f/1.2L mkii

Jim Saunders

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2014, 09:38:52 PM »
Having a PIN to enable each lens to a given body strikes me as feasible - no aperture/AF/IS without it.  The disable-after-24 hour thing is interesting also.

Jim

I was thinking that too but what about those of use that have multiple bodies that use the lenses interchangeably on the shoot - You'd have to be able to pair a lens to X bodies and then "lock" it from being paired to any other camera.  Then, of course, there'd have to be someway to reset that when customers forget their PIN so I think that would all be pretty easily bypassable.


It could be as simple as "enter PIN to enter pairing menu".  Employing that option would make keeping receipts even more important so you could prove ownership if you had to get that PIN reset, but if it saves me on insurance then so much the better.

Jim
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jdramirez

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2014, 09:50:15 PM »
I'm a big believer in the secondary market... so that's my concern.  If I buy a lens that is paired and coded with a pin, the first time I want to do is pop it on my body and test it out.  If the buyer doesn't know to release the lens or they lose the CD... then that could pose a problem. 

Maybe a USB key that you can input software... and then a Sigma style dock... or via usb through the body to unlock. 

I think a USB key that you keep @ home in a lock box would be the figurative and literal key to this plan being feasible. 
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L-> 85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm -> 85mm f/1.2L mkii

Jim Saunders

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2014, 09:57:05 PM »
I'm a big believer in the secondary market... so that's my concern.  If I buy a lens that is paired and coded with a pin, the first time I want to do is pop it on my body and test it out.  If the buyer doesn't know to release the lens or they lose the CD... then that could pose a problem. 

Maybe a USB key that you can input software... and then a Sigma style dock... or via usb through the body to unlock. 

I think a USB key that you keep @ home in a lock box would be the figurative and literal key to this plan being feasible.

What about a microSD card in a little compartment, install it to leave the lens entirely unlocked (so you could sell it), remove it to enable the locking functionality?  Something like that.

Jim
See what I see: 6500K, 160 cd/m^2, ICC 2, gamma 2.2.

candyman

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #20 on: July 18, 2014, 04:08:04 AM »
I try to understand this subject.
It makes sense to lock your mobile since it contains a lot of private information - like contacts (some people store a lot of add. info with those contacts), social media, photos, email etc

Your camera.....it has a memory card with photos only. Let's say the camera get stolen. The thief will open the memory card slot and has access to the photos. A pincode does not prevent it.
A pincode that prevent the use of the camera? You think that the thief will bring it back? He may throw the camera or try to sell it for parts. But you will not get it back.
A thief knowing that stealing this kind of camera doesn't make sense because it has a pincode? Most will not know that and try to steal it anyway.

Even if you have a pincode (or fingerprint scan) it doesn't bring back camera or photos. Yes, photos...it would make sense to encrypt the storaged photos so a stranger would have difficulty to access them. But encrypt photos while they get stored on the memory card will slow down the burst speed - not something we want.

A good insurrance will help...(not bringing back your photos though)

Hillsilly

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #21 on: July 18, 2014, 04:57:31 AM »
I'd find it a little annoying, but if it was an optional feature, then great.

A "find my phone" via GPS/Wi-Fi feature that can be remotely triggered even with the camera turned off would also be pretty cool.  You could go and bust some bad girls.
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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #21 on: July 18, 2014, 04:57:31 AM »

jdramirez

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #22 on: July 18, 2014, 08:30:33 AM »
I'm not concerned about the photos.... but reducing the functionality of the camera/lens to reduce its resale value if stolen.

If Canon incorporates this locking functionality across the board, thieves would have a fiduciary causation to avoid Canon gear. 

If you are going to risk your freedom... you want to get the most return on your risk...

I think a stolen car has more value for the parts alone... I'm not sure you can say that about a camera body.

I try to understand this subject.
It makes sense to lock your mobile since it contains a lot of private information - like contacts (some people store a lot of add. info with those contacts), social media, photos, email etc

Your camera.....it has a memory card with photos only. Let's say the camera get stolen. The thief will open the memory card slot and has access to the photos. A pincode does not prevent it.
A pincode that prevent the use of the camera? You think that the thief will bring it back? He may throw the camera or try to sell it for parts. But you will not get it back.
A thief knowing that stealing this kind of camera doesn't make sense because it has a pincode? Most will not know that and try to steal it anyway.

Even if you have a pincode (or fingerprint scan) it doesn't bring back camera or photos. Yes, photos...it would make sense to encrypt the storaged photos so a stranger would have difficulty to access them. But encrypt photos while they get stored on the memory card will slow down the burst speed - not something we want.

A good insurrance will help...(not bringing back your photos though)
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L-> 85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm -> 85mm f/1.2L mkii

crashpc

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #23 on: July 18, 2014, 12:21:15 PM »
Didn´t read whole thread, but it would be nice to have the option - you look into viewfinder, it scans your eye, and lets you store data on memory card (for next time chosen)..

jdramirez

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #24 on: July 18, 2014, 12:29:07 PM »
Didn´t read whole thread, but it would be nice to have the option - you look into viewfinder, it scans your eye, and lets you store data on memory card (for next time chosen)..

I like the idea, but I think that would drive up cost.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L-> 85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm -> 85mm f/1.2L mkii

candyman

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #25 on: July 18, 2014, 12:33:43 PM »
Didn´t read whole thread, but it would be nice to have the option - you look into viewfinder, it scans your eye, and lets you store data on memory card (for next time chosen)..
Why a camera and viewfinder.....
You look with your eye...and it store a still or a video instantly in the cloud. With an eye-lens you can zoom-in and zoom-out....now THAT would be something.... ;)

9VIII

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #26 on: July 18, 2014, 02:23:29 PM »
I'm not concerned about the photos.... but reducing the functionality of the camera/lens to reduce its resale value if stolen.

If Canon incorporates this locking functionality across the board, thieves would have a fiduciary causation to avoid Canon gear. 

If you are going to risk your freedom... you want to get the most return on your risk...

I think a stolen car has more value for the parts alone... I'm not sure you can say that about a camera body.

I try to understand this subject.
It makes sense to lock your mobile since it contains a lot of private information - like contacts (some people store a lot of add. info with those contacts), social media, photos, email etc

Your camera.....it has a memory card with photos only. Let's say the camera get stolen. The thief will open the memory card slot and has access to the photos. A pincode does not prevent it.
A pincode that prevent the use of the camera? You think that the thief will bring it back? He may throw the camera or try to sell it for parts. But you will not get it back.
A thief knowing that stealing this kind of camera doesn't make sense because it has a pincode? Most will not know that and try to steal it anyway.

Even if you have a pincode (or fingerprint scan) it doesn't bring back camera or photos. Yes, photos...it would make sense to encrypt the storaged photos so a stranger would have difficulty to access them. But encrypt photos while they get stored on the memory card will slow down the burst speed - not something we want.

A good insurrance will help...(not bringing back your photos though)

I really doubt there's much of a black market for camera parts. That requires a population of people willing to build or repair cameras on their own, which as far as I know is pretty much limited to LensRentals.com.
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dgatwood

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #27 on: July 19, 2014, 12:07:13 PM »
I'm not concerned about the photos.... but reducing the functionality of the camera/lens to reduce its resale value if stolen.

If Canon incorporates this locking functionality across the board, thieves would have a fiduciary causation to avoid Canon gear. 

It's a good start, but a better solution would increase your chances of getting caught.  Put a cellular chip in the thing, but leave it powered down.  If someone fails to unlock the camera with a fingerprint or PIN, the cellular chip immediately goes live, and every thirty seconds, sends GPS coordinates back to Canon servers until the user unlocks it correctly.  To make it infeasible for criminals to disable this feature, use a self-contained microcontroller instead of the main CPU, powered by a supercapacitor deep inside the unit.

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #27 on: July 19, 2014, 12:07:13 PM »

jdramirez

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #28 on: July 19, 2014, 01:38:47 PM »
I love the idea... but I don't want to pay twice as much for a lens because of the infrastructure and added tech.  That's why I lean towards a software issue.

I'm not concerned about the photos.... but reducing the functionality of the camera/lens to reduce its resale value if stolen.

If Canon incorporates this locking functionality across the board, thieves would have a fiduciary causation to avoid Canon gear. 

It's a good start, but a better solution would increase your chances of getting caught.  Put a cellular chip in the thing, but leave it powered down.  If someone fails to unlock the camera with a fingerprint or PIN, the cellular chip immediately goes live, and every thirty seconds, sends GPS coordinates back to Canon servers until the user unlocks it correctly.  To make it infeasible for criminals to disable this feature, use a self-contained microcontroller instead of the main CPU, powered by a supercapacitor deep inside the unit.
Upgrade  path.->means the former was sold for the latter.

XS->60D->5d Mkiii:18-55->24-105L:75-300->55-250->70-300->70-200 f4L USM->70-200 f/2.8L USM->70-200 f/2.8L IS Mkii:50 f/1.8->50 f/1.4->100L-> 85mm f/1.8 USM-> 8mm -> 85mm f/1.2L mkii

Skulker

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #29 on: July 19, 2014, 01:45:37 PM »
How much of a problem is it?

How many cameras and lenses get stolen?

Has anyone got any data?
If you debate with a fool onlookers can find it VERY difficult to tell the difference.

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Re: Locking our bodies with a code like we do our phone... ramifications?
« Reply #29 on: July 19, 2014, 01:45:37 PM »