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Author Topic: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?  (Read 15301 times)

briansquibb

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2011, 05:57:51 PM »

But i dearly want one for when i do sports/ wildlife/ action shoots because the AF is soo much better than the 5D2.


Are you basing that on reviews or experience?

Trust me the 7D AF is not THAT good. You have to try a 1D4 to find out what good AF and metering is about.

I was expecting a lot when I bought a 7D to go with my 5DII and I was rather underwhelmed.

I then bought the 1D4 and was blown away. Am seriously thinking of selling the 5DII and the 7D and just making do with two 1D4s

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2011, 05:57:51 PM »

Meh

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2011, 06:23:11 PM »

But i dearly want one for when i do sports/ wildlife/ action shoots because the AF is soo much better than the 5D2.


Are you basing that on reviews or experience?

Trust me the 7D AF is not THAT good.

Isn't a review someone's experience?  No more or less valid than your experience that you ask to be trusted.  No offense, just injecting some perspective. 

briansquibb

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2011, 06:28:37 PM »

But i dearly want one for when i do sports/ wildlife/ action shoots because the AF is soo much better than the 5D2.


Are you basing that on reviews or experience?

Trust me the 7D AF is not THAT good.

Isn't a review someone's experience?  No more or less valid than your experience that you ask to be trusted.  No offense, just injecting some perspective.

A review is of a single camera - we are looking for a comparison which a review wont give you. The experience has to have the same baseline, the shooter, in order to compare.


Meh

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2011, 06:45:33 PM »

Isn't a review someone's experience?  No more or less valid than your experience that you ask to be trusted.  No offense, just injecting some perspective.

A review is of a single camera - we are looking for a comparison which a review wont give you. The experience has to have the same baseline, the shooter, in order to compare.


Not necessarily, the credible reviewers have usually used/tested/reviewed many if not most cameras and lenses and will make comparisons to other bodies in the same class.   And reviews and lab tests have the advantage of being more controlled and less biased towards a brand or a body the reviewer has a preference for.  I'm not trying to devalue your personal experience as I'm sure it's extensive but you do seem to have a strong preference for your personal, anecdotal experience over reviews/tests.  For me, I like to consider multiple sources and types of information.  The reviews and lab tests are very informative.  Personal experience, such as yours, is also valuable which is why I like this forum.   Again, no offence intended.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 06:47:41 PM by Meh »

neuroanatomist

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2011, 06:56:38 PM »
In my experience, the 7D is a big step up from the 5DII for AF, and a modest step up for metering. Although I've never used a 1-series, I know it will be substantially better at both, which is why my next body will be a 1D X. 

Frankly, my fear is that the 1D X AF will spoil the 7D for me...
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TexPhoto

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2011, 07:10:01 PM »
I own both a 7D and a 5DII.  When I shoot sports, the 7D is my primary camera. 

My 5DII is an awesome camera, but it does feel like Canon went out of it's way to limit in a few areas to keep it from cutting 1D/1Ds sales.  Now I sell stock, and the 5DII is my primary for almost everything I shoot besides sports.  I have never been unhappy with it's AF system, I just don't expect it to be a 7D.

In any case if sports was my primary focus, I'd buy the 7D way before a 5DII.  Strap the best 70-200 you can afford on it and you have a sports machine gun rivaled only by 5000+ camera, and then by only a small margin.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 08:30:06 PM by TexPhoto »

Meh

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2011, 07:19:06 PM »
In my experience, the 7D is a big step up from the 5DII for AF, and a modest step up for metering. Although I've never used a 1-series, I know it will be substantially better at both, which is why my next body will be a 1D X. 

Frankly, my fear is that the 1D X AF will spoil the 7D for me...

Agreed.  I've only had my 5D2  a few weeks (although I've used one on occasion in the past) but it's AF simply isn't as good as the 7D.   My bias though (and possibly yours since I think you also had the 7D first) is that once used to the 7D the 5D2 may appear much worse that it really is.  And briansquibb (sorry to pick on you Brian) might have a similar bias after using a 1D4 in that the 7D AF, based on the comparison to 1D4, gets an artificial downgrade and "appears" to be not much better than the 5D2.  There's a name for that in psychology (can't think of it right now) where human perception tends to bunch things together and minimize differences in the context of something much bigger/better.

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2011, 07:19:06 PM »

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2011, 07:57:00 PM »
My 5D MK II has slower but more accurate af, particularly in low light, easily beating my 1D MK III and 7D.  My 7D has faster AF which will track fast moving objects, which is what you want for sports.  I've never actually used my 1D MK III to track rapidly moving objects, but it is better than the 7D all around, and only loses out to the 5D MK II in high ISO sensitivity and fast autofocus.

I'm considering picking up a used 1D MK IV, but am waiting on the 1D x to get some reviews from trusted sources.  There are lots of camera reviews that may be less than accurate or objective, we all have our bias, so I usually look at reviews from sources I trust who have a track record of accurate reporting.  This means that I do not take a review posted by a new camera owner with a unknown amount of experience as a trusted source.

wickidwombat

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2011, 08:00:22 PM »
My 5D MK II has slower but more accurate af, particularly in low light, easily beating my 1D MK III and 7D.  My

Is this the center point only? can you get any of the other points to achieve focus lock in low light?
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briansquibb

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2011, 08:18:34 PM »
And briansquibb (sorry to pick on you Brian) might have a similar bias after using a 1D4 in that the 7D AF, based on the comparison to 1D4, gets an artificial downgrade and "appears" to be not much better than the 5D2.  There's a name for that in psychology (can't think of it right now) where human perception tends to bunch things together and minimize differences in the context of something much bigger/better.

I bought the 7D and then because it didn't meet my expectations I bought the 1D4. I am still using the 7D and the 5DII as well as the 1D4 - last Saturday I was using all 3 on my shoot - so it was real back to back comparison.

I have always said that the AF of the 7D is better than that of the 5DII. However (possibly because I only use the centre focus point and have had a long line of 9 pointers) I automatically work round the AF and dont hit the problems that others seem to hit - for example that little delay for the AF to lock. Where the 7D works for me is the use of the expansion point for tracking - it is quicker to lock, but there is still a delay. What may not be a problem for me may of course be a dealbreaker for someone else.

However as a package there are several downsides to the 7D which take the edge off the  better AF. The first of which is the picture IQ, particularly when cropping ( that applies to all crop cameras) that the bokeh inevitably looks worse.

I can also see the difference in the picture quality too. Put two sharp A3 prints on the table and I can tell which came from the 5DII and which came from the 7D, particularly when low light is involved. This is my perception that the 5DII gives a smoother image, whereas the 7D seems more raw.

I find that people, who have never used the 5DII, are trashing the 5DII AF based on the street reputation alone as are the press.  I believe you can only objectively comment on this after some experience of the camera.

The title of this thread is 'How bad if the AF on the 5DmkII really'. From where I stand the AF is not bad at all if you are using the centre focus point, however you will find that the tracking AF on the 7D does a better job for you and definitely the 1D4 is significantly better.

If the question was 'Is the 7D better than the 5DII' I would be much more hesitant. If the 7D was better than the 5DII why does the 5DII sell in such huge numbers? - there aren't that number of dedicated studio people around.

Here is a good example of what the 5DII can do - the A3 version of this is stunning IQ and the colours are sumptuous.

5DII, 24-105@92, iso50, f13, 1/15,



« Last Edit: November 23, 2011, 08:29:42 PM by briansquibb »

neuroanatomist

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2011, 08:20:06 PM »
My 5D MK II has slower but more accurate af, particularly in low light, easily beating my 1D MK III and 7D.  My

Is this the center point only? can you get any of the other points to achieve focus lock in low light?

The 5DII's off-center points achieve a lock in low light with the effectiveness of...well, I can think of a sufficiently ineffective example, but the bottom line is that while the 5DII's center AF point is quite good, the rest of them pretty much suck.
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neuroanatomist

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2011, 08:22:23 PM »
I find that people, who have never used the 5DII, are trashing the 5DII AF based on the street reputation alone as are the press.

FWIW, I have one, and I 'trash' it to some extent. 

Here is a good example of what the 5DII can do - the A3 version of this is stunning IQ and the colours are sumptuous.

The OP was questioning it's capability for shooting sports...a lighthouse at f/13 might not be the most relevant example.
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wickidwombat

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2011, 08:26:47 PM »
My 5D MK II has slower but more accurate af, particularly in low light, easily beating my 1D MK III and 7D.  My

Is this the center point only? can you get any of the other points to achieve focus lock in low light?

The 5DII's off-center points achieve a lock in low light with the effectiveness of...well, I can think of a sufficiently ineffective example, but the bottom line is that while the 5DII's center AF point is quite good, the rest of them pretty much suck.
yeah thats pretty much what I find, Have you used AI servo much with the 5D2? How does it go tracking after achieving lock with the center point?
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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2011, 08:26:47 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2011, 08:34:49 PM »
yeah thats pretty much what I find, Have you used AI servo much with the 5D2? How does it go tracking after achieving lock with the center point?

Ok - but not great - for subjects moving across the frame. Pretty poorly for subjects moving toward or away from the camera.
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briansquibb

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2011, 08:39:56 PM »

The OP was questioning it's capability for shooting sports...a lighthouse at f/13 might not be the most relevant example.

I have already posted the Kart going 40+ - I think that answers that question

The lighthouse is just an example of a 5DII photo.

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Re: How bad is the AF on 5DmkII really?
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2011, 08:39:56 PM »