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Author Topic: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights  (Read 31928 times)

jweu

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #45 on: December 15, 2011, 02:45:41 AM »
i just really really want a pro build FF with no integrated grip battery life now in modern LI batteries is fine the grip is just un-necessary bulk. We need something more like nikons D700 and upcoming D800. I'm not interested in a FF rebel no feature plastic fantastic but i dont begrudge anyone for wanting such a camera, I guess there would be some concern from a business standpoint that a cheap FF might canibalise sale on the higher end ones, maybe they are still smarting from the 5D2 cutting the legs out from under the 1Ds3
I agree and think: If lenses are sharp enough for 18MP crop sensor, there lenses should be good enough for 45MP FF. So why not more Pixels at 3 images per second? Unfortunetly Canon is not reporting MTF with with 60 and 100 Linepairs per mm.

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #45 on: December 15, 2011, 02:45:41 AM »

torger

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #46 on: December 15, 2011, 03:17:10 AM »
I hope they make the 7D2 a "mini 1DX", focused on superior speed AF and low light capability for the APS-C format, and keep the good build quality. I'd like to see a reduction rather than increase in megapixels -- leave the high MP count to full format (I'd love a 5Dmk3 with 36+ megapixels) and possibly lower end APS-C -- and let the "pro" APS-C camera 7D2 be an action/wildlife camera, 12 megapixels with improved noise performance would be nice.

I think it will be a smart move to have like today that 7D and 5D are complementary, so you want to own them both.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2011, 03:19:56 AM by torger »

whatta

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #47 on: December 15, 2011, 04:04:35 AM »
I hope they make the 7D2 a "mini 1DX", focused on superior speed AF and low light capability for the APS-C format, and keep the good build quality. I'd like to see a reduction rather than increase in megapixels -- leave the high MP count to full format (I'd love a 5Dmk3 with 36+ megapixels) and possibly lower end APS-C -- and let the "pro" APS-C camera 7D2 be an action/wildlife camera, 12 megapixels with improved noise performance would be nice.

I think it will be a smart move to have like today that 7D and 5D are complementary, so you want to own them both.
+1, except no more MP into low end apsc  ;)
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nightbreath

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #48 on: December 15, 2011, 04:44:07 AM »
Even with lower stats, 1DX buyers spending a whopping ~$7000 will be pissed off if the sensor, the central feature, the brain is the same with a cheaper cousin that is already announced. From a marketing point of view, this is no way for them to sell enough 1DX and they won't do it!

Agree. There's no way Canon is going down in MPx count for 5D and using the same sensor as 1D X. This would cause loosing high MPx buyers if it is not 21+ or loosing 1D X buyers if it is 18 MPx. However they can bring out a 1D IV similar sensor (some changes might be applied) and give people ~27 MPx on a full-frame.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2011, 04:45:38 AM by nightbreath »
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Jettatore

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #49 on: December 15, 2011, 05:32:49 AM »
With the economy the way it is, shortening a product's life cycle is the exact opposite thing any developer should be thinking about.  My bet is that 7D II doesn't see an actual shelf till the very end of 2012 or early 2013.  5D Mark III is due for release some-time in 2012.  A side by side announcement or release of these two cameras (while it may very well happen) just doesn't make any sense.  The 5D Mark II and original 7D were released about a year apart from each other and it would make more sense that they will continue with that trend, it worked, really well for them.

At any rate, I'm planning to upgrade to 5D Mark III (or equivalent if they end up releasing two 5D sized upgraded bodies with different names) in 2012, and 7D Mark II in 2013 or later especially I can snag it at a reduced price/find a good deal on a used copy, I'm pretty happy with the 7D as it is.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2011, 05:41:46 AM by Jettatore »

whatta

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #50 on: December 15, 2011, 05:57:38 AM »
With the economy the way it is, shortening a product's life cycle is the exact opposite thing any developer should be thinking about.
true, but if they reuse sensor, af, digic like they do so, development is less camera by camera but more generations by generations.
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motorhead

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #51 on: December 15, 2011, 06:56:23 AM »
I don't see the 18 MP 1Dx having a long life span. Canon had to produce something for the Olympics next year and this they have done. However good the camera proves to be in other areas for the photojournalists and sports togs, 18 MP is not enough in the long term to replace the higher quality 1Ds mk3.


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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #51 on: December 15, 2011, 06:56:23 AM »

KeithR

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #52 on: December 15, 2011, 07:09:46 AM »
I understand that the larger the MP count the more it suffers from ISO noise.
Then you don't understand, I'm afraid. It simply doesn't work like that.


KeithR

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #53 on: December 15, 2011, 07:15:16 AM »
Why does the A77 sensor need improving? It is better than any Canon APS-C sensor.
Oh, please! the A77's sensor is a piece of crap, and if my 7D wasn't eminently able to stomp all over it - and it is - I'd throw my camera in the river.

You clearly haven't done any side-by-side testing of A77 files against the Canon sensor, or you couldn't possibly believe what you wrote.

KeithR

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #54 on: December 15, 2011, 07:19:11 AM »
Or are we all stupid enough to buy anything that Canon trots out just because it has the name Canon on it?
Based on the available evidence you might be, but I buy Canon gear because it's the best all-round solution by far for my photographic needs...

match14

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #55 on: December 15, 2011, 07:26:12 AM »
Why does the A77 sensor need improving? It is better than any Canon APS-C sensor.
Oh, please! the A77's sensor is a piece of crap, and if my 7D wasn't eminently able to stomp all over it - and it is - I'd throw my camera in the river.

You clearly haven't done any side-by-side testing of A77 files against the Canon sensor, or you couldn't possibly believe what you wrote.

+1

existent

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #56 on: December 15, 2011, 08:01:43 AM »
If D800 rumors are true and it will be 36mp, I can't see canon releasing a second 18mpx body as the only option. But I can see it being two different cameras as it has been suggested many times before.

If they announce a 18mpx 5DmkIII, and D800 is announced as 36mpx, canon will lose lot of sales. (not necessariliy jumping ship, but people simply won't buy it).

Only way a 18mpx ff camera will be announced first is with a new name. I can see a new body, say 6D, being announced as a ff 18mpx, high iso, great af FF camera priced at or under $2000. This way, people can still think that a 5D with a higher mpx may be coming as well.

Otherwise, I think next ff camera from canon will be a high mpx camera, call it 5dmkIII or 3D, and it will be priced $3000 minimum.

There is easily enough gap between 7D and 1DX to fit 2 ff cameras. Having a $2k ff camera will be great for marketing, attracting newcomers and stealing customers from likes of sony.

And lets be honest, 18mpx FF camera will be more than enough for your average prosumer... even for landscapes. If you are really dedicated and want the highest mpx you can get, then you wouldn't mind investing a bit more and going for a higher mpx alternative at around $3k...

So to summarise, I think there are enough room for 2 FF cameras - one cheaper more general purpose, and one more specialised and more expensive.

And just to remind again, I am basing all this to the fact that D800 will be high megapixel.



whatta

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #57 on: December 15, 2011, 08:21:25 AM »
So to summarise, I think there are enough room for 2 FF cameras - one cheaper more general purpose, and one more specialised and more expensive.
I agree, a relaively cheap FF (called 6d?) would definitelly have market.. I was considering, but I've invested too much in efs. Anyway next year a new body for me, hoping for a good 650d, I will not wait one more year (like for the 70d).
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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #57 on: December 15, 2011, 08:21:25 AM »

Maui5150

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #58 on: December 15, 2011, 09:34:54 AM »
I am not sure the demand will be as big. 

You a lot of people are in the bigger is better category, but say 36 MP versus 21MP is 1.7x greater.  That means your 32GB card you are used to shooting is now a 19GB card for all intent and purposes.

Will the Nikon allow us to have multiple levels of Raw?  i.e. an 18MP Raw and a 36MP Raw.

I can see a lot of people who will need that high of resolution, but I think for many that size might start to get too cumbersome. 

dilbert

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #59 on: December 15, 2011, 12:23:00 PM »
So to summarise, I think there are enough room for 2 FF cameras - one cheaper more general purpose, and one more specialised and more expensive.
I agree, a relaively cheap FF (called 6d?) would definitelly have market.. I was considering, but I've invested too much in efs. Anyway next year a new body for me, hoping for a good 650d, I will not wait one more year (like for the 70d).

I could definitely get behind that idea.

I'd love to see the 5D3 at sub-$2k prices, even if that means it retains the 9 point AF (but an AF that works) and for Canon to bring in a 3D or something at a higher price point that has better AF, build quality, etc.

A $1600 5D3 (even if it had a 18MP FF sensor) and a $3200 3D would fill out their camera line nicely.

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Re: 7D2, 5D3 and Megapixel Insights
« Reply #59 on: December 15, 2011, 12:23:00 PM »