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Author Topic: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF  (Read 16597 times)

koolman

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2011, 02:29:23 PM »
neuroanatomist: Does what your explaining above mean - that even using the CENTER focusing point for focus, the 60d for example is more advanced then the 550d - as its center point has "duel cross" ? I was thinking to upgrade to the 60d - soley for the purpose of more accurate AF . Would I feel a diffrence?

Yes, the 60D has a more accurate center AF point than the 550D, in addition to having better (cross-type) off-center points.  In some situations, you'd notice a difference, while in others (good light, high-contrast subject) probably not.

Do you think new rebels like the 650d - will have better AF like the 60d - or they will continue to employ the lower AF of the 550d?
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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2011, 02:29:23 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #31 on: December 20, 2011, 02:58:29 PM »
Do you think new rebels like the 650d - will have better AF like the 60d - or they will continue to employ the lower AF of the 550d?

Probably not the 650D.  I think that if the 70D gets improved AF, the 40/50/60D system will trickle down to the Rebel/xxxD line. But, that might require a better AF in the 7DII first, or the 70D might get a slight bump.  Historically, Canon has used the AF system as a significant differentiator between the lines.
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RonQ

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #32 on: December 20, 2011, 09:10:59 PM »
WOW!!  :o
You guys have me all confused about the 5DII, I'm this close to pulling the trigger on purchasing this body and now I'm not so sure.  I shoot events and weddings; AF accuracy is extremely important to me.  If the AF is that bad then why do I see so many wedding photographers using the 5DII?  I should just stick with the 7D then if this is the case, sure I lose out of the FF but AF accuracy is very important.  I also understand that noise is much better on a FF body, but that's what Lightroom is for.....
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skitron

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #33 on: December 20, 2011, 09:54:53 PM »
After a second session with my new 5D2 here are comments I have.

First after getting a handle on the shallow DOF I really like it at longer distances and learned to just stop down at short distance unless I want the "emerging from fog" effect.

Second, (probably should be first since it is the subject of the thread), the AF center point is a little better than my 50D. I messed with the peripheral points in pretty low light and at least with my Sigma 50 1.4 they actually worked pretty good. I was expecting total disaster after reading here and was pleasantly surprised.

Third, the empirical IQ/noise/ISO performance is very good, it's easy to get great looking shots with this camera. Everybody and their dog shoots this camera for weddings so RonQ I'd say give it a whirl and I think you'll like it (unless maybe it's a couple of 100 meter sprinters getting hitched  :) )
« Last Edit: December 20, 2011, 10:01:15 PM by skitron »
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neuroanatomist

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #34 on: December 20, 2011, 10:05:18 PM »
FF offers a substantial benefit at high ISO, and church interiors where flash isn't permitted mean you need high ISO.  For static and slow-moving subjects, the 5DII's AF is fine (well, the center point is, and the outer ones in decent light).  Personally, my issues with the 5DII are the poor servo tracking for somewhat faster and unpredictably moving targets.  Brides and wedding guests don't usually fall into that category (if the bride is running, things have gone terribly wrong...).  The center point will do well in dim light (better than the 7D, in my experience), and at the reception and other events you can mount a flash (if only for the AF assist). 

For weddings and events, portraits, etc., I think the 5DII's AF will be just fine.  Running kids, agility dog competitions, etc., not so much - there, if you want sufficiently capable AF and the ISO benefits of FF (indoor sports, dance recitals, etc.), a 1DsIII or 1D X is a better option.  But they're expensive, and if personal or business budgets don't support that, compromises are necessary.
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RonQ

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #35 on: December 20, 2011, 10:29:54 PM »
FF offers a substantial benefit at high ISO, and church interiors where flash isn't permitted mean you need high ISO.  For static and slow-moving subjects, the 5DII's AF is fine (well, the center point is, and the outer ones in decent light).  Personally, my issues with the 5DII are the poor servo tracking for somewhat faster and unpredictably moving targets.  Brides and wedding guests don't usually fall into that category (if the bride is running, things have gone terribly wrong...).  The center point will do well in dim light (better than the 7D, in my experience), and at the reception and other events you can mount a flash (if only for the AF assist). 

For weddings and events, portraits, etc., I think the 5DII's AF will be just fine.  Running kids, agility dog competitions, etc., not so much - there, if you want sufficiently capable AF and the ISO benefits of FF (indoor sports, dance recitals, etc.), a 1DsIII or 1D X is a better option.  But they're expensive, and if personal or business budgets don't support that, compromises are necessary.
Now I'm leaning back to the 5DII, thanks!!
The lens arsnal I'll be using on the 5D2 is a 24-70, 70-200 2.8 (non IS), and a 50 1.4.  I see mostly shooting with a 24-70 and for indoor reception hall switching to my 50 1.4 with a 580EXII attached.  I'm hoping that this line up will do it's job... What do you think?
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neuroanatomist

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #36 on: December 20, 2011, 10:49:41 PM »
@RonQ - sounds like a plan. I'd consider a double strap with the 70-200 on a crop body, for longer shots without the need to change lenses, and so you always have a backup camera at hand, just in case.
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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #36 on: December 20, 2011, 10:49:41 PM »

RonQ

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #37 on: December 20, 2011, 11:29:14 PM »
Sounds good, thanks for the info/feedback neuroanatomist.
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briansquibb

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #38 on: December 21, 2011, 03:39:44 AM »
For landscapes, portraits , and general center point usage, I find it to be very good.

In terms of AF accuracy of the center point, its extremely accurate.

In low light, it matches or exceeds my 1D MK III and is better than the 1D MK IV

Outer points and subject tracking are its weak points.

The lens you use is a big part of AF speed, but tracking, low light, point selected, and accuracy vary by model.

+1

Plus the viewfinder is good

At weddings I always compose inside the viewfinder - ie leave a little extra as this avoids cutting little bits off which you dont seen when taking shots.

I find the 70-200 the tool to take outdoors pictures when getting  head and shoulders images. I think you will find the 50mm too long indoors - if you are using flash then a lens such as the 17-40 more useful as the f/4 is not an issue as probably the aperture you will be shooting will be f4/f5.6 at as it avoids missing images though OOF from lack of DOF. You may find that even the 24-70 is too long indoors for couples/groups.

Remember that a wedding shoot is as much a reportage project as an artistic exercise. There are some shots that you MUST get - keep taking them until no one is pulling a face/blinking. Artistic shots are a bonus.

If you can get to the venue a vew days before at the same time as the wedding you will be able to checkout the lighting. Take the camera and take some images - if you can, take the future bride and groom to see how their heights affects the shots. Just think of the wedding pictures of Kris Humphries and Kim Kardashian - very difficult due to the difference in height - that would very much affect your lens choice and possibly where you take pictures - there is nothing worse than seeing a picture rail at ear height :)

RonQ

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #39 on: December 21, 2011, 11:40:40 AM »
@briansquibb
So in terms of the 17-40, I would assume then you use center AF point to shoot?  If that's the case then how can you insure that all subjects will be in focus?  Like short & tall subjects as you indicated, given that the AF is not that advanced.....
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briansquibb

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #40 on: December 21, 2011, 05:08:32 PM »
@briansquibb
So in terms of the 17-40, I would assume then you use center AF point to shoot?  If that's the case then how can you insure that all subjects will be in focus?  Like short & tall subjects as you indicated, given that the AF is not that advanced.....

Not sure what context you are talking about here - most images have OOF subjects, it is only the one which you are interested in which are important.

If you are talking about a wedding group - focus on the ground in front of the nearest person and then have sufficient DOF dialled in.

Tall and short people are all in the same plane so will be in focus

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #41 on: December 21, 2011, 05:40:35 PM »
WOW!!  :o
You guys have me all confused about the 5DII, I'm this close to pulling the trigger on purchasing this body and now I'm not so sure.  I shoot events and weddings; AF accuracy is extremely important to me.  If the AF is that bad then why do I see so many wedding photographers using the 5DII?  I should just stick with the 7D then if this is the case, sure I lose out of the FF but AF accuracy is very important.  I also understand that noise is much better on a FF body, but that's what Lightroom is for.....

just use the center point and f2.8 lenses or faster and you'll be fine :D
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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #42 on: December 21, 2011, 05:56:23 PM »
WOW!!  :o
You guys have me all confused about the 5DII, I'm this close to pulling the trigger on purchasing this body and now I'm not so sure.  I shoot events and weddings; AF accuracy is extremely important to me.  If the AF is that bad then why do I see so many wedding photographers using the 5DII?  I should just stick with the 7D then if this is the case, sure I lose out of the FF but AF accuracy is very important.  I also understand that noise is much better on a FF body, but that's what Lightroom is for.....

just use the center point and f2.8 lenses or faster and you'll be fine :D

I think F/4 as well?

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #42 on: December 21, 2011, 05:56:23 PM »

Meh

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #43 on: December 21, 2011, 06:01:08 PM »
@briansquibb
So in terms of the 17-40, I would assume then you use center AF point to shoot?  If that's the case then how can you insure that all subjects will be in focus?  Like short & tall subjects as you indicated, given that the AF is not that advanced.....

@RonQ I recall you asked a similar question the other day in another thread.   It might just be your choice of words but your question about short/tall subjects being in focus if only using a center AF point suggests that you might think that by using multiple focus points that the camera can independently achieve focus at each point but that is not the case (I apologize if I'm just misunderstanding your comment).  The camera can only focus at one distance at a time and every object that is at that distance from the camera will be in focus.  A tall person standing vertically (assuming the camera is held perpendicular to the ground) will be in focus from head to toe (more or less) because their whole body is aligned on the focal plane.  It doesn't matter whether you only used the center AF point, an off center point, or many points.

RonQ

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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #44 on: December 21, 2011, 06:32:24 PM »
@briansquibb
So in terms of the 17-40, I would assume then you use center AF point to shoot?  If that's the case then how can you insure that all subjects will be in focus?  Like short & tall subjects as you indicated, given that the AF is not that advanced.....

@RonQ I recall you asked a similar question the other day in another thread.   It might just be your choice of words but your question about short/tall subjects being in focus if only using a center AF point suggests that you might think that by using multiple focus points that the camera can independently achieve focus at each point but that is not the case (I apologize if I'm just misunderstanding your comment).  The camera can only focus at one distance at a time and every object that is at that distance from the camera will be in focus.  A tall person standing vertically (assuming the camera is held perpendicular to the ground) will be in focus from head to toe (more or less) because their whole body is aligned on the focal plane.  It doesn't matter whether you only used the center AF point, an off center point, or many points.
It's OK Meh, I'm just trying to learn from others.... I recently had a similar experience where my lens was wide open 2.8 shooting in AP and only the foreground subject was in full focus, all others were not.  I was so upset that I kicked myself several times trying to figure out what, if anything, I did wrong..... Once I changed to A-DEP the next day trying to take a similar shot with different subjects, everyone was in focus.  However, the only difference between the two were one was shot at sunset and the other (test subjects) were shot in full sunlight. 
Yehh, I'm aware it could have also been my camera and that's a possibility, I took it into the Canon Service center (about 2 blocks) from me and they swore nothing was wrong... However, 2 days later, I shot a family for portraits and I had a similar issue..... I was so frustrated that I went to manual focus and finished the job.  I took it back to Canon and told them that this was unacceptable, it took them 8 days to get the camera back to me indicating that they had to change out the FA and that it was causing inaccurate focus, they changed it out and did some electrical adjustments and since I have not had any clients to shoot, I'm assuming it's back to normal but still curious as to how other photographers are shooting. 
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Re: 5d mkII vs 50D in terms of AF
« Reply #44 on: December 21, 2011, 06:32:24 PM »