PC or MAC

[Meh]

During the 5 years I used that 2006 MBP (and it's still running, will be used by the kids), I went through six PC laptops (Compaq, then HP, then Lenovo, fortunately paid for by work) - one was end-of-lifed, and the other 4 just flat out failed for one reason or another.  Only the most recent of the six had specs that actually exceeded the 5 year old MBP. 

That's quite the poor track record for your PC laptops.  If one was end-of-lifed was that at 3 years old, if so then you had 4 failed machines in 2 years?  I wouldn't say that's the typical experience.  Is there anything about your work environment that may have contributed?

I had a laptop fail on me just yesterday (an HP) but is coming up 4 years old and essentially runs 24/7.  Another (an LG) is 6 years old and still runs Windows XP fine.

Macs are definitely better built with only top notch components so are certainly going to last longer.  Historically, they have performed well for longer periods compared to Windows machines but that was largely due to Windows adding performance hogging features over time as new hardware improved... anyone upgrading software of course was then running the new versions on the same hardware so saw a big performance hit.  Apple was much more cautious and focused more on maintaining performance.  Very smart on their part, it helped to build their reputation.

[EYEONE]

I haven't read this entire thread but here is my take.

Apple clearly has better build quality than most laptops. That much isn't so debatable to me.

It's funny how people just assume that I edit on a Mac because I'm a photographer. I don't. I'm a PC person.
I had a desktop with WindowsXP on it and for 5 years I never had a problem. Now I have a ASUS laptop with Windows7 on it and I've never had a problem. I bought it about 3 years ago with Intel i5, 4gb RAM and a Radeon 5470 graphics chip for $870.

I've used Macs and I've seen them freeze up and be goofy from time to time. I have an iphone and it works really well but sometimes it is goofy too (I switch from Droid because it was a piece of crap). So I don't really buy the line that "Macs/Apple just work".

Truth is they work just as well as anything else. I don't think they are better and I don't think they are worse.
If you choose Mac then that is great because they are good machines. But I do tire of the Apple Elitist attitude.

[awinphoto]

Thanks for your input Jettatore and Meh... I cant say I've ever gone through Fire damage Per Se but have experienced HD failure in old machines... In my day job which I shoot commercially for my company, My Macs are hooked up to the same network as the rest of the company/sales floor, which uses PC's...  I also have a remote server when i need to access the networks datebase via access on a windows machine... I talk constantly with the IT Manager who has major antivirus softwares for the network and computers... Even the top managers get narly virus's on regular occasions and their computers get replaced on a regular cycle because of them... My dept (marketing) all runs Macs and never once has the IT manager ever have to monitor, trouble shoot, worry about our computers... It's just trouble free... I back up files i deem necessary at home such as clients photos, portfolio stuff, kids photos, etc... But with the PC, when I had one, I remember getting virus's on a monthly occurrence... backing up daily in some situations... and it was always painful when it did crash because not only stuff not backed up gets wasted, but time to reformat, reinstall, recalibrate, etc... all that down time in a professional situation I cannot afford.  When I can have a machine work as I expect it when i need it as I need it, that's money in the bank for me.  When I need to back up, I do, but it isn't something I fret about.  If something happens beyond my control (fire), that's fine, I'll deal with that as I need to (grab my external while I flee out the door as well as my cameras and family), but the choice to run my mac and not a windows is a choice I can make and I did. 

[Maui5150]

I'm sure that exact same card is in millions of PCs doing the exact same thing. If a 4 year old Dell or HP or Samsung showed up dead do you think they'd replace the graphics card for free even if they knew it was a problem? I'd be surprised.

Actually a few years ago, Dell swapped out about 250 HD controllers that were bad at the hospital I work at on machines that were around 3 years old. 

Better yet, I fried a motherboard by mistake, I think on a machine I built, went to MicroCenter, dropped off the board and since the board was no longer carried got a credit on the purchase of a new motherboard for the price I paid originally. 

The main reason I like PCs is I have more control of the components that go into them.  A new video card comes out that smokes, it is much easier to swap and install. 

Along the same lines, similar reason that I love MacGurus for their external drive storage solutions.  as the technology has improved, the sell you the components needed to upgrade, so no need to buy a new enclosure, just upgrade the HD controllers, etc. 

[Jettatore]

I went to two highly rated universities for computer graphics.  The Apple machines never worked well.  They were always jammed up/frozen, completely out of service, unreliable and crashed like crazy.  Especially in public settings like a school, Macs are notoriously horrendous.  I'm sure your personal workstation or laptop won't have these problems en mass effect like public machines do so the comparison isn't entirely a fair one.

I've also repaired peoples consumer end Windows PC and Laptops and have serviced my friends Mac machines and walked them through necessary purchases like what wiFi modems/switches/routers to buy for their home network.  They never know what they are doing, bought garbage in the first place, have no idea how to keep a machine running efficiently and all the extra stuff they bought to help them (McAfee, Norton, etc.) just made everything that much worse.  You can't judge consumer end walmart PC equipment for this conversation, it's not relevant for our purposes and if that or some crap sale at Dell is what you are judging PC performance on then you are going to have issues, I'm certain of it.

I've also owned a Mac, and had a horrendous experience with the Apple store.  Because I paid in cash via check, instead of using a credit card (never do this, ever, with anything big) I had no back up and got really screwed over on a brand new purchase.  I ended up paying full price for a factory refurbished Mac system and suffered over a month of downtime trouble shooting the problem.  No way, never again.

And they make high end water resistant spill and crash proof/shock absorbed PC laptops so this idea that you can't get a well built PC laptop is insane.

[neuroanatomist]

That's quite the poor track record for your PC laptops.  If one was end-of-lifed was that at 3 years old, if so then you had 4 failed machines in 2 years?  I wouldn't say that's the typical experience.  Is there anything about your work environment that may have contributed?

Agreed - I'm sure it's worse than usual.  Environment?  An office with a nice view of Boston...I can see Fenway Park out the window, maybe the PCs were Yankees fans?   

Yes, Macs are definitely better-built than typical PC laptops, and while the 'low end' Mac laptop starts at $1K, there are lots of less expensive PCs out there.  I also agree that once you get into high-end PCs, the cost differences become less evident for similar products. 

But one of the things I really like about Macs is the 'it just works' bit.  Granted, sometimes it doesn't.  I bought a PowerMac 6500 desktop several years ago, and the HDD stopped working after two weeks - not component failure (which happens to any brand) but a bug in Apple's driver.  Tech support helpfully said I could simply download a fix (and I did, from work), but in a fit of pique I pointed out that since their bad software had rendered my Mac inoperable, I had no way to download it - so they shipped a floppy disk (remember those?) overnight.  </digression>  But mostly, they do work, and in part that's beacuse of the tight controls Apple places on developers, and also the freedom from viruses and/or the overhead of AV software because of the Unix kernel that runs the Mac OS.

Another thing I really like is the host of little features that make them more convenient.  Once you use two-fingered scrolling on a multitouch trackpad, going back to a regular PC trackpad is acutely annoying.  Ever tripped over a power cord and pulled the laptop off the table/desk?  My wife did that to a 12" PowerBook once onto a tile floor, dented the corner but the damage was cosmetic only - the accelerometer parked the HDD, and aluminum is tough; I'm pretty sure a PC would have bit the dust with a cracked case and internal damage.  But with current Macs, if you trip over the cord the MagSafe power connector just falls off, and the laptop stays put.  Etc.

[Caps18]

I've been using my MacBook Pro 17" since 2010, and it still is working great.

I like the software on a Mac better since it helps me stay organized and allows me to do more with my photos and videos.

[EYEONE]

Another thing I really like is the host of little features that make them more convenient.  Once you use two-fingered scrolling on a multitouch trackpad, going back to a regular PC trackpad is acutely annoying.

Actually that's not just an Apple feature anymore. My Asus Laptop has track pad gestures for 1, 2 and 3 fingers. And I must say the two finger scrolling and tapping for a right mouse click is one of the best things ever.

[JR]

"Another thing I really like is the host of little features that make them more convenient.  Once you use two-fingered scrolling on a multitouch trackpad, going back to a regular PC trackpad is acutely annoying" 

No matter how powerful my PC setup is, I often go back to my Mac Pro for convenience.  For example I love the iPhoto software and the possibility to build your own books and have them printed professionally.  I know this is possible on a PC as well, just more user friendly on a Mac. 

I still need to figure out how to make Lightroom zoom at 100% on pictures on my Mac at lightning speed like my PC does!

Oh, and the mouse scroll thing is addictive indeed!

[awinphoto]

Someone mentioned earlier about how they hate apple users "elitist attitude"... I've heard this also in other mac/pc discussions... I dont feel that even though I use a mac that i'm an elitist compared to a PC person... my dear 85 year old runs both a PC and a Mac because even though he see's the benefits of a Mac, he's just more used to the PC... The PC didn't work for me and so I got the Mac... It's a personal preference... just like the Nikon/Canon debate... Some people just use Canon's and love them... Some adore Nikons and more power to them... and then you got those who swing both ways... It's the same with Mac's/PC's... 10 years ago I swore I'd be a PC person but virus after virus, lost files after lost files, etc... I eventually had enough and made a personal decision to make the jump... It doesn't make me any more right or wrong, it is what it is and "it just works" for me.   

[Jettatore]

Yeah but Awin, it's not like the Canon vs. Nikon debate or the Coke vs. Pepsi debate.

You have three ranges of OS systems.  For profit, closed source and proprietary (Apple), For profit and closed source (Windows) and completely free (Linux).  Apple, is continually pulling technology away from open source systemologies and towards proprietary monopolistic empires that they control entirely.  It's a BAD idea for all of us in the long run.  I'm embarrassed to even still be on a Windows machine at this point and I plan to have this completely corrected by the end of 2012.

[imjwalsh]

Here is my 2 cents:

I seriously considered going with a 15” Mac Book Pro, but ended up going with Lenovo instead as I work with PCs for work and could get more speed for a system that I am very familiar with.  I ended up going with a W510 (W520 is current model) which is a “workstation replacement.”  It has an i7 quad core processor, nVidia GPU with 48 cores, and 16GB of memory.  It also has a built in colorimeter and 95% color gamut display.  It has an eSata port too, for very fast external hard drive access.  I don’t think I would have gone wrong with a Mac Book Pro; I think this was just a better fit for what I wanted.  At some point I will upgrade to a Solid State Drive and use my current drive as a secondary after taking out the burner which I do not really use.  I don’t think it is as easy to do this sort of thing on a Mac.

I use Lightroom 3, Photoshop CS5, and Premier CS5.  I also host a VM that I use for work.  It sits in its docking station and is hooked up to 2 displays at home, but still is relatively mobile for working around the house or traveling with it.  I did a photo vacation in Utah in February and brought this with me (and of course everyone else had Macs).  I personally haven’t had any trouble with the business ThinkPad class of Lenovos; I still have my machine that’s 4.5 years old and is working fine (although I did have to replace the battery).  I also like Windows 7 much better than previous Microsoft offerings.

[awinphoto]

Yeah but Awin, it's not like the Canon vs. Nikon debate or the Coke vs. Pepsi debate.

You have three ranges of OS systems.  For profit, closed source and proprietary (Apple), For profit and closed source (Windows) and completely free (Linux).  Apple, is continually pulling technology away from open source systemologies and towards proprietary monopolistic empires that they control entirely.  It's a BAD idea for all of us in the long run.  I'm embarrassed to even still be on a Windows machine at this point and I plan to have this completely corrected by the end of 2012.

I understand your concern about the closed source/monopoly that is Apple, however from what I can tell, more and more software providers are given opportunities to provide applications for macs... If you go to the apple store you can find a plethora of Non-apple branded companies, whom i'm sure is sponsored by apple, but the list is growing... There are non-apple stores where you can upgrade/upspec your systems... You can upgrade stuff like Ram on Imacs and towers...  It isn't as open as PC's are but shoot, for what I need and use, it's pretty darn close. 

[Jettatore]

Good to know Awin, but that's not exactly why I am concerned.

When you are working with software (or an operating system which is also considered software), and no one can see what is going on behind the scenes with-in the code, it's not safe for your freedom, as a human being with rights including your rights to privacy.  Microsoft is no champion in this regard and they are no great friend to open source methodologies either.  Apple just happens to be slightly worse, because their closed source software on top of being closed source, only runs on hardware that ONLY they sell.  This is a horrible idea long term, for all of us.

[well_dunno]

Hello,

This is my first post but I have been following the forums for a few months so firstly, greetings to you all!

I personally prefer laptops running windows and always install linux in a separate partition (I personally go with ubuntu but naturally a lot of other options are avaliable). Having windows feels convenient basically even though I do not use it frequently. Linux environment, just like mac, is free of malwares so you do not consume the resources of the computer on  protecting it. Then most of the software available are under general public license and free. Also, most of the time,  it is possible to find a program for any given purpose. Linux systems do require more expertise to manage in comparison to windows though.

Even if you prefer windows and something happens to it, you can run linux and get your files out (non-hardware failure situations naturally)...

Just my thoughts...

Cheers