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Author Topic: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup  (Read 32645 times)

Neeneko

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #30 on: January 24, 2012, 12:50:17 PM »
once again, the "having video makes this camera worse for stills" argument
I completely disagree

I do not think including video itself makes it 'worse', but pointing out that video is not just a 'free' feature.  It eats development time, it eats limited resources on the camera, it eats testing time, it effects design decisions the impact the still photo side.  To a limited degree, this is a zero sum case and, if the body did not include video, the same amount of resources being put into it likely would have produced a better still camera.

Naturally it could be argued that the increase in sales/demand for a dual purpose camera out weighs this and TBH I have no idea if it does or not.

Quote
and I didn't hear any stills shooters complaining in the times of film, when you could buy better and vastly cheaper film stocks thanks to the huge demand for film by the movie industry
just as "kodak should forget about stills and develop better film stocks for its main customer, the movie industry" was a dumb argument back then, "canon should forget about video and develop better stills cameras" is silly now

Not really the same thing.  I do not think anyone is suggesting Canon should not product video cameras, or even dual function cameras, just that Canon should also produce cameras where the only function is still and thus all design decisions and hardware/firmware tradeoffs focus on still photography rather then 'it has to work well for both'. 

When you buy a dual use camera, you are paying for not only the increased manufacturing cost of including video capabilities and the R&D/Testing involved in a more complex device, but, as said, if this theory is true, you are paying for design decisions intended to benefit a whole class of use-cases that you (assuming one only wants stills) do not care about, and thus design decisions that focus on the other use cases probably would have designed it differently.

For reference, I spent years working in embedded systems (not cameras) and this was always a major point of contention, esp when marketing pushed for features that a certain percentage of customers wanted to be put into all models, even when those customers were already served by specialized models that met their use cases specifically.  It was very frustrating from an engineering perspective.

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #30 on: January 24, 2012, 12:50:17 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #31 on: January 24, 2012, 12:51:32 PM »
Seems to me that 5D3 would be introduced well before a 7D2.   At least it's due sooner.

Based on what?  An n=2 for the 5-series and an n=1 for the 7-series?  One point isn't even enough for a trendline...

There you go being all logical.... You're going to anger all the crazy 7D APC-S fanatics by talking like that.  :P

There won't be a 7-series with APS-H.  Too confusing for EF-S compatibility.  Does anyone really want to consult a table or other resource to determine which lenses will work with which bodies?  Would any manufacturer push out such a confusing system to make things more complex for their customers?  I mean, there's absolutely no precedent for that...   ::)

But, nothing preculdes another line for a semi-pro APS-H camera...
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V8Beast

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #32 on: January 24, 2012, 12:53:30 PM »
I posted on another thread, but will ask the question here as well: if the autofocus is the only major upgrade, is that enough for people to buy the 5DIII?

Hell yes, for me at least. I never bothered upgrading from the 5D to the 5DII because despite the increase in resolution, and slight bump in DR and ISO, Canon didn't address my biggest gripe with the 5D: the pathetic AF. If the 5DIII is essentially the same as a 5DII, with with a pro-caliber AF, I will cease all talk about defecting to Nikon and put in a pre-order for one ASAP.  Of course, a couple more FPS would be nice, too :)

I like everything about the 7D except the image quality, and I like everything about the 5DIII except the AF. I really hope there's some truth to these rumors, because it just makes too much sense.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 01:02:16 PM by V8Beast »

marius

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #33 on: January 24, 2012, 12:54:46 PM »
I don't think this is a full-frame sensor camera. And so, no 5D Mark III ...
First, this camera has the battery grip integrated - the 5D Mark I (II) has not.
Second, I noticed that the "focal plane mark" is white and on the right side. All full frames camera (even 1D), 1D-s and 5D-s, have the mark on the left side.
I think this may be a 7D mark II OR a totally new camera, but not a 5D Mark III  :-\

Focal plane mark
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=d64387-1327427629.jpg


bigblue1ca

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #34 on: January 24, 2012, 12:56:40 PM »
This is all very entertaining with all the hype that has been generated.  All I hope is they announce the 5DIII sooner than later.  I was about to put a pre-order in on a 1DX when this all broke.  If the 5DIII has some improvements in ISO, FPS, and picks up the AF of the 7D as people are speculating, I would be highly inclined to buy it over the 1DX and take my savings and put it towards glass.  I need a good AF system, okay FPS, and decent low light ISO capabilities.  A one stop ISO improvement in the 5DIII over the 5DII, the 7Ds AF system, and somewhere in the 5-7 FPS range would be right up my alley.

I think in one of the other threads on the 5DIII (I think there are three on the go now) I saw Neuro hypothesizing about if Canon would leave the 1DX as the top of the line flagship model, but let the 5DIII come in just slightly below in terms of features.  It's certainly an interesting question. 

Canon likely has a pretty good idea that they'll automatically sell X units of the 1DX to pros sports/photo journalists, etc, based on previous flag ship sales.  The question is if they blend the 5DII and 7D, and add a few improvements and create the 5DIII and sell it for $3000 less than the 1DX, will the extra units they would undoubtedly sell of improved 5DIII make up for the lost sales from those (like me) who would have otherwise bought the 1DX?
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 01:03:40 PM by bigblue1ca »

D_Rochat

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #35 on: January 24, 2012, 01:00:25 PM »
I see what you're saying neuro, but I don't think it's too far out there to think that Canon may be restructuring their Pro line and pushing the APC-S and EF-S down to a more Prosumer XXD line. I might think differently if they start to produce red ring EF-S lenses.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 01:02:59 PM by D_Rochat »

mkln

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #36 on: January 24, 2012, 01:07:27 PM »
I don't think this is a full-frame sensor camera. And so, no 5D Mark III ...
First, this camera has the battery grip integrated - the 5D Mark I (II) has not.
Second, I noticed that the "focal plane mark" is white and on the right side. All full frames camera (even 1D), 1D-s and 5D-s, have the mark on the left side.
I think this may be a 7D mark II OR a totally new camera, but not a 5D Mark III  :-\

Focal plane mark
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=d64387-1327427629.jpg


The battery grip is not integrated, the dented thing under the LCD is the attachment screw between body and grip

I wonder tho where you insert the batteries.
Could it be a wifi grip?
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 01:10:07 PM by mkln »

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #36 on: January 24, 2012, 01:07:27 PM »

marius

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #37 on: January 24, 2012, 01:12:03 PM »
I don't think this is a full-frame sensor camera. And so, no 5D Mark III ...
First, this camera has the battery grip integrated - the 5D Mark I (II) has not.
Second, I noticed that the "focal plane mark" is white and on the right side. All full frames camera (even 1D), 1D-s and 5D-s, have the mark on the left side.
I think this may be a 7D mark II OR a totally new camera, but not a 5D Mark III  :-\

Focal plane mark
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=d64387-1327427629.jpg


The battery grip is not integrated, the dented thing under the LCD is the attachment screw between body and grip

I wonder tho where you insert the batteries.
Could it be a wifi grip?



I think is integrated:
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=411be0-1327429194.jpg

... but something like this (on the left side):
http://a.img-dpreview.com/reviews/CanonEOS1DMarkIV/Images/battery.jpg
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 01:14:43 PM by marius »

awinphoto

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #38 on: January 24, 2012, 01:15:13 PM »
I posted on another thread, but will ask the question here as well: if the autofocus is the only major upgrade, is that enough for people to buy the 5DIII?

Hmmm define "major"   ;)  Depends... the 5d2 is a great camera but the AF in it currently makes it fell psychologically like a dinosaur.  Like what digirev said in the comparison of the 7d vs 5d2, after using the 7d, the 5d2 AF is "depressing".  There are other nuances with the 7D which, like going into a sharper image store, you didn't know you needed...  Like for me, levels is a must and I think there's no wall in heck they wouldn't add it in, at least in the LCD if not the viewfinder.  I do a lot of product, a lot of architecture, panoramas, and levels is so much better and easier than having a bubble level on the hot shoe.  Weathersealing... I've taken my 7d out in snow storms, rain, etc and haven't worried about what if... (with a sealed lens).  I'm sure the 5d2 could handle moisture but, like with the xxd cameras when I used them, you always have that nagging doubt which inevitably cuts your shoot in half before you probably could last.  Lastly, flash commander... With no pop-up, I have no idea how they wish to incorporate this, but it really would be an awesome feature if they add it in.  Also keep that MFN button and dial lock and we got ourselves a perfect camera for me.  Otherwise I'll have to weigh if it's worth the upgrade or not. 
Canon 5d III, Canon 24-105L, Canon 17-40L, Canon 70-200 F4L, Canon 100L 2.8, 430EX 2's and a lot of bumps along the road to get to where I am.

awinphoto

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #39 on: January 24, 2012, 01:16:36 PM »
I don't think this is a full-frame sensor camera. And so, no 5D Mark III ...
First, this camera has the battery grip integrated - the 5D Mark I (II) has not.
Second, I noticed that the "focal plane mark" is white and on the right side. All full frames camera (even 1D), 1D-s and 5D-s, have the mark on the left side.
I think this may be a 7D mark II OR a totally new camera, but not a 5D Mark III  :-\

Focal plane mark
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=d64387-1327427629.jpg


The battery grip is not integrated, the dented thing under the LCD is the attachment screw between body and grip

I wonder tho where you insert the batteries.
Could it be a wifi grip?



I think is integrated:
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=411be0-1327429194.jpg

... but something like this (on the left side):
http://a.img-dpreview.com/reviews/CanonEOS1DMarkIV/Images/battery.jpg


The first link clearly shows the screw in wheel that connects the grip to the camera.. it is not integrated, however it can be the closest sealed grip made to date tho.
Canon 5d III, Canon 24-105L, Canon 17-40L, Canon 70-200 F4L, Canon 100L 2.8, 430EX 2's and a lot of bumps along the road to get to where I am.

mathino

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #40 on: January 24, 2012, 01:16:49 PM »
I don't think this is a full-frame sensor camera. And so, no 5D Mark III ...
First, this camera has the battery grip integrated - the 5D Mark I (II) has not.
Second, I noticed that the "focal plane mark" is white and on the right side. All full frames camera (even 1D), 1D-s and 5D-s, have the mark on the left side.
I think this may be a 7D mark II OR a totally new camera, but not a 5D Mark III  :-\

Focal plane mark
http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=d64387-1327427629.jpg


The battery grip is not integrated, the dented thing under the LCD is the attachment screw between body and grip

I wonder tho where you insert the batteries.
Could it be a wifi grip?


As mentioned before, batteries could be put from side. Or this could be a Wifi/GPS grip as you suggest.
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well_dunno

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #41 on: January 24, 2012, 01:30:38 PM »
Oh well, apparently Stephen Oachs received accusations for sharing the info and had to post a follow up stating that the images he posted are not fake and that he is not a Canon employee...

If all that is true, I would not be posting anything of the kind again in his shoes. I don't know how many clicks aperture academy got since yesterday though...  ;D

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DzPhotography

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #42 on: January 24, 2012, 01:33:41 PM »


Based on what?  An n=2 for the 5-series and an n=1 for the 7-series?  One point isn't even enough for a trendline...

maybe because the 5D MkII is one of the oldest models in the canon line-up?  ::)
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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #42 on: January 24, 2012, 01:33:41 PM »

doug13

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #43 on: January 24, 2012, 01:37:46 PM »
Oh well, apparently Stephen Oachs received accusations for sharing the info and had to post a follow up stating that the images he posted are not fake and that he is not a Canon employee...

If all that is true, I would not be posting anything of the kind again in his shoes. I don't know how many clicks aperture academy got since yesterday though...  ;D

Cheers!

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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #44 on: January 24, 2012, 01:50:27 PM »


Based on what?  An n=2 for the 5-series and an n=1 for the 7-series?  One point isn't even enough for a trendline...

maybe because the 5D MkII is one of the oldest models in the canon line-up?  ::)
But countering that, the 7D is the second oldest and there are a number of high profile sports events coming this year (e.g. Olympics and European Championsips, for which Canon is a major sponsor). Of course, it could be neither :P.
In fact the 1D MkIV was newer than both.
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Re: 5D Mark III (or other) Followup
« Reply #44 on: January 24, 2012, 01:50:27 PM »