November 22, 2017, 07:10:00 PM

Author Topic: Sigma 150-600mm customization  (Read 5927 times)

AlanF

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Sigma 150-600mm customization
« on: May 18, 2016, 07:31:49 AM »
I traded one of my 100-400mm IIs for a Sigma 150-600mm C last Thursday from the local shop after I borrowed and tested it. The Sigmas vary from copy to copy, some have tested much worse than the Tamron. This copy is off-scale at the top end in their quality control. It beats my 100-400 IIs at 400 in the centre and matches them at the edges at 400mm, and kills them at 560mm with 1.4xTCs when it is set to 600mm, where it is also ahead of my 300mm f/2.8 II + 2xTC.

The first problem was with the OS - it is all aver the place in the viewfinder. But, I got a Sigma dock today and fixed the problem using dynamic OS.

What other customizations would you recommend for bird and other photography?

Here are a couple of shots on the 5DS R at 600mm. The first is the best I have ever taken of a barnswallow - no sharpening at all from RAW. The second is a tiny 650x450 crop of my local peregrine falcon 48 m up a tower.
5D IV, 5DS R, 400mm DO II, 1.4xTC III, 2xTC III, EF 1.8 STM,  EF 24-105, 100-400 II, EF-S 15-85, Sigma 150-600mm C, EOS-M5 15-45, f/2 22, 11-22, Samyang 8mm f/2.8 fisheye: sold 7D II, EOS-M, Powershot G3 X,  Sigma 10-20, EF 300/2.8 II, 70-200/4 IS.

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Sigma 150-600mm customization
« on: May 18, 2016, 07:31:49 AM »

Travelintrevor

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2016, 11:09:54 AM »
I also traded in my 70-300L for the Sigma 150-600C. I purchased it for $700 new and then tested it against my 70-300L. The IS is not as good as the canon but the IQ was on par AND I got another 300mm reach. Also noticed that the background blur was not as much at the same f stop and FL but that did not bother me. Great lens and not too heavy!
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Stewart K

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2016, 06:43:01 AM »
Hi folks,

I might be going on a holiday to Africa later in the year, I currently have the 100-400L (V1) + a 1.4xIII.
I know I'm asking about the other version of this lens, but if the C version is better than my current combo, would you expect the Sport version to better still?  Weight is not an issue for me, I'm just very curious about the IQ on the extra reach of a bare lens minus a Teleconvertor.

Grateful for any advice.
EOS 5DIII - EOS 70D - EF 600L IS USM - EF 100-400L - EF 24-105L - EF 16-35L ƒ2.8 II - EF 100 ƒ2.8 USM Macro - EF 50 ƒ1.4 USM - EF 1.4xIII - Speedlight 600EX-RT
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Ladislav

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2017, 07:20:21 AM »
I got this lens yesterday. I was very surprised with the build and overall package quality. Now I'm trying to figure out AF, OS and sharpness quality.

What shutter speed do you consider minimal at 600mm on FF with OS in mode 1 when shooting static subjects handheld? In my initial tries, I had quite poor keeper rate even with 1/250s. It can be because of my technique - I never shoot with lens over 300mm.

Did you do any focus adjustments with USB dock? I run some tests with Focal for all four focal lengths and 2.8, 6 and 15 meters focus distances. I got AF adjustments between -5 to +9. 150, 250 and 400 mm are all consistently in negative values with ranges between -5 to -2. 600mm is in positive values with range between +4 and +9.

On the other hand, I don't really trust FoCal a lot.


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SecureGSM

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2017, 07:28:27 AM »
I would strongly suggest investing in Sigma USB dock. Trust me, you cannot reliably calibrate this lens with in camera only AFMA options. long story but just trust me. it will be the best $50.00 you spent in your life ;)

I got this lens yesterday. I was very surprised with the build and overall package quality. Now I'm trying to figure out AF, OS and sharpness quality.

What shutter speed do you consider minimal at 600mm on FF with OS in mode 1 when shooting static subjects handheld? In my initial tries, I had quite poor keeper rate even with 1/250s. It can be because of my technique - I never shoot with lens over 300mm.

Did you do any focus adjustments with USB dock? I run some tests with Focal for all four focal lengths and 2.8, 6 and 15 meters focus distances. I got AF adjustments between -5 to +9. 150, 250 and 400 mm are all consistently in negative values with ranges between -5 to -2. 600mm is in positive values with range between +4 and +9.

On the other hand, I don't really trust FoCal a lot.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2017, 09:05:20 AM by SecureGSM »

AlanF

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2017, 10:01:19 AM »
I would strongly suggest investing in Sigma USB dock. Trust me, you cannot reliably calibrate this lens with in camera only AFMA options. long story but just trust me. it will be the best $50.00 you spent in your life ;)

I got this lens yesterday. I was very surprised with the build and overall package quality. Now I'm trying to figure out AF, OS and sharpness quality.

What shutter speed do you consider minimal at 600mm on FF with OS in mode 1 when shooting static subjects handheld? In my initial tries, I had quite poor keeper rate even with 1/250s. It can be because of my technique - I never shoot with lens over 300mm.

Did you do any focus adjustments with USB dock? I run some tests with Focal for all four focal lengths and 2.8, 6 and 15 meters focus distances. I got AF adjustments between -5 to +9. 150, 250 and 400 mm are all consistently in negative values with ranges between -5 to -2. 600mm is in positive values with range between +4 and +9.

On the other hand, I don't really trust FoCal a lot.

I use the Sigma Dock, which I used to change the OS to "Dynamic". My copy of the C doesn't change by more than 2 AFMA units with focal length so I can use in-camera AFMA. As for shutter speed, it depends on your skill and the camera. I've gone down to 1/80s fully had held, but it was close.
5D IV, 5DS R, 400mm DO II, 1.4xTC III, 2xTC III, EF 1.8 STM,  EF 24-105, 100-400 II, EF-S 15-85, Sigma 150-600mm C, EOS-M5 15-45, f/2 22, 11-22, Samyang 8mm f/2.8 fisheye: sold 7D II, EOS-M, Powershot G3 X,  Sigma 10-20, EF 300/2.8 II, 70-200/4 IS.

Ladislav

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2017, 06:36:55 AM »
I would strongly suggest investing in Sigma USB dock. Trust me, you cannot reliably calibrate this lens with in camera only AFMA options. long story but just trust me. it will be the best $50.00 you spent in your life ;)

I have Sigma USB dock. That's why I'm asking about focus adjustments ;)

Sigma USB dock is an interesting idea but it is in my opinion missed opportunity. It is nice that you can tweak the focus but since there is no automation, it is just a gimmick and way for Sigma to reduce cost of technical support they need to give to their customers.

I used FoCal to get some data for focal lengths and distances used by Sigma Optimization Pro SW. What I wonder is if those values are equal to values I should set in Sigma SW.
6D | 16-35 | 24-70 | 70-200 | 70-300 | 150-600 | 17 TS | 24 TS | 50 | 100 Macro | 430 EX II

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2017, 06:36:55 AM »

SecureGSM

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2017, 07:22:59 AM »
yes, those values are what you need to set in Sigma SW. but then, do another Focal run to verify that you are arrived at the perfect AFMA values. if not perfect, then do another Focal run. The new values will be very close to 0, but set them in Sigma SW again and repeat.
In regards to lack of automation: you can automate!
I charge $100.00 per perfectly calibrated at 16 points Sigma Telephoto zoom lens. pretty automated: drop your lens off and pick up in 2 hours :)

Sigma support would not calibrate your lens at 16 points. they calibrate at x40 to x50 the lens focal length distance to target at Wide and telephoto end. thats all.



I would strongly suggest investing in Sigma USB dock. Trust me, you cannot reliably calibrate this lens with in camera only AFMA options. long story but just trust me. it will be the best $50.00 you spent in your life ;)

I have Sigma USB dock. That's why I'm asking about focus adjustments ;)

Sigma USB dock is an interesting idea but it is in my opinion missed opportunity. It is nice that you can tweak the focus but since there is no automation, it is just a gimmick and way for Sigma to reduce cost of technical support they need to give to their customers.

I used FoCal to get some data for focal lengths and distances used by Sigma Optimization Pro SW. What I wonder is if those values are equal to values I should set in Sigma SW.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2017, 12:21:24 AM by SecureGSM »

JoSto

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2017, 07:49:57 AM »
I bought the Sigma 150-600C one year ago. Until now I have to say that this lens is very impressive.

I use it on a Canon 7DII, a very high pixel-density camera. The AF is fast, the stabilzer allows usage of 1/320s handheld at 900mm. The lens is lightweight and compact. It fits very nice into a backpak so it is carry-on baggage capable. The build quality feels as good as the new plasticy Canon L Lenses, only thing is I dont trust the weather-sealing. I use it only when its dry outside. All that for a $900 Price Tag.

As I wrote I use the canon 7d mark II so sharpness should be a problem but there is none (At least my copy looks very sharp). To show the sharpness of my copy I took some pictures of a barcode from a book.

30 feet away, 500mm, Zero Sharpening, Neutral Cameraprofile, Exported from Lightroom, Zoom on Pixel-Level (about 8:1)

Picture 1: Centre f6.3 wide open
Picture 2: Centre f8.0

I have a question: Did somebody the firmwareupgrade and if so, did the lens improve?
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AlanF

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2017, 02:47:44 PM »
I don't understand the pixel size of the barcode image. Do you mean that 8 pixels of the barcode = 1 pixel of the original image?
5D IV, 5DS R, 400mm DO II, 1.4xTC III, 2xTC III, EF 1.8 STM,  EF 24-105, 100-400 II, EF-S 15-85, Sigma 150-600mm C, EOS-M5 15-45, f/2 22, 11-22, Samyang 8mm f/2.8 fisheye: sold 7D II, EOS-M, Powershot G3 X,  Sigma 10-20, EF 300/2.8 II, 70-200/4 IS.

langdonb

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2017, 12:03:45 AM »
I traded one of my 100-400mm IIs for a Sigma 150-600mm C last Thursday from the local shop after I borrowed and tested it. The Sigmas vary from copy to copy, some have tested much worse than the Tamron. This copy is off-scale at the top end in their quality control. It beats my 100-400 IIs at 400 in the centre and matches them at the edges at 400mm, and kills them at 560mm with 1.4xTCs when it is set to 600mm, where it is also ahead of my 300mm f/2.8 II + 2xTC.

The first problem was with the OS - it is all aver the place in the viewfinder. But, I got a Sigma dock today and fixed the problem using dynamic OS.

What other customizations would you recommend for bird and other photography?

Here are a couple of shots on the 5DS R at 600mm. The first is the best I have ever taken of a barnswallow - no sharpening at all from RAW. The second is a tiny 650x450 crop of my local peregrine falcon 48 m up a tower.
Wow Alan I am shocked to hear you say the Sigma is better than the 100-400 II with 1.4! I have had great experience with the canon with 1.4 on a 5DIII. While i would love to have a 150-600 to shoot without TC, I haven't seen reviews that prove that.

AlanF

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2017, 02:25:50 AM »
I traded one of my 100-400mm IIs for a Sigma 150-600mm C last Thursday from the local shop after I borrowed and tested it. The Sigmas vary from copy to copy, some have tested much worse than the Tamron. This copy is off-scale at the top end in their quality control. It beats my 100-400 IIs at 400 in the centre and matches them at the edges at 400mm, and kills them at 560mm with 1.4xTCs when it is set to 600mm, where it is also ahead of my 300mm f/2.8 II + 2xTC.

The first problem was with the OS - it is all aver the place in the viewfinder. But, I got a Sigma dock today and fixed the problem using dynamic OS.

What other customizations would you recommend for bird and other photography?

Here are a couple of shots on the 5DS R at 600mm. The first is the best I have ever taken of a barnswallow - no sharpening at all from RAW. The second is a tiny 650x450 crop of my local peregrine falcon 48 m up a tower.
Wow Alan I am shocked to hear you say the Sigma is better than the 100-400 II with 1.4! I have had great experience with the canon with 1.4 on a 5DIII. While i would love to have a 150-600 to shoot without TC, I haven't seen reviews that prove that.

All lenses vary from copy to copy, the big Tamron and Sigma zooms more than most. My copy is very good. Try one for yourself and find a good one, and don't believe reviews that just look at a single copy - you have to test yourself. 

If you want to see what the 1.4xTC does to the MTF of the 100-400mm II go to http://www.objektivtest.se/tester/canon-ef-100-400-mm-f45-56-l-is-ii-usm-test/ for numbers or http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/ISO-12233-Sample-Crops.aspx?Lens=972&Camera=979&Sample=0&FLI=4&API=1&LensComp=972&CameraComp=979&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=5&APIComp=0 (I don't take seriously comparisons of one lens with another but adding a TC is relatively sound).
5D IV, 5DS R, 400mm DO II, 1.4xTC III, 2xTC III, EF 1.8 STM,  EF 24-105, 100-400 II, EF-S 15-85, Sigma 150-600mm C, EOS-M5 15-45, f/2 22, 11-22, Samyang 8mm f/2.8 fisheye: sold 7D II, EOS-M, Powershot G3 X,  Sigma 10-20, EF 300/2.8 II, 70-200/4 IS.

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2017, 03:01:16 AM »
I traded one of my 100-400mm IIs for a Sigma 150-600mm C last Thursday from the local shop after I borrowed and tested it. The Sigmas vary from copy to copy, some have tested much worse than the Tamron. This copy is off-scale at the top end in their quality control. It beats my 100-400 IIs at 400 in the centre and matches them at the edges at 400mm, and kills them at 560mm with 1.4xTCs when it is set to 600mm, where it is also ahead of my 300mm f/2.8 II + 2xTC.

The first problem was with the OS - it is all aver the place in the viewfinder. But, I got a Sigma dock today and fixed the problem using dynamic OS.

What other customizations would you recommend for bird and other photography?

Here are a couple of shots on the 5DS R at 600mm. The first is the best I have ever taken of a barnswallow - no sharpening at all from RAW. The second is a tiny 650x450 crop of my local peregrine falcon 48 m up a tower.
Wow Alan I am shocked to hear you say the Sigma is better than the 100-400 II with 1.4! I have had great experience with the canon with 1.4 on a 5DIII. While i would love to have a 150-600 to shoot without TC, I haven't seen reviews that prove that.

All lenses vary from copy to copy, the big Tamron and Sigma zooms more than most. My copy is very good. Try one for yourself and find a good one, and don't believe reviews that just look at a single copy - you have to test yourself. 

If you want to see what the 1.4xTC does to the MTF of the 100-400mm II go to http://www.objektivtest.se/tester/canon-ef-100-400-mm-f45-56-l-is-ii-usm-test/ for numbers or http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/ISO-12233-Sample-Crops.aspx?Lens=972&Camera=979&Sample=0&FLI=4&API=1&LensComp=972&CameraComp=979&SampleComp=0&FLIComp=5&APIComp=0 (I don't take seriously comparisons of one lens with another but adding a TC is relatively sound).

Zooms are notorious for having a sample variance, and even if you get a exceptional one, it may get bumped and decentered. 

It was always my understanding that the 100-400 MK II was not better in the center than the MK I, but build, IS, and the edges were improved.    I've been bit by Sigma on several previous lenses I've owned, so I keep away, but the lure of a 600mm lens that I can hold is strong.

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2017, 03:01:16 AM »

JoSto

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2017, 05:47:01 AM »
I don't understand the pixel size of the barcode image. Do you mean that 8 pixels of the barcode = 1 pixel of the original image?


No. Im sorry I dind'tmade that clear. For the comparison I viewed the picture in my 4k Monitor. 1 Pix from the Camera = 8 Pix on my 4k Monitor. If you look at the Barcode-pic in full res you can see the Pixel-Grid.

I have to add that the Barcode is not exact straight up but a little bit tilted, so full pixel sharpness is physically not possible. Im sure Canons big whites are better but valure for price is incredible.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2017, 05:49:09 AM by JoSto »
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AlanF

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2017, 08:37:32 AM »
I don't understand the pixel size of the barcode image. Do you mean that 8 pixels of the barcode = 1 pixel of the original image?


No. Im sorry I dind'tmade that clear. For the comparison I viewed the picture in my 4k Monitor. 1 Pix from the Camera = 8 Pix on my 4k Monitor. If you look at the Barcode-pic in full res you can see the Pixel-Grid.

I have to add that the Barcode is not exact straight up but a little bit tilted, so full pixel sharpness is physically not possible. Im sure Canons big whites are better but valure for price is incredible.

It would be simpler to post a straight crop from the picture where 1 px = 1 px of the original rather than an upresolved image.
5D IV, 5DS R, 400mm DO II, 1.4xTC III, 2xTC III, EF 1.8 STM,  EF 24-105, 100-400 II, EF-S 15-85, Sigma 150-600mm C, EOS-M5 15-45, f/2 22, 11-22, Samyang 8mm f/2.8 fisheye: sold 7D II, EOS-M, Powershot G3 X,  Sigma 10-20, EF 300/2.8 II, 70-200/4 IS.

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Re: Sigma 150-600mm customization
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2017, 08:37:32 AM »