December 14, 2017, 08:08:26 PM

Author Topic: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera  (Read 12126 times)

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Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« on: January 02, 2017, 09:51:31 AM »
A breakthrough at Magic Lantern has opened up the possibility of shooting lossless 14bit DNG format on your Canon DSLR.

Magic Lantern developer a1ex has figured out how Canon decodes their CR2 files and modified the output to allow the camera to produce a lossless DNG file instead.

There is proof of concept over at the Magic Lantern forums as shooter Danne has posted a couple of lossless 14bit DNG files here.

There is no mention of when this feature may become available, but stay tuned.

image credit //  PetaPixel

« Last Edit: January 02, 2017, 12:28:13 PM by Canon Rumors »
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Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« on: January 02, 2017, 09:51:31 AM »

IglooEater

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2017, 10:23:21 AM »
I'll be showing my ignorance here, but is there some hard advantage of DNG over CR2?

HawkinsT

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2017, 10:55:04 AM »
I'll be showing my ignorance here, but is there some hard advantage of DNG over CR2?
Files are 15-20% smaller and image previews load faster in lightroom. The disadvantage is some metadata is discarded and dng files don't play well with some non-adobe software. There's also an argument that dng files are more future proof, but since old dng files are different to new dng files, I don't buy that argument; I'm sure I'll still be able to access/convert cr2 files in 20 years if it becomes and issue.

Basically if you never intend to move outside of Adobe's ecosystem then it's a nice choice for saving some hard drive space. With modern hardware the speed advantage will be minimal for most people, and there's the risk if you move to capture one or dxo (say) in the future, you'll have issues with camera profiles and lens correction not working accurately (despite the format being semi-supported).

vscd

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2017, 11:08:34 AM »
Canon should be proud of such an active community around the Canon-DSLRs... it's one of the reasons why I buy them. Sadly the new firmware of the 5DM3 destroys a lot of those capabilites ;(
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SkynetTX

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2017, 03:35:19 PM »
The sample images are not the best as they do not help to decide if it worths to shoot in DNG instead of CR2. I suppose the white balance was not set correctly on the cat's picture as it seems it was taken with automatic wb instead of tungsten. The second one is too dark for me. My second problem is that important information is missing from the exif: there's no aperture, no ISO speed and no shutter speed so I don't know what ISO speed was the photo taken with and if it has been denoised or not.

3kramd5

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2017, 05:10:55 PM »
The sample images are not the best as they do not help to decide if it worths to shoot in DNG instead of CR2.

They aren't intended to - it's a proof of concept.

In any case, the decision to shoot DNG in favor of CR2 shouldn't hinge on sample images.
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CADuke

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2017, 09:20:17 PM »
This would be awesome, as I don't use lightroom it takes several steps for me to to use Colorchecker Passport. First CR2 to DNG, second Use Colorchecker software to create DNP. Third convert DNP to ICC.

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2017, 09:20:17 PM »

Talley

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2017, 01:04:50 AM »
Would this mean 20%more buffer on high speed shooting?  ;D

tpatana

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2017, 02:52:54 AM »
Hmm, interesting, if it just helps somehow :)

I hope they crack 5D4 soon :)

jeffa4444

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2017, 07:39:09 AM »
I always back my raw files up to a NAS two bay drive mirrored. Separately I store my Adobe edited photos on a drive that's also backed-up to the cloud. The originals are simple RAW whereas my edited shots are either DNG. or JPegs (for camera club comps).
Its dangerous to have everything in DNG. and limit yourself for the future. Nokia was king of the castle, so was Kodak that maybe Adobe in the future.
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tron

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2017, 09:26:58 AM »
Canon should be proud of such an active community around the Canon-DSLRs... it's one of the reasons why I buy them. Sadly the new firmware of the 5DM3 destroys a lot of those capabilites ;(
The latest firmware of 5D3 is useless. I have stayed with 1.2.3 and I enjoy Magic Lantern's functionality. To downgrade from 1.3.3 or 1.3.4 you have to use EOS utility though.

mihazero

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2017, 12:48:38 PM »
I don't know about you guys but my experiences with DNG are actually quite bad. Slow to decode and load. Took me forever to edit that one catalog I have converted to DNG. I have proper desktop i7 (not those mutilated mobile ones) with 32gb ram SSD and all that but still it was painfully slow. For comparison CR2 files are not like editing JPGs but its 3-4 fold faster then editing DNGs.

I congratulate team ML on new break thru and welcome any advancement they make.

LDS

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2017, 01:04:42 PM »
I'll be showing my ignorance here, but is there some hard advantage of DNG over CR2?

You don't need to upgrade PS/LR to read files from a new camera <G> Just, you'd need Magic Lantern to add it to new cameras, not older ones...

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2017, 01:04:42 PM »

LDS

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2017, 01:07:17 PM »
Would this mean 20%more buffer on high speed shooting?  ;D

Maybe, but if the DNG compression algorithm requires more processor power and/or memory, it could slow down things as well. Only tests could tell. Sometimes larger is better, sometimes it is not.

infared

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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2017, 04:08:58 PM »
This is a very interesting conversation and interesting information....hmmmmmm.....
So ....what ....there will be an update to Magic Lantern some time in the near future?
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Re: Magic Lantern Lets You Shoot Lossless 14bit DNG in-Camera
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2017, 04:08:58 PM »