October 23, 2017, 07:41:45 AM

Author Topic: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]  (Read 31270 times)

yoms

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #90 on: September 19, 2017, 06:31:02 AM »
I re-up this topic.
Any more news about this lens? I'm really looking forward to it...

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #90 on: September 19, 2017, 06:31:02 AM »

craiglove

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #91 on: September 23, 2017, 11:44:59 PM »
I preordered the new 85mm but immediately thought that the 135 would be the first one that needed IS. I shoot a lot of music in dark clubs and love both my 85mm f1.8 and 135mm f2. My 85 is a great lens but would hold out for the 135 with the IS as it is much more needed at the longer focal length. I will be thrilled to see both although the 85 looks a bit hefty at two pounds...

ahsanford

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #92 on: September 24, 2017, 02:12:10 AM »
I preordered the new 85mm but immediately thought that the 135 would be the first one that needed IS. I shoot a lot of music in dark clubs and love both my 85mm f1.8 and 135mm f2. My 85 is a great lens but would hold out for the 135 with the IS as it is much more needed at the longer focal length. I will be thrilled to see both although the 85 looks a bit hefty at two pounds...

It'll help in dark clubs provided no one is moving.  In that environment, one would think true speed (f/1.4) is better than 'virtual' speed (i.e. f/2 IS) if moving subjects are involved, right?

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GMCPhotographics

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #93 on: September 24, 2017, 04:53:05 AM »
I preordered the new 85mm but immediately thought that the 135 would be the first one that needed IS. I shoot a lot of music in dark clubs and love both my 85mm f1.8 and 135mm f2. My 85 is a great lens but would hold out for the 135 with the IS as it is much more needed at the longer focal length. I will be thrilled to see both although the 85 looks a bit hefty at two pounds...

It'll help in dark clubs provided no one is moving.  In that environment, one would think true speed (f/1.4) is better than 'virtual' speed (i.e. f/2 IS) if moving subjects are involved, right?

- A

My own personal golden rule for wedding photography is that any shutter speed below 1/50th isn't going to work due to people moving. The just of the 85mm f1.2 is the bright aperture combined with a shooting speed of 1/80th. The problem of the current 135mm f2 L is the less bright aperture and the need to shoot at 1/125th make the lens far less versatile and usable in lower light levels. Effectively, you loose over a stop due to the aperture and you loose just under a stop due to the increased shutter speed (from 1/80th to 1/125th). But a good IS unit should allow the shutter speed to drop to (hopefully) 1/50th sec... that does help a lot. Just over a stop. So the new 135 LIS could potentially come lot closer to the working light levels of the 85IIL, which would be nice because it's a really nice focal length. It would also allow me the option of taking the 135 LIS or a 70-200 f2.8 LIS, giving me options on the day depending on weather and venue brightness.   

The issue I have with the 85mm f1.4 LIS is that the IS unit isn't going to offer me much until I get to my lowest usable shutter speed of 1/50th. So I loose 1/3 stop in aperture but gain 2/3 stop shutter speed. So i only really gain 1/3 stop over all...not a lot more.   

So I have to say that I'm more excited about the 135LIS than I am about th 85LIS

SecureGSM

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #94 on: September 24, 2017, 04:53:55 AM »
At 135mm focal length, IS would really help shooting stage at 1/60s for example, camera shake would be more of an issue than your subject slowly moving ;)

 

It'll help in dark clubs provided no one is moving.  In that environment, one would think true speed (f/1.4) is better than 'virtual' speed (i.e. f/2 IS) if moving subjects are involved, right?

- A

SecureGSM

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #95 on: September 24, 2017, 04:58:16 AM »
at 85mm and non-stabilised I cannot really shoot slower than 1/100s with 5D IV. reciprocal rule does not work as well as with 20Mp sensors for me any longer.


... The issue I have with the 85mm f1.4 LIS is that the IS unit isn't going to offer me much until I get to my lowest usable shutter speed of 1/50th. So I lose 1/3 stop in aperture but gain 2/3 stop shutter speed. So i only really gain 1/3 stop over all...not a lot more.   

So I have to say that I'm more excited about the 135LIS than I am about th 85LIS
« Last Edit: September 24, 2017, 05:58:14 AM by SecureGSM »

CanonFanBoy

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #96 on: October 04, 2017, 05:14:23 PM »
Wondering what the chances are that this lens will be announced this year.
I can't list my gear. I'm too ashamed. Everything I have is crippled and obsolete.

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #96 on: October 04, 2017, 05:14:23 PM »

GMCPhotographics

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #97 on: October 05, 2017, 05:33:35 AM »
at 85mm and non-stabilised I cannot really shoot slower than 1/100s with 5D IV. reciprocal rule does not work as well as with 20Mp sensors for me any longer.


... The issue I have with the 85mm f1.4 LIS is that the IS unit isn't going to offer me much until I get to my lowest usable shutter speed of 1/50th. So I lose 1/3 stop in aperture but gain 2/3 stop shutter speed. So i only really gain 1/3 stop over all...not a lot more.   

So I have to say that I'm more excited about the 135LIS than I am about th 85LIS

I hear what you are saying.
For me, I have no particular use for a 50mp camera. For my wedding and portrait work, 25ish mp is more than plenty. For landscape work, I'm using a tripod and I'm extracting every nuance of sharpness and detail out of my images that just isn't possible without a tripod (even in half decent light levels). So while it would seem that a 50mp camera would be nice for that endeavour...I've found that a 25ish mp camera more than adequate for the max A1 prints I'm making. I have a pair of very nice A1 wall prints with plenty of detail and depth, one of which was shot using a lowly 5D classic.
So while hand holding is good and convenient, to get the most out of the sensor and the scene then a good tripod is usually the way to go.

SecureGSM

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #98 on: October 05, 2017, 06:02:13 AM »
sorry, 5D IV is a 30Mp camera. I am getting sharp shots with non-stabilised lens at Tmin= 1/(1.5 x Focal Length)
You mentioned that you shoot people at no slower 1/50s shutter speed. 85mm unstabilised lens at 1/80s may no longer work for you on 30Mp FF sensor. An extra stop or two of stabilisation would certainly take care of the issue.

Quote
.. The issue I have with the 85mm f1.4 LIS is that the IS unit isn't going to offer me much until I get to my lowest usable shutter speed of 1/50th. So I lose 1/3 stop in aperture but gain 2/3 stop shutter speed. So i only really gain 1/3 stop over all...not a lot more.   


I hear what you are saying.
For me, I have no particular use for a 50mp camera. For my wedding and portrait work, 25ish mp is more than plenty. For landscape work, I'm using a tripod and I'm extracting every nuance of sharpness and detail out of my images that just isn't possible without a tripod (even in half decent light levels). So while it would seem that a 50mp camera would be nice for that endeavour...I've found that a 25ish mp camera more than adequate for the max A1 prints I'm making. I have a pair of very nice A1 wall prints with plenty of detail and depth, one of which was shot using a lowly 5D classic.
So while hand holding is good and convenient, to get the most out of the sensor and the scene then a good tripod is usually the way to go.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2017, 06:04:36 AM by SecureGSM »

Maiaibing

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #99 on: October 11, 2017, 04:59:58 AM »
sorry, 5D IV is a 30Mp camera. I am getting sharp shots with non-stabilised lens at Tmin= 1/(1.5 x Focal Length)
You mentioned that you shoot people at no slower 1/50s shutter speed. 85mm unstabilised lens at 1/80s may no longer work for you on 30Mp FF sensor. An extra stop or two of stabilisation would certainly take care of the issue.
If it worked for him with 20 MPIX camera it'll work just as well with a 30 MPIX, 50 MPIX and 500 MPIX camera. There not a iota more motion blur. On the contrary - shutter devices are improving with newer high-MPIX cameras effectively reducing shutter-induced blur.

SecureGSM

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #100 on: October 11, 2017, 07:21:42 AM »
I beg to differ.. It is a common knowledge that old 1/focal length reciprocal rule is no longer  valid for Canon 5DsR camera. I can provide tons of evidence to support my claim..

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/canon-5ds-r/canon-5ds-r-field-test-part-i.htm

"... Watch that shutter speed
And speaking of technique, the high-resolution sensor also changes the game regarding the long-standing 1/focal length shutter speed "rule" -- a.k.a. the Reciprocal Rule -- which states that the minimum shutter speed required to avoid camera shake when shooting handheld is 1/focal length (i.e. 1/50s for a 50mm lens). With the Canon 5DS R, the individual pixels are so small that a much smaller amount of movement poses a risk for per-pixel blurring, so you'll need to account for this with a faster shutter speed -- perhaps even 1/(2x focal length)..."


sorry, 5D IV is a 30Mp camera. I am getting sharp shots with non-stabilised lens at Tmin= 1/(1.5 x Focal Length)
You mentioned that you shoot people at no slower 1/50s shutter speed. 85mm unstabilised lens at 1/80s may no longer work for you on 30Mp FF sensor. An extra stop or two of stabilisation would certainly take care of the issue.
If it worked for him with 20 MPIX camera it'll work just as well with a 30 MPIX, 50 MPIX and 500 MPIX camera. There not a iota more motion blur. On the contrary - shutter devices are improving with newer high-MPIX cameras effectively reducing shutter-induced blur.

Maximilian

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #101 on: October 11, 2017, 07:55:09 AM »
I beg to differ.. It is a common knowledge that old 1/focal length reciprocal rule is no longer  valid for Canon 5DsR camera. I can provide tons of evidence to support my claim..

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/canon-5ds-r/canon-5ds-r-field-test-part-i.htm

"... Watch that shutter speed
And speaking of technique, the high-resolution sensor also changes the game regarding the long-standing 1/focal length shutter speed "rule" -- a.k.a. the Reciprocal Rule -- which states that the minimum shutter speed required to avoid camera shake when shooting handheld is 1/focal length (i.e. 1/50s for a 50mm lens). With the Canon 5DS R, the individual pixels are so small that a much smaller amount of movement poses a risk for per-pixel blurring, so you'll need to account for this with a faster shutter speed -- perhaps even 1/(2x focal length)..."


sorry, 5D IV is a 30Mp camera. I am getting sharp shots with non-stabilised lens at Tmin= 1/(1.5 x Focal Length)
You mentioned that you shoot people at no slower 1/50s shutter speed. 85mm unstabilised lens at 1/80s may no longer work for you on 30Mp FF sensor. An extra stop or two of stabilisation would certainly take care of the issue.
If it worked for him with 20 MPIX camera it'll work just as well with a 30 MPIX, 50 MPIX and 500 MPIX camera. There not a iota more motion blur. On the contrary - shutter devices are improving with newer high-MPIX cameras effectively reducing shutter-induced blur.
I can concur with adapting that 1/FL rule.
I talked to a professional doing workshops on technique. He said to me, that this old 1/FL rule was valid in the times of 135 film.
With FF DSLRs above 20 MP he today is teaching a 1/(2xFL) rule already and for those MP beasts above 40 MP he is recommending 1/(4xFL) especially if the subject is moving. He is doing a lot of wildlife, animal an zoo workshops and as he is cooperation with a local store he has access to almost any brand and equipment he likes.
So I would put my money on this opinion, too.
sometimes you have to close your eyes to see properly.

privatebydesign

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #102 on: October 11, 2017, 07:55:30 AM »
I beg to differ.. It is a common knowledge that old 1/focal length reciprocal rule is no longer  valid for Canon 5DsR camera. I can provide tons of evidence to support my claim..

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/canon-5ds-r/canon-5ds-r-field-test-part-i.htm

"... Watch that shutter speed
And speaking of technique, the high-resolution sensor also changes the game regarding the long-standing 1/focal length shutter speed "rule" -- a.k.a. the Reciprocal Rule -- which states that the minimum shutter speed required to avoid camera shake when shooting handheld is 1/focal length (i.e. 1/50s for a 50mm lens). With the Canon 5DS R, the individual pixels are so small that a much smaller amount of movement poses a risk for per-pixel blurring, so you'll need to account for this with a faster shutter speed -- perhaps even 1/(2x focal length)..."


sorry, 5D IV is a 30Mp camera. I am getting sharp shots with non-stabilised lens at Tmin= 1/(1.5 x Focal Length)
You mentioned that you shoot people at no slower 1/50s shutter speed. 85mm unstabilised lens at 1/80s may no longer work for you on 30Mp FF sensor. An extra stop or two of stabilisation would certainly take care of the issue.
If it worked for him with 20 MPIX camera it'll work just as well with a 30 MPIX, 50 MPIX and 500 MPIX camera. There not a iota more motion blur. On the contrary - shutter devices are improving with newer high-MPIX cameras effectively reducing shutter-induced blur.

It all depends on your output for goodness sake.

If you compare a 50MP image to a 20MP image at the same size the shake is exactly the same. If you compare at pixel size the 50MP is enlarged more so the shake is more apparent.

This is a simple fact and it can be looked at two ways.
1: The only 'fair comparison' is two images the same size.
2: There is no point in a higher MP sensor if you don't want pixel level sharpness.

Both are valid and it really depends on your uses.
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #102 on: October 11, 2017, 07:55:30 AM »

SecureGSM

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #103 on: October 11, 2017, 08:21:36 AM »
PBD,

ok, I will make it really simple:

images shot on 5D IV with 70mm non stabilised lens at 1/50s are _evidently_ less sharp than the same but at 1/150 sec when evaluated at 1:1 ( pixel level) on decent size screen.  True or not? I say true and I have a very strong evidence to support my claim. let alone shooting with 85mm lens at 1/50s...

p.s. what is the point of shooting huge 50 mp files if you will have to downsample them down to 20Mp size just to equalise image sharpness with an image natively shot on 20Mp camera? some kind of weird logic. don't you think?




I beg to differ.. It is a common knowledge that old 1/focal length reciprocal rule is no longer  valid for Canon 5DsR camera. I can provide tons of evidence to support my claim..

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/canon-5ds-r/canon-5ds-r-field-test-part-i.htm

"... Watch that shutter speed
And speaking of technique, the high-resolution sensor also changes the game regarding the long-standing 1/focal length shutter speed "rule" -- a.k.a. the Reciprocal Rule -- which states that the minimum shutter speed required to avoid camera shake when shooting handheld is 1/focal length (i.e. 1/50s for a 50mm lens). With the Canon 5DS R, the individual pixels are so small that a much smaller amount of movement poses a risk for per-pixel blurring, so you'll need to account for this with a faster shutter speed -- perhaps even 1/(2x focal length)..."


sorry, 5D IV is a 30Mp camera. I am getting sharp shots with non-stabilised lens at Tmin= 1/(1.5 x Focal Length)
You mentioned that you shoot people at no slower 1/50s shutter speed. 85mm unstabilised lens at 1/80s may no longer work for you on 30Mp FF sensor. An extra stop or two of stabilisation would certainly take care of the issue.
If it worked for him with 20 MPIX camera it'll work just as well with a 30 MPIX, 50 MPIX and 500 MPIX camera. There not a iota more motion blur. On the contrary - shutter devices are improving with newer high-MPIX cameras effectively reducing shutter-induced blur.

It all depends on your output for goodness sake.

If you compare a 50MP image to a 20MP image at the same size the shake is exactly the same. If you compare at pixel size the 50MP is enlarged more so the shake is more apparent.

This is a simple fact and it can be looked at two ways.
1: The only 'fair comparison' is two images the same size.
2: There is no point in a higher MP sensor if you don't want pixel level sharpness.

Both are valid and it really depends on your uses.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2017, 10:03:18 AM by SecureGSM »

Jopa

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #104 on: October 11, 2017, 11:26:45 AM »
PBD,

ok, I will make it really simple:

images shot on 5D IV with 70mm non stabilised lens at 1/50s are _evidently_ less sharp than the same but at 1/150 sec when evaluated at 1:1 ( pixel level) on decent size screen.  True or not? I say true and I have a very strong evidence to support my claim. let alone shooting with 85mm lens at 1/50s...

p.s. what is the point of shooting huge 50 mp files if you will have to downsample them down to 20Mp size just to equalise image sharpness with an image natively shot on 20Mp camera? some kind of weird logic. don't you think?

Indeed. That's why I still have a hope to see a 24-70 f/2.8L IS one day...

I remember when I first got the A7r after shooting a year with my A99 (IBIS) I was really surprised I can't get sharp shots with the 55mm f/1.8 even at 1/50s :)

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS Coming in 2017 [CR2]
« Reply #104 on: October 11, 2017, 11:26:45 AM »