December 10, 2017, 09:26:37 PM

Author Topic: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]  (Read 9804 times)

ahsanford

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2017, 06:34:14 PM »
On another note, the lens tip sharpness chart from the 135L seems way off, compared to my experience. I am shure the 135ART is better, but the difference is nothing like those charts seems to indicate.

Agree, and it may have something to do with how the files are generated on the 1Ds3 vs. the 5D3 in that comparison.

For another source that goes with images instead of numbers, both on a 5DS R:

Wide open:  it is not close

Canon at f/2.8 vs. Sigma wide open:  Getting closer, but I still take the Sigma there.  (Don't let the 135L's lowered vignetting at that aperture mask the sharpness differences.)

Canon at f/4 vs. Sigma wide open:  Almost the same to me, but the Sigma's better in the corners to my eyes.

Canon at f/5.6 vs. Sigma wide open:  Just about identical (other than vignetting of course).

I would take no solace in the 135L stopping down brilliantly unless you're shooting landscapes with it (which I'm sure some do).  But if you are ponying up the money / trouble to be one stop faster than a 70-200 f/2.8, presumably for portraiture, one imagines you probably want to use this lens towards that wide open end.

Again, sharpness isn't everything, but you have to tip your cap to Sigma on this front.

- A

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: November 11, 2017, 06:34:14 PM »

captainkanji

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #31 on: November 11, 2017, 06:50:52 PM »
I hope they don’t sacrifice micro contrast for sharpness. The Sigma is great for taking crime scene photos. I love the 135 L’s look.
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michi

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #32 on: November 11, 2017, 08:13:04 PM »

If bokeh is your thing, one of the 85Ls or the 135L would likely be the move.  If cost constrained, look at the non-L 85 f/1.8 (a common first portrait lens for FF-ers) and 100 f/2 (the lens no one talks about).

- A

I have had the EF 85mm 1.8 since the 90's.  I have a love hate relationship with it.  AF is completely unreliable although the 5DIV seems to do much better with it than all my prior cameras.  I'm leaning more towards 85mm, so it will have to be either the old L or the new one.  I'll wait and watch to see some more reviews about the new one.

Antono Refa

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #33 on: November 11, 2017, 11:46:53 PM »
Too late... the Sigma 135 Art is superb....

It's so late. Anyone who might have bought a 135mm prime in the next decade already bought the Sigma Art. Actually, Sigma has put the production line in Naphthalene, knowing demand is satisfied for years to come.

CanonFanBoy

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #34 on: November 12, 2017, 03:00:26 AM »
Cue people complaining it's not f/1.8 in 3, 2, 1...

Yes! I would complain!

Sigma & Sony have a f/1.8 with image stabilized equivalent.

Nikon has the NIKKOR 105mm with a f/1.4!
I'd prefer the more compact size of a f/2.0 at this FL.

Yes, but the difference between f/2 & f/1.8 IS huge. Frankly, I don't know how I have survived at f/2. Maybe we should start a petition? 100 signatures should be enough to get Canon to make this an f/1.8 lens. Stupid Canon. Canon is doomed.  ;)  ::)
5D Mark III, Canon A-1, Voigtlander Vito, Tamron SP 15-30 f/2.8 Di VC, 24-70 F/2.8L II, 70-200 f/2.8L IS II, 35 f/1.4L II, 135 f/2L, Helios 58 f/2 (x3), Canon FD 50 f/1.8, 600EX-RT (x7), Streaklight 360ws. All of it was obsolete before I bought it and no longer take good photos.

CanonFanBoy

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #35 on: November 12, 2017, 03:11:57 AM »
Honestly, in a sequel to the 135L, a few things come to mind:

  • After this new one drops, tip your cap to a legendary run for the 135L.  I liken it to a hall of fame player with a very long career at an underappreciated position on the field -- like an offensive lineman in football, catcher in baseball, a holding midfielder in soccer: they are never on the highlight reel, but you could not imagine your team without them. 

  • This lens was always deemed so sharp that it didn't need an update for so long.  But I think the jump from 22 to 50 MP with the 5DS is a really big deal, and this conversation we're having about sharpness being an improvement area in a lens where sharpness was its hallmark is going to happen again with other lenses we love soon -- the 70-200 f/2.8L IS II comes to mind.

  • I always thought of the 200mm f/2.8L II as the 'brother' of this lens.  They came out about the same time, and the 200 f/2.8L II looks almost like it was made from strapping an extender to a 135L (see pic).  Yet while the 135L had that extra stop and sharpness (at the time) vs. earlier 70-200L lenses, the 200 f/2.8L II was all but eclipsed by the 70-200 zooms because it was only a shade sharper, not any quicker and lacked IS.  So I wonder if it will just be the 135L being replaced or if we get a 200 f/2.8L III as well (my money is on the former).

  • Any chance Canon keeps the original 135L in production alonside a pricier newer IS version rather than discontinue it?  Stranger things have happened.

Curious to hear everyone's thoughts.

- A

Looking at charts and reading reviews is nice, but you've already indicated that you don't own and have not rented the 135 f/2L. Your posts are good, but you should at least rent and try the lens instead of regurgitating the work of others. ;) That's a lot of authoritative sounding posts about the older lens from someone who's never used it. I've read a recent post of yours where you ask whether the quality of the old lens is as good as people say. So, have you ever used it?
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ahsanford

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: November 12, 2017, 04:41:12 AM »
Looking at charts and reading reviews is nice, but you've already indicated that you don't own and have not rented the 135 f/2L. Your posts are good, but you should at least rent and try the lens instead of regurgitating the work of others. ;) That's a lot of authoritative sounding posts about the older lens from someone who's never used it. I've read a recent post of yours where you ask whether the quality of the old lens is as good as people say. So, have you ever used it?

Never, actually.  I've been intrigued about it but between my 100L and 70-200 2.8 I haven't been able to convince myself that I need it.  I've had a price watch up on CPW for some time for a refurb and just haven't felt the need to pull the trigger.  But the lens is interesting to me and I may try/buy one someday... which is kind of why I'm on this thread.

You can call my offerings to this thread authoritative all you want, but I just call it participating in a discussion -- care to join us?  Or were there other troubling parts of my photography CV that warrant another charming post like that one above?

- A
« Last Edit: November 12, 2017, 04:43:44 AM by ahsanford »

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: November 12, 2017, 04:41:12 AM »

Maiaibing

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #37 on: November 12, 2017, 06:55:31 AM »
One word for success "Apodization".

This feature alone could make a new Canon 135L portrait lens a sales success as it would introduce a unique lens to Canon's line-up which cannot be manipulated digitally in any way (like soft focus can). Fuji has achieved this feat (AF and apodization together), so we know it can be done.

IS makes perfect sense with an apodization lens. It would also fit the rumour that Canon is planning a new 135L as a portrait lens.

Berowne

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #38 on: November 12, 2017, 09:09:13 AM »

If bokeh is your thing, one of the 85Ls or the 135L would likely be the move.  If cost constrained, look at the non-L 85 f/1.8 (a common first portrait lens for FF-ers) and 100 f/2 (the lens no one talks about).

- A

I have had the EF 85mm 1.8 since the 90's.  I have a love hate relationship with it.  AF is completely unreliable although the 5DIV seems to do much better with it than all my prior cameras.  I'm leaning more towards 85mm, so it will have to be either the old L or the new one.  I'll wait and watch to see some more reviews about the new one.


Re unreliable AF of the EF 85/1.8 - I made the same experience. Nevertheless, if AF hits, it is pin sharp even wide open.
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snoke

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #39 on: November 12, 2017, 09:09:28 AM »
Need this lens.

Tripod not possible, 1/15, ISO 3200, f/2.2 but cannot hold camera still.
4 stop IS big help.

michi

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #40 on: November 12, 2017, 09:56:47 AM »

Re unreliable AF of the EF 85/1.8 - I made the same experience. Nevertheless, if AF hits, it is pin sharp even wide open.

Yes, the few shots where the AF nails it, this lens produces amazing shots.  It really is a shame they didn't make a version II with a better AF module or whatever it takes to make AF work better.  I would gladly pay $600 for a II lens if I knew AF would nail it every time.

Luds34

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #41 on: November 12, 2017, 10:49:49 AM »
The Sigma is not stabilized.   And it is still 80% the weight of a 70-200 f/2.8 zoom!

IMHO, a 135 prime needs to be sharper/creamier/shorter/lighter than the 70-200 f/2.8 zoom that so many folks already own or it will be relegated to niche use status. ... which is kind of where the 135L has sat since the 70-200 f/2.8L IS II came out. 

- A

I agree with this.

I shoot the 70-200 when I'm not sure of what I'm exactly shooting and want the zoom versatility. If I'm stepping out to shoot a portrait shot I reach for the 135 every time as it is (arguably) the ultimate portrait lens.

Luds34

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: November 12, 2017, 11:11:11 AM »
I'm totally uninterested in how sharp it is; instead they must pay attention to the rendering. I have tried (borrowed never owned) the Zeiss 135/2 as well as the Sigma 135. I prefer the rendering of the Canon over the other two and I know that's a completely subjective and rather controversial to say here but I just think it renders in a pleasing way, especially the background. I use it on a 5DS and it is plenty sharp wide open. Is the Zeiss sharper? Yes. Will anybody in the real world ever notice the difference? No. The 135L has such a beautiful bokeh, such lovely colours, I really would just love to see it slightly improved wherever they can, especially if we can have IS and leave it at that. If the bokeh gets compromised then I am not interested, however sharp they make it.

I fear the constant demand for "more sharpness" can sometimes lead lens designers astray. Sigma's 50mm Art for example is an amazingly sharp 50mm lens but the old 50mm DG EX (the Sigmalux as it was called) had a nicer rendering and bokeh and produces photos eerily similar to Nikon's legendary Noct 58/1.2.

So for once, I rather hope they don't change too much!

Count me in on the 135L being "sharp enough". It is actually quite sharp and like any other lens in this category the DOF is quite narrow shooting wide open. While the AF on this lens is incredibly accurate (my copy anyway) it just takes a slight subject movement/shift to throw off focus and lead to softer image. I enjoy the rendering, out of focus highlights etc with this lens. It does have a little bit of "magic" to the images it produces.

As a once owner of the old Sigma 50mm EX I completely agree on the images produced, rendering of that lens as well. The AF was just too slow for run and gun shooting that I wanted to use the FL with. And while the centerpoint was consistent, outer AF points never seemed to work quite right. With that said I never replaced the 50mm focal length (still waiting on Canon here I guess for a consumer level, affordable prime) and do miss this lens from time to time.

Total thread hi-jacking (sorry) but a couple shots of the old EX 50, memory lane time.

20150610-IMG_1913-M by Ryan Ludwig, on Flickr

It's my birthday and I can cry if I want to by Ryan Ludwig, on Flickr

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: November 12, 2017, 11:11:11 AM »

Dholai

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #43 on: November 12, 2017, 12:31:15 PM »
I have compared the following 4 lenses in identical settings in one session.
1) Canon 135 F2
2) sigma Art 135 F1.8
3) Canon 70-200 F 2.8L MK II
4) Zeiss Milvus 135 F2

In my opinion-

Zeiss is first and far ahead. Nothing comes closer.
Sigma and Canon are close second. Sigma may be a tad better
Canon 70-200 is a distant last.

This is JUST the image quality(IQ) viewed on a 30 inches 4K color calibrated monitor- because to me, only IQ matters!
Overeating may or may not kill you but over processing will definitely kill your images.

MayaTlab

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: November 12, 2017, 02:24:26 PM »
Meanwhile I'm still looking for modern Canon mid-range primes above 35mm...

Personally at 135mm I could easily do with an f4 lens - but with great bokeh and sharp / blur transitions.

Dear Mr Canon, there's at least 500 euros in my bank account for each of the following lenses :

- 50mm f/nofasterthanf2 internalfocusfaststuff maybeIS with flat field of focus, low astigmatism, low CA, great bokeh, good transitions blur / sharp, and reasonable (but not necessarily through the roof) definition wide open.
- 85mm f/nofasterthanf2 internalfocusfaststuff maybeIS with flat field of focus, low astigmatism, low CA, great bokeh, good transitions blur / sharp, and reasonable (but not necessarily through the roof) definition wide open.
- 100mm macro f/nofasterthanf4 internalfocusfaststuff maybeIS with flat field of focus, low astigmatism, low CA, great bokeh, good transitions blur / sharp, and reasonable (but not necessarily through the roof) definition wide open.
- 135mm f/nofasterthanf4 internalfocusfaststuff maybeIS with flat field of focus, low astigmatism, low CA, great bokeh, good transitions blur / sharp, and reasonable (but not necessarily through the roof) definition wide open.

Of course that's never going to happen.

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Re: Canon EF 135mm f/2L IS USM Coming First Half of 2018 [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: November 12, 2017, 02:24:26 PM »