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Author Topic: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]  (Read 35496 times)

lol

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2012, 07:42:09 AM »
I don't care if the next flagship APS-C body is called 70D or 7D2, as long as it is built upon the current 7D and not the 60D. Assuming they go this route, I think there is more marketing value in keeping the 7D name than reverting to 70D though.

I don't think they can afford to revert to the 9 point AF system though regardless, unless the 5D3 offers wide area f/8 AF, which isn't possible even on any 1D series body. The 7D seems to be massively popular, and it would be suicide not to provide a functional successor for it.

Comparing against the 5D2 is kinda pointless though. The 5D2 is basically a 50D with an overgrown sensor. It feels like a toy compared to the 7D. So the 5D3 would at a minimum need to match the 7D build if it is going to replace a 7D in any way.
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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2012, 07:42:09 AM »

GL

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2012, 07:46:01 AM »
Without fanning the flames of the "7D vs 5D2" debate going on here, I must say, as a wedding/portrait pro that uses a 5D2 as my main body with the 7D as second body/backup, and who uses both for professional video films, you simply can't compare the IQ of the 7D with what the 5D2 can do at any ISO over 400.

Nevermind the noise (which is fairly well controlled on the 7D at up to ISO 800/1000), the AWB and skin tones of the 5D2 just hit the spot every time, whereas (especially for video) we end up white balance shifting the 7D every single time.

Now if I were a bird/sport shooter that would be different, and when I just need the reach with decent IQ, I go to the 7D first. But to say the 7D can match the 5D2 - it simply can't - not for the work I do anyway.

Now 5D2 focus, shutter lag, shutter noise, these are other issue altogether... the 7D is a real upgrade in each of these, which is why a FF 5D/7D merge makes so much sense!


DzPhotography

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2012, 07:50:35 AM »
I just wanna state my humble opinion and not flame anyone, just to be clear from the start.

Altho' I love my 7D, it doesn't come close to IQ and ISO performance of the 5DMkII (or any other FF).

A FF with approx. the same MP count as an APS-C will always, I repeat always deliver better pics, because the pixel density is much less and therefore will not have as much overflow as the APS-C in the higher ISO settings.

Just go out and try to shoot a concert without flash with both a 5DMkII and a 7D (and the same lenses ofcourse) at ISO's of 1600-3200 and you'll understand what I'm talking about  ;)
« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 07:53:20 AM by DzPhotography »
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JR

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #33 on: February 14, 2012, 07:53:43 AM »
While I am not in the market for a 7DmkII myself, I find this rumor a bit odd indeed.  With the APS-H sensor gone from the line-up, I dont see how Canon can leave the crop sensor side of the market unaddressed with simply a replacement of the 60D?!?!?  Nikon is in a bit of a different situation because they can have their FF body crop such that we have more reach, but Canon does not have this to my knowledge.  I even heard of a D400 in the way from Nikon...

We are surely missing the full picture here no?  There is a still market for pro-level APS-C, does it?

Jacques
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nicku

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #34 on: February 14, 2012, 07:59:37 AM »


We are surely missing the full picture here no?  There is a still market for pro-level APS-C, does it?

Jacques

A very big one...

If 7D had  1 stop better ISO quality at ISO 100 and 200 a had chose  7D. but IQ is more important than every other think that a Canon bodies can have.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 08:03:59 AM by nicku »

Maui5150

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #35 on: February 14, 2012, 08:17:53 AM »
I think Canon is consolidating their lines slightly which makes sense.

When you look at the previous landscape of the lines (with latest MK #s eliminated)

1Ds
1DMK
5DMK
7D
60D
T3i

There is just a huge overlap, especially in the Crop body.  Yes, the 7D was the king of the APS-C, but the total gap between 7D - 60D - and T3i in terms of features, performance, etc was not that great and a $1000 difference... A lot of it came down to the quality of the body as the biggest differences, along with AF and FPS

So what I see

1Dx (and possibly a 1DsX) as the Pro body line.  $6500 Body

5DMKIII  - The Mid Level Pro - Solid all around, $3000 Body - Really becomes a economic win, really a merging of the 5DMKII and 7D lines, so instead of paying $4200 for a 7D and 5D MKII, you save $800 - $1000 and have it all in one body.  Yes, you lose the crop reach, but this will be a SOLID all around camera

2D/3D/4D - This will be the high MP beast.  It is coming, and my guess is Canon is tweaking the hell out of it... In the corporate minds, better to be a few months slower and have a better body for several years, than rush and be mediocre.

70D - Seriously Upgraded line.  Top of the Crop Prosumer Body.  Better construction.  Weather Sealing, this becomes the $1500 - $1700 crop body, probably 18MP still, maybe up to 21MP, Faster FPS, and likely the same AF. 

Rebel T4i - Top Consumer Body.  Same overall sensor as the 70D, great video, less bells and whistles, plastic body, slower FPS, less ISO and likely not as good AF.

The nature of the shift is really 6 lines into 4 lines, or 5 lines into 4 depending on how you look at the 1Ds/1DMK line. 

This is not a bad thing.  I think what this means is an upgrade to the xxD line, and by focusing these bodies a little more, it takes some of the confusion away especially with the T3i / 60D / 7D which are 3 fairly close bodies within $800 - $900 of each other, which then becomes 2 Bodies with in the same range. 

One less body line allows Canon to focus on better improvements for their next generation as well as improve their lenses with more resources. 

dilbert

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: February 14, 2012, 08:18:47 AM »
Finally Canon wakes up.

They've been dumbing down the xxD to bring down the price, creating a hole for the 7D.

If Canon move the xxD back to where the 7D was (70D replacing 7D seems kind of neat), or close there to, then that gives Canon the option of pulling all of its DSLRs up in pricing.

Why would they do that?

How about to make room for a mirrorless at the bottom.

If the 7D evaporates, then we might end up seeing:
xxD - ~$1500-$1700 (or more?)
xxxD - ~$1000-$1200
xxxxD - sub $1000
... or even xxxxD disappears and is replaced by a body like that of the NEX-5 or 7.

With the 7D, they had one too many DSLRs in their lineup but it was required as an offensive move against the Nikon D300(s) whilst they sorted out their overall plan.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 08:20:47 AM by dilbert »

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #36 on: February 14, 2012, 08:18:47 AM »

Dbleznak

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #37 on: February 14, 2012, 08:26:08 AM »
The only thing I want is the best pro body for my 17-55 2.8 IS. Right now, its still the 7D, right?

candyman

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #38 on: February 14, 2012, 08:30:19 AM »
The only thing I want is the best pro body for my 17-55 2.8 IS. Right now, its still the 7D, right?


The difference in IQ between 600D, 60D en 7D is not big. Same sensor. Maybe very small difference in terms of ISO noise though I am not sure.


A new camera with new APS-C sensor will for sure give better IQ with your 17-55 2.8.
Not likely this lens wil be updated soon
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BXL

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #39 on: February 14, 2012, 08:39:02 AM »
Because the true succession was 40D -> 50D -> 7D

The 60D is closer to a "slightly improved" 600D. Is Canon allowing Nikon to be alone? Hardly.
I don't agree... true, the 60D lost some minor features of the 50D but the gap between those two cameras is very small compared to the 7D.

The xxD line has 9 cross-type AF points, compared to the 7D with it's 19 cross-type AF points. So, if a 70D would be the successor of the 7D, what type of AF will it get? An improved version of the 40/50/60D or an improved version of the 19 cross-type AF of the 7D?

And if this would be the case and the 70D would replace both 60D and 7D, which means also that the 70D will be priced similar to the 7D (~1500 US$), than there is a hugh gab between the 60D/7D successor and the xxx/rebel product line. I don't believe that the xxx/rebel line (1 cross-type AF point) will receive the AF of the xxD product line and I don't believe that canon will leave such a gab in its product portfolio.

So if those rumors are true, then something has to fill the gap. And don't forget, the rebel name is only used in the US/Canada. In other markets the rebel name is unknown.
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DzPhotography

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #40 on: February 14, 2012, 08:52:51 AM »
The only thing I want is the best pro body for my 17-55 2.8 IS. Right now, its still the 7D, right?


The difference in IQ between 600D, 60D en 7D is not big. Same sensor. Maybe very small difference in terms of ISO noise though I am not sure.


A new camera with new APS-C sensor will for sure give better IQ with your 17-55 2.8.
Not likely this lens wil be updated soon
but right now, as Dbleznak asked, it's still the 7D... ::)
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AprilForever

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #41 on: February 14, 2012, 09:17:01 AM »
I want an APS-C 7D MK II. I don't want it called different names, nor do I want it's sensor size meddled with.

This is a very serious and emotional thing for me and many 7D users.
What is truth?

A.W.Gonya

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: February 14, 2012, 09:30:12 AM »
I have a 20D, a 50D and now a 7D, if anyone was a XXD owner before moving to the 7D you know what it really is. 

If the next 7D becomes the 70D I hope it retains the construction and AF of the current 7D.   

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #42 on: February 14, 2012, 09:30:12 AM »

maxxevv

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #43 on: February 14, 2012, 09:32:19 AM »
Just a thought ... what if the 7D successor was an APS-H camera that they somehow made it compatible with EF-S lenses ?   :P

And they grafted the AF from the 1Div, with some '7D-ish' wrappings' rather than offering the latest and greatest from the 1Dx?  It would create an awesome camera, with a clear upgrade path for the APS-C users as well a clear market segment ? 

It might be so rather than completely killing off the 7D since it has been such a great seller.

Think about it :

- APS-H with 20+/- MP (possibly recycle the 1D-IV sensor)
- EF-S lens compatible ( Some modification to the standard APS-H sized mirror could possibly allow that )
- 7-8fps
- ISO up to 12800
- 1D-IV AF with additional 7D implementions (zoning ??), but simplified somewhat compared to 1D-IV
- No f/8 AF points
- Carrying all the bells and whistles of the 7D
- Separate grip
- Single Card
- Weather sealed
- $3200-$3800

I think it would sell in heaps !   8)

Possible ???

candyman

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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: February 14, 2012, 09:38:20 AM »
The only thing I want is the best pro body for my 17-55 2.8 IS. Right now, its still the 7D, right?



The difference in IQ between 600D, 60D en 7D is not big. Same sensor. Maybe very small difference in terms of ISO noise though I am not sure.


A new camera with new APS-C sensor will for sure give better IQ with your 17-55 2.8.
Not likely this lens wil be updated soon
but right now, as Dbleznak asked, it's still the 7D... ::)



I would say so.
DxOMark does not have a comparison of the Canon 17-55 2.8 with a Canon 60D or 600D
It only tested with the 7D (and older APS-C Canon camera's)
Here is the link: http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/Lenses/Camera-Lens-Database/Canon/EF-S-17-55-f-2.8-IS-USM/(camera)/619/(cameraname)/CANON-EOS-7D
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Re: No 7D Mark II? [CR1]
« Reply #44 on: February 14, 2012, 09:38:20 AM »