December 12, 2017, 05:09:39 PM

Author Topic: Sigma 85 looks better in corners  (Read 6016 times)

DaviSto

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #30 on: November 21, 2017, 05:44:16 PM »
Just a happy 85 IS camper comment here, I’m excited, how on earth did I ever use a 135, 100 and 85 without IS?? ;D

I blame my declining steadiness on age and parenthood.  Especially parenthood.  We now have a 1 year old who climbs like a monkey, moves chairs to get on tables, and will happily wave around a steak knife or a camera when found.  So, yes, IS has become an urgent need!
Well if your 1-year old gives you enough scares to cause you a constant nervous tremor, I get the usefulness of IS.  If he/she is just scooting about all over the place and hasn't yet given you the 'shakes', I don't see what possible advantage there would be in IS.  Widest possible aperture will help ... or just shoot with flash.

Edit: In fairness and on reflection, my own child of only slightly greater vintage has been very easy on the knife and camera juggling thing ... "It's a 'tool', it's not a 'toy'", he dutifully tells his friends ... makes me wince a little, since I put the words into his mouth.  But he does abide by that mantra ... not shakes inducing at all.  Hey ... but what will he be like at 16???
« Last Edit: November 21, 2017, 05:57:05 PM by DaviSto »

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #30 on: November 21, 2017, 05:44:16 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #31 on: November 21, 2017, 06:36:10 PM »
Hey ... but what will he be like at 16???

Hopefully telling his friends, "It's a mode of transportation to school, not a racecar headed to the liquor store."  ;)
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YuengLinger

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #32 on: November 21, 2017, 07:16:35 PM »
I'd ask Bryan and Sean about this... your assumption about things being 'uncool' and bad manners is ridiculous imho. They are very easy going people and not so hung up on these minor particulars as your post makes you appear.

They might not care at all, you're right. But by and large, it's very much net etiquette not to post linked images someone else is hosting. Their bandwidth gets eaten up. Which is why so many commercial sites explicitly disallow it.

Given that Bryan has numerous disclaimers up about how much time/effort he puts into the site, and he solicits commissions and even donations, I go on the assumption that it's more polite to not do something that would cost him money (even if it is pennies on bandwidth).

Plus, it's not like it takes that much effort to host an image, or to simply link to the page so the owner gets some page-hits/advertising revenue.

You're preaching to someone who has donated to his site many times. Thanks for the school marm treatment.

Ahh. I didn't realize that if you've donated to a site, you get to make your own rules.

Another poster--not you--posted images hosted by Bryan at TDP. I said, "hey, that's a bit rude. Think again."  And I gave reasons why it's considered bad etiquette, and why it literally costs the image host money. Plenty of forums have rules explicitly forbidding this, and plenty of hosts block images from being posted like that.

You disagree? Fine. You don't think it's rude. And your contributions to TDP allow you to do whatever you want, apparently. I'm not the arbiter of Fairness and Justice on the Internet. I'm just sharing what is common practice.

If your undies are in a bunch about it, that's your problem and not mine, childish insults notwithstanding.

And, given that I'm a college professor, comparing me to a school marm isn't so far off the mark.

You must have tenure if you have time to join a camera forum and start flaming and scolding right off the bat.  Ivy League?

aceflibble

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #33 on: November 21, 2017, 08:28:12 PM »
I don't understand why anybody would be surprised or dispute that the Sigma 85 would be sharper than the Canon considering the Sigma is widely-known to be sharper than anything without 'Zeiss' in the name, while Canon has never competed in that world. Can has always taken 2nd place in measured performance for the sake of keeping production times low and getting general use features in sooner.

Yeah, the Sigma is noticeably cleaner. And the Canon has IS and can be more readily repaired in more countries. In other news, the sky is blue and grass continues to be green.

jaell

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #34 on: November 21, 2017, 10:07:52 PM »

You must have tenure if you have time to join a camera forum and start flaming and scolding right off the bat.  Ivy League?

Let's see.. I signed up here in March of 2013. so nothing I've posted here recently is "right off the bat." I've flamed no one. Scolding? I'd say that's even a harsh interpretation of me suggesting someone not steal TDP's hosting/bandwidth to post images here.

But no, not tenured yet. And definitely not Ivy League. I wouldn't want that sort of headache.

It always does make me smile when someone online tells someone else that they must have a lot of spare time to post their thoughts. Aside from the pot/kettle thing, it amuses me that people assume it takes a lot of time to compose a post here (or on any online forum). And even if it did take more than 60 seconds for me to type this paragraph, given that I'm soliciting information and reading this forum to help me decide how to spend $1100-1600 on an 85mm prime, it actually makes sense to spend a little time figuring out the best use of sizable chunk of money.

I apologize to anyone reading this if my digressions have detracted from the Sigma vs. Canon question.

But taking a few minutes periodically through the day to check in here to find out if there have been any new reviews or data to help me figure out how to spend $1100+ isn't, in my mind, a waste of precious time.

Especially over this past week, when my grading is light because I don't like loading up my students with work in the run-up to the extended holiday.

Cheers!
« Last Edit: November 21, 2017, 10:25:35 PM by jaell »
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Viggo

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #35 on: November 22, 2017, 01:32:09 AM »
I don't understand why anybody would be surprised or dispute that the Sigma 85 would be sharper than the Canon considering the Sigma is widely-known to be sharper than anything without 'Zeiss' in the name, while Canon has never competed in that world. Can has always taken 2nd place in measured performance for the sake of keeping production times low and getting general use features in sooner.

Yeah, the Sigma is noticeably cleaner. And the Canon has IS and can be more readily repaired in more countries. In other news, the sky is blue and grass continues to be green.

«canon have never competed in that world” ? Do you mean just with 85mm or in general?
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KirkD

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #36 on: November 23, 2017, 03:42:50 PM »
Looking at the test results, I would say that the Sigma 1.4 Art is very slightly sharper in the corners. However, almost all of my photography is hand-held; those charts were not. I would go with the Canon 1.4 because, hand-held, the results with IS will likely be sharper than the Sigma. In other words, the very slight superiority in corner sharpness for the Sigma is undone by the fact it has no IS if one primarily shoots hand-held.

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #36 on: November 23, 2017, 03:42:50 PM »

Larsskv

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #37 on: November 23, 2017, 04:08:41 PM »
Looking at the test results, I would say that the Sigma 1.4 Art is very slightly sharper in the corners. However, almost all of my photography is hand-held; those charts were not. I would go with the Canon 1.4 because, hand-held, the results with IS will likely be sharper than the Sigma. In other words, the very slight superiority in corner sharpness for the Sigma is undone by the fact it has no IS if one primarily shoots hand-held.

I agree, but compare them when both are attached to the lower resolution body 1Ds III, and it becomes hard to tell them apart. In real world use, to me, the resolution advantage the Sigma holds is unsignificant.

ScottyP

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #38 on: November 23, 2017, 04:37:27 PM »
I would have thought Brian and TDP would like people linking their articles on other sites. I don't recall whether I found CR or TDP first, but I'm pretty sure I found one by seeing a post linking to it on the other. 

Incidentally, I just picked up the 5d4 on that insane Adorama package deal yesterday, but I was careful to go through the TDP link so that TDP gets a little commission.
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ahsanford

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #39 on: November 23, 2017, 04:59:40 PM »
Looking at the test results, I would say that the Sigma 1.4 Art is very slightly sharper in the corners. However, almost all of my photography is hand-held; those charts were not. I would go with the Canon 1.4 because, hand-held, the results with IS will likely be sharper than the Sigma. In other words, the very slight superiority in corner sharpness for the Sigma is undone by the fact it has no IS if one primarily shoots hand-held.

Love IS and agree it's valuable.  It lets you walk the ISO down a few stops on static subjects.

But to make a sharpness argument for it implies you aren't watching your shutter speed. 

But if you're set for auto ISO 1/FL minimum shutter, it would see to it that you wouldn't have a shutter speed related oopsie and you'd be able to realize the resolving power of the lens handheld in the field.

i.e. if I'm shooting a 24-70 lens with IS off (or lacking IS), I'll set min shutter to 1/60th (as 1/70th isn't an option) or 1/125 if I'm tired, hiking, etc.  But if the IS is on and I'm shooting static subjects, I'll tweak my auto ISO to 1/15 or so.  Sounds tweakish, but I really only of do this once each time I mount the lens (IS is almost always on for me). So in the manner I shoot, IS never bails me out -- I'm constantly counting on it to keep my ISO as low as possible.

Love IS, I do, but 'it bails me out when I don't keep an eye on shutter speed or don't like to fiddle with my ISO level' is not a selling point for the way I shoot. 

- A 
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 05:04:32 PM by ahsanford »

bereninga

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #40 on: November 27, 2017, 11:26:26 AM »
It's really a hard choice between these two lenses. Also, the Sigma deals right now make it hard to resist.

However, I think the IS for the Canon is useful, especially if you plan to use the lens for handheld video. Also, the 77mm filter thread is more common than Sigma's gargantuan 86mm. I'll be waiting for refurbs though as the price for the Canon seems sky high, esp since this is a hobby.

e_honda

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #41 on: November 28, 2017, 07:31:37 PM »
I don't understand why anybody would be surprised or dispute that the Sigma 85 would be sharper than the Canon considering the Sigma is widely-known to be sharper than anything without 'Zeiss' in the name, while Canon has never competed in that world. Can has always taken 2nd place in measured performance for the sake of keeping production times low and getting general use features in sooner.

Well, the Canon 35L II is clearly better than the Sigma 35A and the 6 year old 24-70L II is still sharper than the new Sigma 24-70A (which has been somewhat of a disappointment).

Was obvious Canon clearly felt they needed to best the 35A when they later introduced the 35L II, so it stands to reason they wanted to do the same with the new 85L being released after its Sigma counterpart (again). But Sigma, with the size of the lens, obviously went for best possible sharpness while forgoing any concerns of size and weight.

The CA performance of the new Canon 85L is definitely a little disappointing, though.




PavelR

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #42 on: November 29, 2017, 01:56:19 AM »
I don't understand why anybody would be surprised or dispute that the Sigma 85 would be sharper than the Canon considering the Sigma is widely-known to be sharper than anything without 'Zeiss' in the name, while Canon has never competed in that world. Can has always taken 2nd place in measured performance for the sake of keeping production times low and getting general use features in sooner.

Well, the Canon 35L II is clearly better than the Sigma 35A and the 6 year old 24-70L II is still sharper than the new Sigma 24-70A (which has been somewhat of a disappointment).

Was obvious Canon clearly felt they needed to best the 35A when they later introduced the 35L II, so it stands to reason they wanted to do the same with the new 85L being released after its Sigma counterpart (again). But Sigma, with the size of the lens, obviously went for best possible sharpness while forgoing any concerns of size and weight.

The CA performance of the new Canon 85L is definitely a little disappointing, though.
+1

The purple fringing is gone at F5.6 on new Canon 85 and at F4 on Sigma 85A according to review pictures on TDP.

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #42 on: November 29, 2017, 01:56:19 AM »

SRSW

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #43 on: December 01, 2017, 04:45:56 AM »
The price would be the deciding factor for me personally - does the price gap warrant that much of a image and build quality difference?

Viggo

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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #44 on: December 01, 2017, 07:57:38 AM »
The price would be the deciding factor for me personally - does the price gap warrant that much of a image and build quality difference?

If weather sealing and IS means nothing to you and you’re okay with potential AF/copy issues the Sigma will be a good choice. If you value size weight, IS and sealing then the 85 IS might be the right way to go.

I’m really happy with the 85 IS even though it’s a bit far from my 35 L II in image quality.
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Re: Sigma 85 looks better in corners
« Reply #44 on: December 01, 2017, 07:57:38 AM »