December 11, 2017, 12:53:14 AM

Author Topic: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered  (Read 5691 times)

traveller

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2017, 05:21:55 AM »
I wonder if this means that there will be three separate replacements for the 1300D (Rebel T6/Kiss X80) or if Canon are revising their low end naming to use number variations for each region? - e.g. 2000D = Japan, 3000D = international, 4000D = N. America.

If so, why register all of them in a given country?

Anyway, I wonder how many entry-level DSLR Canon needs, and how they will be differentiated.

Good point.

It seems like all the mainstream camera manufacturers seem to think that they need to cover every possible price point with a marginally differentiated model. This combines with older inventory to create a very confusing picture, perhaps to push entry level buyers into the hands of slick talking camera salesmen. Thom Hogan discusses the issue quite a bit on his site (www.bythom.com). Of all the manufacturers, perhaps Canon is best placed to make a commoditised strategy work.

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2017, 05:21:55 AM »

midluk

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2017, 07:28:07 AM »
"You  can get a 4000D for <little money>, but it is not good. For only a little bit more money you can get the better 3000D. But that does not really make sense to buy because the price increase to the even better 2000D is negligible. And if you are at the 2000D price point, you can get the 800D with a much better STM lens for only <not so much money> more."
And before you know it you have bought a 5D Mark IV (or at least an 80D). They need enough steps on the ladder. The price difference between 1300D and 800D is likely too big for that to work at the moment. It is almost a factor of 2.
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jeffa4444

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2017, 09:42:38 AM »
"You  can get a 4000D for <little money>, but it is not good. For only a little bit more money you can get the better 3000D. But that does not really make sense to buy because the price increase to the even better 2000D is negligible. And if you are at the 2000D price point, you can get the 800D with a much better STM lens for only <not so much money> more."
And before you know it you have bought a 5D Mark IV (or at least an 80D). They need enough steps on the ladder. The price difference between 1300D and 800D is likely too big for that to work at the moment. It is almost a factor of 2.

Jan / Feb is not that far off better to wait and see what the products actually are rather than speculate and get bent out of shape over nothing.
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Maximilian

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2017, 09:43:47 AM »
...
Kit: Body, 18-55mm IS II, 18-55mm DC III</li>
...
... Meh!

The 18-55 III is a relatively new lens (2011) compared with some of the dinosaurs that Canon is still pushing with low end kits, such as the 75-300 III. ...
I know, I know, I know!
Guess what I am thinking about a 75-300 III ...  ::)  :o :-X

But maybe Canon could optimize their supply and production chain to still have cost advantage but can get rid off those optical trash toys.
But if they still produce those of course my thought is wrong. Cause there is no other right to exist for those but being very, very cheap in production.  :-\
sometimes you have to close your eyes to see properly.

AvTvM

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2017, 11:07:48 AM »
yes, fill the channels with more low, lower, lowest end mirrorslappers and yesteryear kit lenses! Not only 1, but 3 models! Maybe Canon will drop "rebel" moniker and maybe go to "higher number = better model". Would be about time to move on to a more rational product naming/numbering scheme. 

EOS M50 is also going to be bottom / entry level for EOS M line-up ... further nerfed [e.g. no RAW capture, only Auto-modes ...] and cheaper than M100.

IIIC ... Innovative Inspired Infallible Canon!  ;D

SkynetTX

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2017, 11:53:54 AM »
The naming scheme could go as ###C for crops, ###F for full frames and ###M for mirrorless cameras starting and increasing the numbers with 100. Maybe ###B for budget crops for beginners with the oldest versions of the "no one uses them but they are still in production because they are cheap" 18-55mm lenses. :)
As for the new bodies: I've asked for a 9000D with 18 Mp APS-C sensor, 1,6 Mp rear LCD screen, and 25 AF points (1 in the center, 8 around in the frist circle, and 16 in a second circle), but no wi-fi, no nfc and no video mode. Maybe the 2000D is the first step for this camera with a higher resolution LCD than the 1200D/1300D. :)

jolyonralph

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2017, 12:35:04 PM »
EOS M50 is also going to be bottom / entry level for EOS M line-up ... further nerfed [e.g. no RAW capture, only Auto-modes ...] and cheaper than M100.

No, no it won't :)

They don't need to sell nerfed cameras. Who else sells nerfed cameras? They'll just get destroyed in reviews, and don't forget everyone checks amazon ratings etc before buying these days. 

The M100 will remain the entry, and the M50 is either going to be an M5 replacement or an M100 with built-in EVF.
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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2017, 12:35:04 PM »

jolyonralph

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2017, 12:41:28 PM »
So, why so many models?

The only real possibility is that the old Rebel line is no more.

Makes sense because we're at the 800D already and certainly it can't go up to 1000D.  So we probably need to reset the number sequence.


So the 2000D =  what was the 1400D

The 3000D is the replacement for the 800D
and the 4000D is the replacement for the 77D (which was the 9000D in asia anyway)

Jolyon Ralph

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jolyonralph

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2017, 12:47:30 PM »
So, why so many models?

The only real possibility is that the old Rebel line is no more.

Ok, looking at this again I think this can't be right. Unless Canon are really being mean to the Russians they wouldn't bundle a replacement to the 800D or 77D with a non-STM kit lens.

So these have to be three different low-end models.

Jolyon Ralph

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Maximilian

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2017, 12:49:13 PM »
So, why so many models?

The only real possibility is that the old Rebel line is no more.

Makes sense because we're at the 800D already and certainly it can't go up to 1000D.  So we probably need to reset the number sequence.


So the 2000D =  what was the 1400D

The 3000D is the replacement for the 800D
and the 4000D is the replacement for the 77D (which was the 9000D in asia anyway)
Sorry Ralph, but that is not logical!
I thought about that for a second, too.
But that would mean that the higher level consumer cameras would get a downgrade in kit lenses.
So it really seems that those bodies are all in the "1300D segement" but maybe each with little different specs and 50 $/€/£ difference.
sometimes you have to close your eyes to see properly.

neuroanatomist

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2017, 12:57:15 PM »
As for the new bodies: I've asked for a 9000D with 18 Mp APS-C sensor, 1,6 Mp rear LCD screen, and 25 AF points (1 in the center, 8 around in the frist circle, and 16 in a second circle), but no wi-fi, no nfc and no video mode.

I predict the EOS 9000D will be 24 MP APS-C, 3" 1.04Mp articulating LCD, 45 AF points, with WiFi, NFC, and HD video.

Don't bother second-guessing or arguing with me, I guarantee my prediction.  How?  It's already come true.  The 9000D is available today in Japan.  In the rest of the world, it's better known as the EOS 77D.

 8)
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ahsanford

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2017, 01:59:51 PM »
So, why so many models?

The only real possibility is that the old Rebel line is no more.

Ok, looking at this again I think this can't be right. Unless Canon are really being mean to the Russians they wouldn't bundle a replacement to the 800D or 77D with a non-STM kit lens.

So these have to be three different low-end models.

That would be my guess as well.

- A

jolyonralph

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2017, 03:48:21 PM »
So, perhaps:

2000D -  Cut-down model, no flash hotshoe, no left side ports at all (no HDMI, no USB, no remote trigger), but with wifi and NFC

Most people don't need these ports, they can use wifi or a card reader to transfer images.  This could end up being the cheapest entry level Canon DSLR ever in real terms.

3000D - as above, but with flash hotshoe

4000D - with hotshoe, hdmi, usb, remote trigger port


But speed, focus points, 24mpx sensor will be identical with all models.

Why?  Canon won't design 3 different cameras at the same time. THese have to be 3 cameras that are pretty much identical internally, the only differences being costsaving features.

A 4000D might alternatively contain more RAM than the 3000D giving it a greater buffer size.  That's the sort of internal change that is simply a matter of soldering on more chips to a standard design.

We won't see features being dropped off the lower models simply to 'nerf' them, for example wifi is so cheap to add to devices now that there's no reason not to add it.  The cost of the real ports in terms of both components, production time and warranty returns due to failure is far greater than the wifi chip.






Jolyon Ralph

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2017, 03:48:21 PM »

okaro

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #28 on: November 24, 2017, 04:33:28 AM »
EOS M50 is also going to be bottom / entry level for EOS M line-up ... further nerfed [e.g. no RAW capture, only Auto-modes ...] and cheaper than M100.

No, no it won't :)

They don't need to sell nerfed cameras. Who else sells nerfed cameras? They'll just get destroyed in reviews, and don't forget everyone checks amazon ratings etc before buying these days. 

The M100 will remain the entry, and the M50 is either going to be an M5 replacement or an M100 with built-in EVF.

I think it will be something like M100 with a flash shoe and an optional viewfinder.

photonius

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #29 on: November 24, 2017, 07:09:59 AM »
So, perhaps:

2000D -  Cut-down model, no flash hotshoe, no left side ports at all (no HDMI, no USB, no remote trigger), but with wifi and NFC

Most people don't need these ports, they can use wifi or a card reader to transfer images.  This could end up being the cheapest entry level Canon DSLR ever in real terms.

3000D - as above, but with flash hotshoe

4000D - with hotshoe, hdmi, usb, remote trigger port


But speed, focus points, 24mpx sensor will be identical with all models.

Why?  Canon won't design 3 different cameras at the same time. THese have to be 3 cameras that are pretty much identical internally, the only differences being costsaving features.

A 4000D might alternatively contain more RAM than the 3000D giving it a greater buffer size.  That's the sort of internal change that is simply a matter of soldering on more chips to a standard design.

We won't see features being dropped off the lower models simply to 'nerf' them, for example wifi is so cheap to add to devices now that there's no reason not to add it.  The cost of the real ports in terms of both components, production time and warranty returns due to failure is far greater than the wifi chip.

maybe, but these little details seem not offer a sufficiently clear distinction with cost saving features.
I would speculate that one main differentiating feature could be the LCD.
Lowest level: no touch screen
Middle: fixed touch screen
highest level body, vari-angle touch screen.           
The "value" of those difference consumers can recognise easily, and I think it allows Canon a reasonable differentiated pricing

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Re: EOS 2000D, EOS 3000D, EOS 4000D, EOS M50 Registered
« Reply #29 on: November 24, 2017, 07:09:59 AM »