July 22, 2018, 07:06:15 AM

Author Topic: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]  (Read 10220 times)

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New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« on: January 02, 2018, 06:33:55 PM »
We’re told that a new line of EF ILC video oriented camera capable of 4K is coming from Canon in 2018. We’re told that it won’t fall under the Cinema EOS banner.

We’ve seen patents related to such a camera in the recent past, but this is the first time a known source has mentioned the camera.

This camera could appear ahead of NAB in April. The next Cinema EOS camera is scheduled to be announced after the NAB show, which isn’t an unusual thing for Canon to do.

The source was confident it would be a new series of camera, and if it goes well, there’s a possibility of a whole series of cameras under the new umbrella.

« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 12:52:39 PM by Canon Rumors »
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New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« on: January 02, 2018, 06:33:55 PM »

James Larsen

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2018, 06:39:24 PM »
I hope, hope, HOPE that this is true!!!! lol

Talys

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2018, 06:59:11 PM »
If true, perfect.  I hope that Canon makes a fantastic 4k ILC for people who want that, and don't charge a premium to photographers who are not really interested in 4k video on their DSLRs, at least, not if there's a price difference or some other tradeoff.


ahsanford

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2018, 07:04:10 PM »
This may be just a dedicated video cam with an EF mount like the XC10 / EF photoshoppery the leading post jokes at.

If so, this is great news for videographers, vloggers, etc. but potentially sad news for those waiting for the 5DS 2, FF mirrorless, etc. 

Canon has a 'hole' in it's planned FF camera releases for 2018 -- from past track record, this year we shouldn't expect a 1DX / 5D / 6D level camera and 5DS update was going to be 2019.  So that hole was either to be filled by advancing the 5DS 2 forward (something Canon typically doesn't do but has some cause to consider) or possibly using that hole in the lineup to release FF mirrorless and give it the spotlight this year.

But if this hole is being filled with an FF ILC just for video, FF mirrorless or the 5DS 2 may not be this year.   :o

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H. Jones

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2018, 08:52:44 PM »
This may be just a dedicated video cam with an EF mount like the XC10 / EF photoshoppery the leading post jokes at.

If so, this is great news for videographers, vloggers, etc. but potentially sad news for those waiting for the 5DS 2, FF mirrorless, etc. 

Canon has a 'hole' in it's planned FF camera releases for 2018 -- from past track record, this year we shouldn't expect a 1DX / 5D / 6D level camera and 5DS update was going to be 2019.  So that hole was either to be filled by advancing the 5DS 2 forward (something Canon typically doesn't do but has some cause to consider) or possibly using that hole in the lineup to release FF mirrorless and give it the spotlight this year.

But if this hole is being filled with an FF ILC just for video, FF mirrorless or the 5DS 2 may not be this year.   :o

- A

I do kinda wonder why a FF ILC made for video wouldn't be mirrorless. A lot of the video guys I know are either using Canon Cinema cameras or are using mirrorless for the ability to use the viewfinder during video. a FF mirrorless would kinda be like a tiny Cinema camera anyway, since the Cinema cameras all use EVFs.

That said, a FF with the 6D2's flippy touch screen and 4K could definitely make the cut for that. Would be interested to know where such a thing would fit in stills-wise.
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padam

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2018, 09:30:45 PM »
It is a little weird to see a 4K camera that is 'video oriented' but not part of the C-series, that means it is probably going to be an XC-like camera with Super 35mm sensor 4:2:2 8-bit with C-Log, no internal ND, etc.

Their first FF mirrorless is probably going to be like a beefed-up EOS M5 made for the consumer market, so it will take a while until it will evolve to more like a mirrorless version of a 5D with all the proper controls, build, etc.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2018, 09:37:55 PM by padam »

CanoKnight

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2018, 09:36:25 PM »
I had given up on Canon video after the garbage 4k in the 5d4 and hearing of 1.4 crop 4k on the upcoming 7d3. This arouses my curiosity, but only a little because sensor size is everything. If it's anything smaller than 1.4x FF, it will immediately be relegated to junk status or DOA as far as I am concerned.

The fact that they are letting us know well in advance that it won't be cinemas EOS which itself is a sub FF system, and the fact that Canon are known to not cannibalize their own systems, tells me it will be a lesser system than Cinema EOS. As in cheaper, with fewer features and a 'tiny' sensor. So I am not keeping my hopes up. In the words of the president, "we will see."


« Last Edit: January 02, 2018, 10:09:31 PM by CanoKnight »
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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2018, 09:36:25 PM »

transpo1

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2018, 12:06:33 AM »
I had given up on Canon video after the garbage 4k in the 5d4 and hearing of 1.4 crop 4k on the upcoming 7d3. This arouses my curiosity, but only a little because sensor size is everything. If it's anything smaller than 1.4x FF, it will immediately be relegated to junk status or DOA as far as I am concerned.

The fact that they are letting us know well in advance that it won't be cinemas EOS which itself is a sub FF system, and the fact that Canon are known to not cannibalize their own systems, tells me it will be a lesser system than Cinema EOS. As in cheaper, with fewer features and a 'tiny' sensor. So I am not keeping my hopes up. In the words of the president, "we will see."

All this is very sensible talk. Not branding it Cinema EOS could tell us something. Or they could be going after video centric hybrid market. But, as you said, if it has anything less than a APS-C or Super 35mm sized sensor and lacks 1080p 120p, it’s DOA. (And yes, ANY video camera moving SHOULD have 4K 60p as well.)

rrcphoto

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2018, 08:45:10 AM »
I had given up on Canon video after the garbage 4k in the 5d4 and hearing of 1.4 crop 4k on the upcoming 7d3. This arouses my curiosity, but only a little because sensor size is everything. If it's anything smaller than 1.4x FF, it will immediately be relegated to junk status or DOA as far as I am concerned.
yeah because all the Canon CINI cameras are all junk..

IglooEater

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2018, 08:55:46 AM »
  If it's anything smaller than 1.4x FF, it will immediately be relegated to junk status or DOA as far as I am concerned.

Really, anything smaller than 1.4x FF? The RED monstro is ~1.8x FF at 4K.  Do you relegate it’s 4K capabilities to junk status?  I don’t mean to contest you, just curious.

criscokkat

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2018, 09:11:30 AM »
This may be just a dedicated video cam with an EF mount like the XC10 / EF photoshoppery the leading post jokes at.

That was my first thought. All of those APS-C lens patents that were revealed last week seem to be a perfect match to a 4k cinema camera setup. It could be using the same sensor that's rumored to be used in the 7D3, without the mirror. I've been firmly in the camp for a while that when Canon does release full frame mirrorless they will keep the same registration distance as the current cameras because making them any smaller impacts handling (and balance as the lenses are just as big). Why not get a jump on it and test everything out with the one crowd that could (mostly) care less about the mirror? 

canonnews

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2018, 09:50:01 AM »
We’re told that a new line of EF ILC video oriented camera capable of 4K is coming from Canon in 2018. We’re told that it won’t fall under the Cinema EOS banner.

this makes alot of sense.

1) we've seen a patent for the EF mount for it.
2) we've found a APS-C / Super-35 APS-C UWA and normal lenses patent application
3) it just really makes sense.

The ergonomics for a video camera and a digital stills camera aren't really nicely married together.  the XC series looked at making more of a hybrid ergonomic solution for both stills and video.  it makes sense for Canon to expand on this.

Drop a Cxxx series sensor in there (1.5 crop) and with an EF mount you have a credible EF mount run and gun EF based reportage camera body.  ergonomics a marry between stills and video. Unlike either the CINI-EOS lineup and the SLR stills lineup.

Neither Panasonic or Sony have made significant inroads in marketshare trying to sell stills cameras at professional video cameras.  However Sony's video cameras continue to hit it out of the park.  So it seems like the overly exaggerated need for professional video on a digital stills camera is still very much a niche.

adamaoc

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2018, 10:38:26 AM »
I'm actually really excited about this. I especially like the idea that this could become its own line of cameras. An XC-like camera with an EF-mount, I'd be all over it. I'd even be okay seeing them make one that's not 4K and have a lineup that can get you up to 4K...

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2018, 10:38:26 AM »

bsbeamer

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #13 on: January 03, 2018, 01:59:52 PM »
At the end of the day, have a feeling this one will be all about the codec.  They could take the exact body from the 5D4 or the rumored 4K 7D update, toss in a better codec for 4K and have a (partial) crowd pleaser on their hands.  Opening up 4K to 60fps (or even 90 or 120) would be icing on the cake.  Though I've gotten used to my Canon cakes being icing-less over the past few years...

Tugela

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2018, 02:54:24 PM »
Canon processors appear to run too hot to do hardware encoded 4K without a cooling solution, so don't count on any hybrid style cameras that do that any time soon (that includes the 7DIII as well btw). The latest iteration of the Digic family (DV6) still have this failing, and likely the corresponding Digic 8 will as well.

My guess is that they will make an XC variant with an ILC mount, but otherwise with a similar design. The 7DIII, when it comes out later this year, will probably still use MJPEG for 4K video because of the heat issue.

Based on what we have seen so far, and extrapolating from how Canon works, the earliest that 4K will appear in consumer cameras is 2019 IMO.

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Re: New 4K ILC Coming From Canon in 2018, Not Cinema EOS [CR2]
« Reply #14 on: January 03, 2018, 02:54:24 PM »