May 27, 2018, 12:01:42 PM

Author Topic: Tony Northrup Predicts The Upcoming Full Frame Mirrorless Offerings From Both Canon and Nikon  (Read 13747 times)

Hector1970

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I think Tony makes a lot of really good points, but I don't understand his notion that people don't understand the viewfinder coming from a cell phone. I don't do it a lot at the moment, but when I'm teaching people the basics of how a DSLR works, the viewfinder is never the issue and they never expect to pinch to zoom a photo. They don't even attempt it. They don't. At all. The last two 18 year old kids that I was teaching the finer points of aperture, exposure, and ISO never once puzzled about the view finder. Maybe it's my sample size (roughly fifteen or so individuals of varying ages, all under 24), but again, the viewfinder was the least of their issues. The biggest issue was teaching them how to process a RAW file.
Seriously, are the people he knows so slow witted they cannot figure out the difference between an optical view finder and an phone screen? It almost feels like that was thrown in as a troll.
I think you are correct in general but I have known beginners asking about their cameras and not ever using the viewfinder. They find it a strange thing to use the viewfinder.

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Talys

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I think Tony makes a lot of really good points, but I don't understand his notion that people don't understand the viewfinder coming from a cell phone. I don't do it a lot at the moment, but when I'm teaching people the basics of how a DSLR works, the viewfinder is never the issue and they never expect to pinch to zoom a photo. They don't even attempt it. They don't. At all. The last two 18 year old kids that I was teaching the finer points of aperture, exposure, and ISO never once puzzled about the view finder. Maybe it's my sample size (roughly fifteen or so individuals of varying ages, all under 24), but again, the viewfinder was the least of their issues. The biggest issue was teaching them how to process a RAW file.
Seriously, are the people he knows so slow witted they cannot figure out the difference between an optical view finder and an phone screen? It almost feels like that was thrown in as a troll.
I think you are correct in general but I have known beginners asking about their cameras and not ever using the viewfinder. They find it a strange thing to use the viewfinder.

Perhaps so.  These people should then avoid a full frame mirrorless entirely.  They will get just as good results with an APSC, which will cost less, and have significantly cheaper and smaller lenses.

I saw an article somewhere else (maybe DPR?) where someone said the A7M3 was close to being a camera they'd just recommend to someone if they were interested in photography looking for a camera.  I would say: why would you make someone who's just curious about photography blow $2,000 + $1,000++ on lenses just to get into the hobby?  You can spend a third of that and enjoy the hobby just as well; probably more as you start.

CanonFanBoy

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I don't understand why a fully electronic mirroless camera should have the design of a mechanical film SLR, which was constrained by film storage and transport, mechanical linkages and mirror/pentaprism needs, and with no ergonomics at all. Whenever I'm nostalgic of that design, I get my A-1 - which anyway I find more comfortable with the Motor Drive MA installed.

I hope Canon will surprise us as it did with the T90... with an innovative yet fully comfortable design.

I have an A-1 also. I'd hate to carry something like that around all day. Probably part of the reason straps were invented. One more reason to hope for a comfortable mirrorless camera.
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CanonFanBoy

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… because I don't think Canon or Nikon have a prayer in matching the A7 III price point.

I keep reading this but honestly, I don't understand where it's coming from. What spec is so outrageous that Canon can't offer it?

I'm just praying Canon won't match Sony's lens cost or quality. If it weren't for companies like Metabones, Sony would already be dead.
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CanonFanBoy

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If they released a mirrorless version of the 5D IV (closest a7 III competitor) and priced it at $2000 to compete with the Sony A7 III, then the 5D IV DSLR and 6D II will nosedive in value.

Canon needs to forget about competing with its own cameras and start competing with other camera manufacturers such as Sony in the mirrorless department.

Silly.  :o :o :o
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CanonFanBoy

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...not just how to photograph pretty girls.

Come on, man. Is there really any other reason to have a camera? Puh-leeeeze!!! That's like saying you go to the beach because you like sand.  ::)
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CanonFanBoy

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So to those who don't like Tony Northrop, which YouTuber would you recommend that puts out Camera videos that are from a similar perspective as Tony Northrop? Similar perspective meaning, more tech talk and not just how to photograph pretty girls.

At least meaningless videos with pretty girls have pretty girls. Tony just has meaningless videos.

I guess that you are one of those guys who know everything about photography, huh?

He didn't say that. What he implied (I think) is that pretty girls add more meaning to the meaningless videos than Tony ever could. I agree. I'd have never got a Brazilian waxing if it were not for the meaningless youtube tutorials with pretty girls. Getting waxed is the closest I can get to a hot date. Thank you, YouTube!
« Last Edit: April 21, 2018, 04:49:09 PM by CanonFanBoy »
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Don Haines

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...not just how to photograph pretty girls.

Come on, man. Is there really any other reason to have a camera? Puh-leeeeze!!! That's like saying you go to the beach because you like sand.  ::)

Cat pictures! The internet needs more cat pictures.....
The best camera is the one in your hands

Talys

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...not just how to photograph pretty girls.

Come on, man. Is there really any other reason to have a camera? Puh-leeeeze!!! That's like saying you go to the beach because you like sand.  ::)

Cat pictures! The internet needs more cat pictures.....

Our cat rules our life.  8)

drob

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I didn't watch the video so I can't comment about what Tony says...but when Canon brings forth their FF mirrorless, will it have a sensor that competes with the likes of Sony and Nikons (D850 sensor)? I mean, really that's what it boils down to, right? Do people really want a full frame mirrorless or do they just want any kind of camera that has improved DR and can compete with the features of the Sony A7 line and the Nikon D850? I honestly don't care whether a camera is mirrorless or a DSLR, I just want to know that my camera isn't 2 years behind the current tech when I buy it (ie the 6D2) or crippled in some way.

criscokkat

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I think Tony makes a lot of really good points, but I don't understand his notion that people don't understand the viewfinder coming from a cell phone. I don't do it a lot at the moment, but when I'm teaching people the basics of how a DSLR works, the viewfinder is never the issue and they never expect to pinch to zoom a photo. They don't even attempt it. They don't. At all. The last two 18 year old kids that I was teaching the finer points of aperture, exposure, and ISO never once puzzled about the view finder. Maybe it's my sample size (roughly fifteen or so individuals of varying ages, all under 24), but again, the viewfinder was the least of their issues. The biggest issue was teaching them how to process a RAW file.
Seriously, are the people he knows so slow witted they cannot figure out the difference between an optical view finder and an phone screen? It almost feels like that was thrown in as a troll.
I think you are correct in general but I have known beginners asking about their cameras and not ever using the viewfinder. They find it a strange thing to use the viewfinder.

Perhaps so.  These people should then avoid a full frame mirrorless entirely.  They will get just as good results with an APSC, which will cost less, and have significantly cheaper and smaller lenses.

I saw an article somewhere else (maybe DPR?) where someone said the A7M3 was close to being a camera they'd just recommend to someone if they were interested in photography looking for a camera.  I would say: why would you make someone who's just curious about photography blow $2,000 + $1,000++ on lenses just to get into the hobby?  You can spend a third of that and enjoy the hobby just as well; probably more as you start.

It really depends on the crowd you are in. If you are hang out with a bunch of friends driving new Merceds/Audis/Porche/etc then suggesting something that cost 3000 as a starter is not a big deal. Like most of us I'm down in the real world and have to think long and hard about just a lens in the 1k price range, especially since it's just a hobby for me.

This same crowd will blow 20k or more for a small camper that's used 3-4 times tops, or the same crowd that will not think anything about spending 10k for a overseas trip or a week at disney. This same crowd is the reason why the local camera stores that still exist are still in business, and why the only malls that are not dead and dying is "that one mall with all of the high end expensive stores".

For the rest of us there's the SL2 and excellent kit lens with the option to upgrade to better stuff if you like it.

privatebydesign

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I didn't watch the video so I can't comment about what Tony says...but when Canon brings forth their FF mirrorless, will it have a sensor that competes with the likes of Sony and Nikons (D850 sensor)? I mean, really that's what it boils down to, right? Do people really want a full frame mirrorless or do they just want any kind of camera that has improved DR and can compete with the features of the Sony A7 line and the Nikon D850? I honestly don't care whether a camera is mirrorless or a DSLR, I just want to know that my camera isn't 2 years behind the current tech when I buy it (ie the 6D2) or crippled in some way.

No, and you have obviously drunk too much of the DXO/DPReview Kool-Aid. At 100iso there is .25 stop difference in DR between the 5D MkIV and the D850. If you use dual pixel development techniques the 5D MkIV has 0.22 stops more DR than the maximum possible from the D850.

How, exactly, is that "uncompetitive?"
Too often we lose sight of the fact that photography is about capturing light, if we have the ability to take control of that light then we grow exponentially as photographers. More often than not the image is not about lens speed, sensor size, DR, MP's or AF, it is about the light.

Talys

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I didn't watch the video so I can't comment about what Tony says...but when Canon brings forth their FF mirrorless, will it have a sensor that competes with the likes of Sony and Nikons (D850 sensor)? I mean, really that's what it boils down to, right? Do people really want a full frame mirrorless or do they just want any kind of camera that has improved DR and can compete with the features of the Sony A7 line and the Nikon D850? I honestly don't care whether a camera is mirrorless or a DSLR, I just want to know that my camera isn't 2 years behind the current tech when I buy it (ie the 6D2) or crippled in some way.

No, and you have obviously drunk too much of the DXO/DPReview Kool-Aid. At 100iso there is .25 stop difference in DR between the 5D MkIV and the D850. If you use dual pixel development techniques the 5D MkIV has 0.22 stops more DR than the maximum possible from the D850.

How, exactly, is that "uncompetitive?"

Keep in mind that the ONLY thing that matters is the DXOMark sensor score if the main goal of purchasing a camera is to own the highest ranked DXOMark sensor.  I mean, why on Earth would buy a Sony A7M3/A7R3 and the matching 28-70 f3.5-5.6 kit lens, otherwise?

Photography: the art of spending money on camera bodies.  8)

The funniest thing that I see on the Kool-Aid reviews is when they take a perfectly exposed studio picture, add ND filters and go, "See, this looks great even at -3EV with exposure compensation in post!!!"  But THIS NEVER HAPPENS.  When do you ever have perfectly balanced light sources, but just not enough of it?  Some poor sap ends up blowing $4,000 then goes into post and cranks the lightroom sliders, and wonders why they can't get a portrait that looks like it came out of a professional's studio.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2018, 04:15:06 PM by Talys »

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JRPhotos

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My concerns:

I won't be able to use my existing EOS lenses
The body will be too small for my hands
No view finder..... I need a view finder and not that digital junk

I just don't have much of an interest in mirrorless.

« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 03:18:34 PM by JRPhotos »

Talys

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My concerns:

I won't be able to use my existing EOS lenses
The body will be too small for my hands
No view finder..... I need a view finder and not that digital junk

I just don't have much of an interest in mirrorless.

I would bet anything in the world that any EF lens will work on Canon's full frame mirrorless. The body might even be to your liking.

But... it's gonna have a digital viewfinder :D

Come to think of it, it would be awesome (though physics defying with today's technology) to have a mirrorless OVF camera :D. All we need is a transparent sensor that doesn't require a shutter!

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