June 24, 2018, 01:59:30 AM

Author Topic: Anyone else delaying lens purchases until we know more about mirrorless plans?  (Read 5374 times)

RiceCanon

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Is it just me or does anyone else find themselves delaying lens purchases until we know more about Canon's prosumer mirrorless plans and timeframes?  I'm a serious amateur/hobbyist without the luxury of unlimited funds and will be very interested in moving to mirrorless if Canon offers a superb quality full frame mirrorless in the near future.

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ahsanford

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Is it just me or does anyone else find themselves delaying lens purchases until we know more about Canon's prosumer mirrorless plans and timeframes?  I'm a serious amateur/hobbyist without the luxury of unlimited funds and will be very interested in moving to mirrorless if Canon offers a superb quality full frame mirrorless in the near future.

Interesting question.  My instant gut answer was 'hell no', but then I thought about it a bit.

My answer is a 'qualified no' depending on your situation and what your goals with the new system are.  Consider before anything else this assumption: all EF glass surely will work on FF mirrorless on day one (either natively or with an adaptor).  That's a hammerlock certainty, IMHO.

However, there are some considerations that may affect your buying decisions:

  • If you are expressly getting into mirrorless to build a tiny rig+lens to carry around, you may want to wait if you are looking at a modestly quick wide or standard FL lens, e.g. a 35 f/2, a 28 2/8, a 50 f/1.8, etc. That's the sweet spot of where a thin mirrorless mount possibly offering it's own version of those lenses could lead to a very small aggregate size body + lens.  If you bought the EF versions of those lenses, they still would work but the camera + lens would be ~ 1" bigger or so for the EF adaptor -- you may not care about that, but some folks do.

  • If you are migrating from EF-S to full frame, if Canon goes full EF mount instead of thin mount, FF mirrorless could dramatically effect you using your existing lenses.  (This would be just like moving from crop to FF and all your lenses are EF-S -- they won't mount on the new rig and you'll either have to sell them or just keep them for your crop SLR.)  So if you are a crop shooter today and you want to move to FF mirrorless, I'd avoid buying any more EF-S glass until the mount decision is made and the specifics of the adaptor (if there is one) is announced.

  • There is the odd possibility -- and I admit this is a worry-wart sort of leap -- that Canon makes some decisions with a thin mount that might empower new thin-mount lenses to do some neat stuff that EF lenses cannot.  So while EF lenses will 100% work as they did before, some slick tech/tricks/tools on the body possibly might not be possible with older glass.  This is mad speculation on my part, and I have no idea what that new functionality may be -- so I feel a lot stronger about points (1) and (2) than this.

That said, if you're looking at a big/fast/long EF lens (f/2.8 zoom, f/1.2 or f/1.4 prime, something longer than 85mm, etc.) just go and buy it.  The future FF mirrorless version of that lens may not happen for a long time, but even when it does, it will be just about as big.

- A
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 01:05:04 PM by ahsanford »

stevelee

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That's certainly not true for me. I have a G7X II, but I want an OVF on anything any bigger. Buying more lenses for my 6D2 is delayed only by my budget.

RiceCanon

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I have a 6D II and a sufficient collection of L glass but there's always that desire to upgrade to a better version of an existing lens or to acquire a new lens altogether. But there's a little voice I'm hearing lately that's telling me to hold my funds and keep the status quo for my dslr stable in hopes that Canon surprises us soon with fantastic full frame mirrorless options to start building around.  I would love a smaller, lighter weight kit to travel with while staying in the Canon ecosystem. I just hope Canon shows their higher end mirrorless hand soon!

dickgrafixstop

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I don't know what Canon - or any other vendor - will do with mirrorless but regardless, I won't be making any
camera related purchase until after Photokina in September.  New format, new bodies, new lenses - whatever -
can wait several months until this starts to shake out.  I have some older gear that's due for replacement, but
it's worked well so far so why leap?

ahsanford

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I have a 6D II and a sufficient collection of L glass but there's always that desire to upgrade to a better version of an existing lens or to acquire a new lens altogether. But there's a little voice I'm hearing lately that's telling me to hold my funds and keep the status quo for my dslr stable in hopes that Canon surprises us soon with fantastic full frame mirrorless options to start building around.  I would love a smaller, lighter weight kit to travel with while staying in the Canon ecosystem. I just hope Canon shows their higher end mirrorless hand soon!

Then listen to that voice and wait.  I think you have your answer.

But keep in mind we may-to-likely just get something like a 6D2 mirrorless (with on-chip ADC + 4K) with a kit zoom and a cute little f/2.8 prime and that's it.  "Higher end" (at least to someone who owns a collection of L glass today) likely isn't going to happen out of the gate*, so presuming a thin mount expect to be adapting constantly in the first few years of service unless you only plan to use this rig in an expressly tiny/travel context.

*Unlike EOS M, which has yet to give us anything resembling an L lens and took four iterations to even get an integral viewfinder, I do expect Canon's first FF mirrorless body to have a red ringed something kitted with it at time of launch.

- A

stevelee

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*Unlike EOS M, which has yet to give us anything resembling an L lens and took four iterations to even get an integral viewfinder, I do expect Canon's first FF mirrorless body to have a red ringed something kitted with it at time of launch.

And if not, fingernail polish is fairly cheap.

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dickgrafixstop

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It used to be that Canon could wait until Nikon made a move and then counter it.  In the mirrorless market that
won't be so - only because both Canon and Nikon have failed to make any significant move into that market.  Now the big dog there is Sony, and it already has a formidable lens lineup to suppport it (Having Zeiss in your corner never hurts).  Canon will need to compete with a full lens line-up (unless they can do an adapter-less EF mount) and who cares what Nikon does?

9VIII

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EF mount isn't becoming less valuable, and I have doubts that the EF-X mount (for lack of a better term) will be available in an affordable body for quite some time. If they're going Full Frame with high end specs it could be all $3,000+ for the first few years.
The existence (and good sales) of EF-M makes me doubt that Canon will ever sell an entry level EF-X body.

ahsanford

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It used to be that Canon could wait until Nikon made a move and then counter it.  In the mirrorless market that
won't be so - only because both Canon and Nikon have failed to make any significant move into that market.  Now the big dog there is Sony, and it already has a formidable lens lineup to suppport it (Having Zeiss in your corner never hurts).  Canon will need to compete with a full lens line-up (unless they can do an adapter-less EF mount) and who cares what Nikon does?

We continue to act like the possibility of a new mount has a dire impact for Canon's competitiveness, our need to buy new and sell old lenses, etc.  That's not an issue.  I honestly think you have it backwards above.  Sony will need to be competing with Canon lens-wise.  Canon will have at least 65* FF lenses ready to go the day this is announced.  EF or adaptor, we presume they will all work with FF mirrorless right out of the gate.

(*that the current can buy now figure at B&H, I imagine the real number is considerably higher than that given how many EF lenses are already out in the wild)

And of the two potential future extremes of what will happen in FF ILC...

1) Sony gets amazing at service, ergonomics, reliability, accessories and steals a ton of pro marketshare from Canon.  YAPODFC.

2) Canon finally puts out an effective and well-thought through FF mirrorless platform.  After years of false dawns, fine print and underwhelming delivery of things (other than sensors and spec sheets), Sony folks try the new Canon platform and realize that they never should have left.  Once Canon gets its FF mirrorless platform up and running (say 3 years in), it will scoop up a huge share of the A7 market.

...#2 is SO much more likely to pass than #1, IMHO.

- A

cpsico

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Is it just me or does anyone else find themselves delaying lens purchases until we know more about Canon's prosumer mirrorless plans and timeframes?  I'm a serious amateur/hobbyist without the luxury of unlimited funds and will be very interested in moving to mirrorless if Canon offers a superb quality full frame mirrorless in the near future.
Not me, if canon changes the mount and flash system I will just buy sony at this point if I am in the market for a mirrorless camera

ken

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Is it just me or does anyone else find themselves delaying lens purchases until we know more about Canon's prosumer mirrorless plans and timeframes? 
...

Emphatically yes. Stopped buying lenses last year, when the 6D ii came out. I don't know if I will stay with Canon or not going forward. But my 6D still gets me by, so I can wait a bit longer to decide.

You didn't ask, but... My camera body wish list (and not implying this should be anyone else's list) is:
 - Higher resolution than my 6D. 24MP or above, but prefer considerably lower than 50
 - A body size similar to my 6D (but I could make do with slightly smaller, or slightly larger. I don't want 1DX size)
 - At a minimum, tilt screen. Flip would be a bonus.
 - At least 6 fps
 - Fast focus with solid tracking. I've lived with crap focus for way too long.
 - Wysiwyg focus in the viewfinder (for macro, tilt-shift, and other reasons). EVF is fine with me.
 - Truly silent shutter option (even if it sacrifices some frame rate)
 - IBIS would be nice for future, lighter lenses
 - It should be fun to shoot with. Sensible layout of buttons, sensible menu system.
 - Solid video support, but secondary concern. (I'd probably shoot more video if the 6D video support was better)

I'm sure I'll have to give up something no matter which way I go. And yes... a mirrorless 6Dii is probably just the kind of thing I'd go for.

I don't really want to switch to Sony (I hate the idea of transitioning to Sony's menu system, the bodies are still too small, Sony support was terrible for laptops so why would they be different with cameras, etc.). It may be a full year before we really see Canon's real direction. But I'll switch if Sony ends up closer to my overall needs than Canon's mirrorless direction. Maybe the A9 will become lower in price to be a sensible option by then.  And I'd rent the A7Riii or A9 before switching, because too much of what is reported seems overhyped. (I own the a6000, so I've seen the disconnect between hype and reality.)

So, for now, I rent the lenses I need that I don't already own. I had an indoor event to shoot last weekend and rented the 24‑70mm f/2.8L II. I really enjoyed shooting with it. I should own it. I WOULD own it (and the 100mm f/2.8L macro, the 85mm f/1.4L IS, ... I personally even enjoyed the week I spent with the 50mm 1.2L). But I don't want to keep investing in Canon glass until I know that's where I'll be for a long time to come. If I go Sony, most of the reviews indicate a serous downside to using adapters. So I have to believe I'd want to trade out to native Sony lenses. That's a serous bummer. If the Canon option requires an adapter for EF glass, I'll wait to see what compromises that entails. I may be selling glass either way.

So... I wait a bit longer. Impatiently. Renting glass, not buying.


« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 05:15:14 PM by ken »
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johnf3f

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No. No delays/hesitation here.

If Canon do come out with a mirrorless it will have to operate very well with my long lenses and reasonably well with my short lenses. It will also have to be strong enough to be manhandled with a 4.5 Kilo lens attached, have reasonably good battery life (certainly greater than my 7D2). Reasonable fps (6 +), moderate MP (26 or less?) and blistering AF with SuperTeles. Also a zero delay viewfinder that adjusts to differing at least as quick/quicker than my eye.

If it ticks all of the above then it might be interesting, if it fails on any one aspect then it will be of no use to me even if it were cheap.

Think I am going to be using mirror-slappers for the foreseeable.............. :)
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9VIII

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Let’s not forget that Sony hasn’t actually convinced very many people to “switch brands”.
If Sony were to release statistics for lens sales, it would probably be abysmal.
Almost every comment or video on social media about people who “switch” rely heavily on adapted lenses. Canon’s user base is not shrinking, and in some ways it might be growing as people buy Canon glass for use on Sony bodies.

It’s inevitable that Canon will compete head to head with Sony in sensor tech eventually. The reality of the situation is Sony has a short window to leverage their camera bodies into a complete system as there is ZERO friction to slow down a migration back to people using Canon glass on Canon bodies.

Don Haines

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It used to be that Canon could wait until Nikon made a move and then counter it.  In the mirrorless market that
won't be so - only because both Canon and Nikon have failed to make any significant move into that market.  Now the big dog there is Sony, and it already has a formidable lens lineup to suppport it (Having Zeiss in your corner never hurts).  Canon will need to compete with a full lens line-up (unless they can do an adapter-less EF mount) and who cares what Nikon does?

We continue to act like the possibility of a new mount has a dire impact for Canon's competitiveness, our need to buy new and sell old lenses, etc.  That's not an issue.  I honestly think you have it backwards above.  Sony will need to be competing with Canon lens-wise.  Canon will have at least 65* FF lenses ready to go the day this is announced.  EF or adaptor, we presume they will all work with FF mirrorless right out of the gate.

(*that the current can buy now figure at B&H, I imagine the real number is considerably higher than that given how many EF lenses are already out in the wild)

And of the two potential future extremes of what will happen in FF ILC...

1) Sony gets amazing at service, ergonomics, reliability, accessories and steals a ton of pro marketshare from Canon.  YAPODFC.

2) Canon finally puts out an effective and well-thought through FF mirrorless platform.  After years of false dawns, fine print and underwhelming delivery of things (other than sensors and spec sheets), Sony folks try the new Canon platform and realize that they never should have left.  Once Canon gets its FF mirrorless platform up and running (say 3 years in), it will scoop up a huge share of the A7 market.

...#2 is SO much more likely to pass than #1, IMHO.

- A

+1

Also, why is it that Sigma and Tamron keep releasing lenses first in Canon Mount, then in Nikon Mount, and then promise that at some time in the future it will be in Sony Mount... and we never see it......
The best camera is the one in your hands

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