July 22, 2018, 08:52:37 AM

Author Topic: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification - Updated  (Read 19621 times)

fullstop

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2018, 02:28:41 AM »
Dividing models with battery level stages in 2018/2019? Ist that the thing these days? c´mon Canon....

hehe, Canon "marketing differentiation" at work. somehow they need to create miniscule differences between a dozen murrorslapper models they are selling betwenn 350 and 6000 €/$.

instead of simply showing remaining battery charge as a precise percentage number. but still better than nerfing battery capacity by more than 18% by stickibg 2012 batteries into a new 2018 camera model ...

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2018, 02:28:41 AM »

ahsanford

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2018, 02:37:16 AM »
instead of simply showing remaining battery charge as a precise percentage number. but still better than nerfing battery capacity by more than 18% by stickibg 2012 batteries into a new 2018 camera model ...

The thread isn't about crappy batteries -- it's about new stuff the crappy batteries go into.  Stay on topic.   ;)

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ahsanford

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2018, 03:07:05 AM »
Update from Nokishita just now.  Link below + screen cap of Google translate.

https://www.nokishita-camera.com/2018/06/ds126721.html

Smaller rig wifi + LP-E6-like battery would presumably rule out the EOS M5 Mk II, so ... 90D or FF mirrorless?

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« Last Edit: June 25, 2018, 03:11:28 AM by ahsanford »

fullstop

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2018, 03:16:51 AM »
correct. it is really absurd to watch Canon's marketing nerfing all the way down to the tiniest firmware functions like showing remaing battery charge. truly telling when in 2018 registration descriptions of new camera models are based on "4 segment vs 6 segment battery charge indicator icons on a camera rear display".

i find it very strange that even on a higher end camera like my 5D3 i have to dive into the menu system just to check *charge remaining* as a percentage. on my EOS M that number is not to be found anywhere. maybe it is not only firmware but also those whimpy old 2012 LP-E12 batteries nerfed to not give a "real readout" of remaining charge ... probably "just to avoid depressing customers" ...  yes, Canon really can. lol

mb66energy

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2018, 03:52:59 AM »
correct. it is really absurd to watch Canon's marketing nerfing all the way down to the tiniest firmware functions like showing remaing battery charge. truly telling when in 2018 registration descriptions of new camera models are based on "4 segment vs 6 segment battery charge indicator icons on a camera rear display".

[...]

Calculating the battery charge is much more than a tiny firmware function. It is a matter of measurement done by the power conversion system and/or the cpu + measurement of battery temperature. This needs some hardware which would not fit easily in smaller cameras and costs ... material + programming + testing.

A more detailed battery charge control is therefore a hint for a camera dedicated to professional use including an "intelligent" battery maybe with integrated temperature sensors and a communication protocol between battery and camera.

The large capacity battery and grainier battery display leads me too to the conclusion that it is probably a FF mirrorless with good video capability - as videographer I would like to see how many minutes I have until the battery is empty. While you may take 1000 photos with one charge over 5 days, video might deliver only 150 min per charge.
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fullstop

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #20 on: June 25, 2018, 03:58:02 AM »
Canapologist BS!  ;D

a percentage battery charge indicator can be and is implemented in even the cheapest smartphones. Luckily those are not made by Canon ...  ;D

Mr Majestyk

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2018, 04:00:24 AM »
But we were told no new DSLR's this year, now we can expect 3!. Not that I'm complaining, but for Canon needs to hit some home runs real soon.

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2018, 04:00:24 AM »

mb66energy

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2018, 05:08:02 AM »
Canapologist BS!  ;D

a percentage battery charge indicator can be and is implemented in even the cheapest smartphones. Luckily those are not made by Canon ...  ;D

Yes, I have built a scale with load cell, arduino and lcd display for about 20 EUR and you can display @ 10ug resolution while repeatability is roughly 10mg (at the moment without thermal isolation of the load cell which will cost three times the money and 20 times the development to come down to e.g. 1mg real resolution.

So
(1) How good are battery indicators of smart phones? My 700EUR Nokia shows 100% for hours after I switched to charge it between 20 ... 90% (not 0 ... 100%).
(2) Do smartphones have current dynamics between 10uA and 3 Amps peak load? I don't think so.
(3) Is the standard use case of temperature for smartphones not between 20°C (room) and 34°C (pocket close to body)? Definitely - but not for cameras.
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crashpc

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2018, 05:11:36 AM »
mb66energy
That is nonsense really. Better measurements take about no hardware resources, and very little software resources. It actually goes along the way of interpreting real percentage by squares nobody understands to....
That is way too stewpid to do these days. At least give it per pixel amount of battery left. So you can see gradually lets say in 30 pixels (battery indicator width/lenght).

mb66energy

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2018, 05:29:02 AM »
mb66energy
That is nonsense really. Better measurements take about no hardware resources, and very little software resources. It actually goes along the way of interpreting real percentage by squares nobody understands to....
That is way too stewpid to do these days. At least give it per pixel amount of battery left. So you can see gradually lets say in 30 pixels (battery indicator width/lenght).

crashpc:
If you say my remarks are nonsense please make "senseful" explanations how "Better measurements take about no hardware resources" - I am ready to learn how industry has overcome 50 years of interpreting battery capacity WITH better hardware resources ...
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weixing

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2018, 05:45:59 AM »
Hi,
mb66energy
That is nonsense really. Better measurements take about no hardware resources, and very little software resources. It actually goes along the way of interpreting real percentage by squares nobody understands to....
That is way too stewpid to do these days. At least give it per pixel amount of battery left. So you can see gradually lets say in 30 pixels (battery indicator width/lenght).
    Accurate battery measurement is not easy especially for device that don't draw power constantly.... for notebook and mobile phone, you can calibrate your battery to get a more "accurate" measurement. But for DSLR, I'm sure how you going to calibrate your DSLR battery? Since when you are not clicking, the power usage is basically minimum. For mirrorless camera, I guess it might be easier since the camera is always processing image.

    Have a nice day.

neuroanatomist

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #26 on: June 25, 2018, 06:20:18 AM »
crashpc:
If you say my remarks are nonsense please make "senseful" explanations how "Better measurements take about no hardware resources" - I am ready to learn how industry has overcome 50 years of interpreting battery capacity WITH better hardware resources ...

Don't hold your breath. This seems to be a case of technical criticism by someone who lacks relevant technical knowledge.  That sort of thing is regrettably common on this forum.
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crashpc

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2018, 06:24:14 AM »
DOH.

Yes, it might even depend on the battery level interpretation. If one wants to see steady decline of the battery level, that is the hard one.

If you´re about real "power left" indication, hell make two maps/curves for heavy load and light load (laboratory measurements using real loads), then apply few coeficients for real voltages on real piece of your accumulator (in-body calibration after few charging and discharging sessions, and even re-calibration after that, as battery capacity and current capabilities go down), and you´re done. Nothing one good engineer could not make in one or two days. With a power supply, volt meter, amper meter, a resistor (or real camera) and a logger.

You might find difficulty, uncertainty, less then ideal precision here and there, but it will always be million times more usable and precise than three to four bars.
For my previous EOS M, they did poor job already, as when I saw first bar to go dim, I knew I have only miutes left before it dies on me. With M6, it is much better, but still weak.
Gosh, it´s Canon, the leading company, right????

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2018, 06:24:14 AM »

crashpc

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #28 on: June 25, 2018, 06:27:43 AM »
crashpc:
If you say my remarks are nonsense please make "senseful" explanations how "Better measurements take about no hardware resources" - I am ready to learn how industry has overcome 50 years of interpreting battery capacity WITH better hardware resources ...

Don't hold your breath. This seems to be a case of technical criticism by someone who lacks relevant technical knowledge.  That sort of thing is regrettably common on this forum.

Heh, when you mentioned it, that is slight miss from your another attempt to put down people personally.
DYIer, repair technician and engineer in electronics for 12 years now. :-)
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neuroanatomist

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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #29 on: June 25, 2018, 06:30:39 AM »
Back to the actual topic, a possible FF MILC using an LP-E6 battery is encouraging. It suggests a body size of at least an xxD series, which I think is far preferable to a smaller form factor that becomes an ergonomic challenge with larger lenses like f/2.8 zooms.
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Re: New Canon Camera Bodies Appear for Certification
« Reply #29 on: June 25, 2018, 06:30:39 AM »