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Author Topic: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]  (Read 287313 times)

chengpenguin

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #765 on: February 29, 2012, 07:26:21 AM »
also found this on another blog:

http://www.clubsnap.com/forums/canon/1050868-something-exciting-coming-canon-singapore-2nd-march.html

"Have been invited to a Canon product launch on the 2nd of March. Their Tag line "Speed. Quality, How do this matter to you in the world of imaging""

This is a forum, and yes, the 2nd March Canon invite is legit.

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #765 on: February 29, 2012, 07:26:21 AM »

sublime LightWorks

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #766 on: February 29, 2012, 07:44:52 AM »
Its funny how this thread has grown over the past week.

We started with it better have "1Dx AF & Metering, 7fps, 22Mpix and better ISO noise than the 1Dx."  Now we're looking at what looks to be the reality of "Simplified 1Dx AF and Metering, 6fps, 22Mpix and roughly the same or a little less performance in ISO than the 1Dx."

For an estimated $3500, possible body only price.

I'm a 5D2 and a 7D owner (and a PhaseOne as well having inherited my dad's Hasselblad 500C and some Ziess glass).  I'll wait until the actual announcement to see what's what, but my decision looks to be going to a 1Dx by EOY.  By the looks of it, this new 5D3 is not the camera I'm looking for.

My shooting is across the spectrum of subjects....weddings, studio, sports.  When I started in digital, I had a Rebel Xt, Xti, 40D and moved to the a 50D.  Then I got my 5Dmk2....I love that camera's IQ, but for other than studio, I hate it's AF.  That's why I got the 7D.  I needed a camera that could tracking moving targets like professional cyclists, equestrian jumping, and kids football, baseball, and soccer, and yet double as a wedding and studio backup.  It does that.  What it does not have is the IQ of the 5D2.

Now, I find myself needing features such as a weather sealed body, strong AF and metering functions, fast frame rates, dual CF cards, but coupled with an IQ of the 5D2.  The 6 fps of this new camera and it's ISO performance, abet a rumor at this time, does not meet my demands.  The 1Dx will be the better camera, no doubt about it.  I strongly believe Canon will not let the IQ crown go to a $3500 body over it's $6800 machine.

So, while I will wait to confirm all that will be, it looks to me that my path lies down the 1Dx route.  I'd have to say, while I have been shooting Canon since the Rebel film days, if I didn't have a ton of Canon L glass and were just starting out today, I'd probably be buying the Nikon D4, with a D800 as my second body.
« Last Edit: February 29, 2012, 11:07:47 AM by sublime LightWorks »

K-amps

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #767 on: February 29, 2012, 07:45:53 AM »
My argument is not that the 5D2 has a 'pro AF' but that it is not as useless system as is regularly portrayed.

With a f/2.8 lens the 5D2 still is the best in low light on that centre point

PS I still would not classify the 7D as a pro AF either - just the best at that price point

Brian why are you lurking the Forums disguised as a 40D /EF-S shooter.... trying to hoodwink us eh?  :D
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image2paint

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #768 on: February 29, 2012, 08:19:19 AM »
Quote "I love that camera's IQ, but for other than studio, I hate it's AF. I needed a camera that could tracking moving targets like professional cyclists, equestrian jumping, and kids football, baseball, and soccer.

Hahaha says the guy who posts a "centre" weighted "DOG" photo all on the same image plane showing the 5d mark ii's focus capabilities. God this is priceless! Hypocrit !

sublime LightWorks

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #769 on: February 29, 2012, 08:23:20 AM »
Don't u just love people posting images of their pets, babies and children :-) and in a 5d mark iii forum haha even better.

Dog- this is an example of my centred weighted image ! See how good the autofocus is ! See !

You missed the point - according to the non 5D2 users this shot is impossible as the AF is 'useless' It is relevant as there is a clamour to move away from the useless system to a 1DX level AF.

This is not one of my pets either.

Brian, I agree with you.  The AF isn't terrible, it's just "old" compared to a lot of current technology, in fact it was a bit old when it was released.  The places where it falls down (in my experience), is in very low light (same issues I have seen with a 1D4 I used from a friend and I mean VERY low light), and in tracking fast moving objects (20+ mph).  The in-focus rate is significantly lower than say my 7D in the action tracking modes (AI Servo).  When you couple that with a sub-4 fps rate, it's really crippled for sports work.

Is this to say I have not had success using the 5D2's AF in sports?  Hell no, I've gotten some excellent shots, and when in focus with a really good lens (i.e. 135 f/2 or 70-200 f/2.8), every single person can pick out which shot was a 5D2 and which was a 7D.  100% of the time.

What is true is that I get far more keepers in sports work with the 7D than the 5D2 due to it's more advanced AF and it's faster frame rate (relative to the 5D2).  What's rumored for the 5D3 is going to improve it's abilities in this area, but if the frame rate is going to be 6 fps, that is not going to satisfy a lot of serious sports shooters (like me) who do get paid for some of that work. 

Let's face it....6 fps is what a 50D could do.  Unless Canon has a 7D update planned to be a "baby APS-C 1Dx", like the original 7D was a baby APS-C 1Dmk3, there is going to be a gap in the product line.

My wish is that this 5D3 has a frame rate of 8 fps (same as the 7D) and an AF and metering that incorporates advances from the 1Dx.  I've said this a dozen times before here that it's a fantasy that it will have the full 1Dx AF....not going to happen, all reasons previously stated.  Those clinging to this are in for a disappointment.

If it has 22Mpix, 8fps, an AF someplace between the 7D and the 1D4 and 1Dx, dual cards (CF only please!!!), some decent weather sealing, an 802.11n wifi option, and the nimble handling of the 7D, I'd reconsider by path down the 1Dx route.  I could see buying two of them and selling the 5D2 and the 7D, and come in under the single 1Dx price after the smoke clears.

But I don't think its going to have the frame rate I need, there is a big difference between 6fps and 8fps.  It means the difference between getting the horse exactly in mid-jump, or the cyclist is the right frame, or the kid kicking that soccer ball at just the right point of impact.  It's why we have cameras like the 1Dx and the D4 that shoot 10-12-14 fps.  The sports segment of photography demands its.

You know, you have to wonder.....if Canon had released a "5D2-Sx" say 2 years after the 5D2, and had just added the six hidden AF points as visible and made them cross type, improved the AF software from lessons learned, and bumped the frame rate to 6 fps using the Digic 4 processor, you have to wonder what people would be saying today about the "5D2-Sx".


sublime LightWorks

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #770 on: February 29, 2012, 08:25:39 AM »
Quote "I love that camera's IQ, but for other than studio, I hate it's AF. I needed a camera that could tracking moving targets like professional cyclists, equestrian jumping, and kids football, baseball, and soccer.

Hahaha says the guy who posts a "centre" weighted "DOG" photo all on the same image plane showing the 5d mark ii's focus capabilities. God this is priceless! Hypocrit !

Dude.....I didn't post that photo, that was not my posting.  It was Brian's.  Go back and check again.  You quoted my posting above, but you referenced a photo and posting that is not mine.  Can't you keep your thoughts straight, or it that too difficult this early in the morning?

You just made a complete ass out of yourself.  That is PRICELESS.  What a jackass.

« Last Edit: February 29, 2012, 08:32:33 AM by sublime LightWorks »

WarStreet

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #771 on: February 29, 2012, 08:38:33 AM »
53 pages, and read every post......

I am happy with the 5DIII rumored specs, speed is an important factor in a camera and it adds value to it. Pretty sure that it will have a 1DX AF with minor difference if any, thanks to the competition of the D800 AF. 

In the past, we were thinking that the 5DIII would be great with a 7D AF, and some even said that a 7D AF in the 5DIII would be a wishful thinking. Now, I don't expect anything less than the 1DX AF, and really happy that both Canon and Nikon are raising the bar that high.

The rumored addition of the dual card was a bit of a surprise at first, but again the D800 has that too, so we should expect it. I remember posters saying that they ended up buying a 1DsIII instead of the 5DII just due to the dual cards. I guess it is a risk for pros shooting an event and later finding out there is a problem with their single card. I would have preferred dual CF too, but having the CF/SD option is already good, after all the 1 series where using this combination too.

For the same reason that the D800 is priced $3000, I doubt the 5DIII will be priced more. The exchange rates and all other economical stuff, should be similar for both companies, being based in the same country. I won't give much weight on the price rumor. 

So, let's see if on Friday, it will be the end of this thread, due to a newer one with the official Canon announcement :)

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #771 on: February 29, 2012, 08:38:33 AM »

nesarajah

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #772 on: February 29, 2012, 08:44:57 AM »
Not sure if i should go with the Mark III . Used to own one , now i use a 7D and I love it .
The only thing I hate about the 7D is how far away I have to stand with the 85 mm to get a shot .
FF is a different beast altogether.

:)

Brad Trent

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #773 on: February 29, 2012, 08:56:43 AM »
I wonder how many people believe that ONLY the centre point can be used for AF? Well here is a picture from last night, in poor light, with the 5D2 using all points AF. According to the pundits the AF system on the 5D2 is so bad that this is not possible - so here is yet more proof that the AF system isn't that bad - exif is intact is you want to see it.

I've found in low key studio setup with just low power modeling lamps and a totally dark room the other points will not even lock on with an f4 lens period. same lens on the 1D no problem any point lock on strait away
but in this situation its not a problem to focus and recompose using the center point.

now that i've gotten over the shock of going from a 1D AF system to the 5D AF and got ways around the problems i encountered it doesnt bother me. I'm mostly looking forward to having an AF i dont have to worry about. It does'nt have to be the all singing all dancing 1Dx system. I just want it to work with having to mess around with it.

And i find AI servo back focuses so i just stopped trying to use that on the 5D at all

Also I have found the 5D mk2 AF system works extremely well with my 600f4.5 FD lens...  ;D

I have always felt the main drawback of the 5D is its focusing system. I got my mkII after having a 1Ds and I basically had to relearn how to focus...and it's not like the 1Ds was anything to write home about! But it did handle low-light situations MUCH better than the 5D ever could. I am the type of photographer Canon was aiming the 5D at...I shoot portraits, both studio and location...and I'm sure they thought for that type of shooting the focus system would be fine. Obviously, they got enough pushback from photographers to change that with the next model.

I've actually gotten tons of emails since yesterday asking me if I'm serious about changing from Canon to Nikon over the new & improved 5D...lemme clarify a bit. The last thing I wanna do is hafta relearn an entire camera system, especially a system that is not even considered secondary in my workflow. I pull out the Canons maybe 15% of the time...is it that important to me to even think of selling off my Canon gear and move to the D800 for a few extra pixels? Like I said earlier...I'm gonna wait until these things are on the street and I'll give both the D800 and whatever new 5D comes out and make my mind up then. Unlike about 95% of the people who hang out in chat rooms, I've learned that trusting a camera company about what they claim their newest and bestest product will do often has me holding a very expensive bag. Since I switched to digital ten years ago, I've owned a lot of very expensive technology that didn't perform exactly as advertised and was replaced far sooner than anybody would like with the next best thing. I'm pretty happy with my current gear even though I'm sure the newer stuff will be 'better', but I can't lose sight of how much better I really need. I would love a camera that doesn't hunt around for a focus point in a low light or backlit situation, but I've managed with my current 5D for years. Likewise, a cleaner & sharper file is always gonna be better, but until I see how MUCH cleaner & sharper the files both the D800 and new 5D spit out are, I'm not gonna be the crash test dummy who kicks up over $3 Grand to be the first kid on my block to have one! Because of that...and despite what I said earlier about my frustration with the lack of information coming from Canon...it would still be a pretty big move to have to move to Nikon. I've been shooting with Canons since I dumped my F3's for the first EOS-1 more than two decades ago. After all that time, I simply know how to use the damn thing In the dark! I looked at a Nikon for the first time in years just yesterday when I was met a friend at B&H to help him buy a new camera, and the layout just made me feel like an amateur! I'm sure you can get used to anything, but damn...I don't wanna start learning new cameras at my age!

If the new version of the 5D just has the promised better focusing system and improved noise...even if it is only 22mp...I would be inclined to stick with Canon. Whatever extra bells & whistles that have been talked about that might be included (improved video means zip to me) will be gravy, but not anythng that would make me upgrade. But if I can see a side-by-side with the D800 that shows me the Nikon has an obvious advantage over the Canon, all bets are off.

RedEye

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5D3 Design Standard
« Reply #774 on: February 29, 2012, 10:48:50 AM »
I would voice the idea that there is a slighted preference for a DSLR that not only functions well but also has a beautiful design and is distinctive.  I don't think I would be comfortable with ferrari red as some hassy models have done for marketing, but I think a distinctive case design with ergonomics to match would add some value to the new model for me. 
Some of the design features of the GX1 are accommodating; probably not the best for a full size DSLR but its the perception of the theory which matters. 

jchl97

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Re: 5D3 Design Standard
« Reply #775 on: February 29, 2012, 11:00:05 AM »
I would voice the idea that there is a slighted preference for a DSLR that not only functions well but also has a beautiful design and is distinctive.  I don't think I would be comfortable with ferrari red as some hassy models have done for marketing, but I think a distinctive case design with ergonomics to match would add some value to the new model for me. 
Some of the design features of the GX1 are accommodating; probably not the best for a full size DSLR but its the perception of the theory which matters.

That's why apparently the new 5D is adopting the curvier look of the 7D, which in my opinion is simply sexy.

awinphoto

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Re: 5D3 Design Standard
« Reply #776 on: February 29, 2012, 11:10:52 AM »
I'm not sure about color accents on the camera... it doesn't need it... I did notice, at least to my impression, that the corners of the safari images we seen on this site that it appears to be "rounder" especially on the bottom and top edge corners... It could have been the angle of the shots or my perception, but that's what jumped out at me...  Color, shape, whatever it could be a square black box for all I care as long as it delivers superior IQ for the price, I'm good.  =)
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briansquibb

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #777 on: February 29, 2012, 11:14:59 AM »
My argument is not that the 5D2 has a 'pro AF' but that it is not as useless system as is regularly portrayed.

With a f/2.8 lens the 5D2 still is the best in low light on that centre point

PS I still would not classify the 7D as a pro AF either - just the best at that price point

Brian why are you lurking the Forums disguised as a 40D /EF-S shooter.... trying to hoodwink us eh?  :D

Because I got flamed for showing my kit. It seemed like the politics of envy raised its ugly head. I do have a 40D - this is the one I leave in the car in case I need a camera. I have had it for 4 years and wont get rid of it - it still works well within its limitations.

« Last Edit: February 29, 2012, 11:26:03 AM by briansquibb »

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #777 on: February 29, 2012, 11:14:59 AM »

briansquibb

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #778 on: February 29, 2012, 11:21:52 AM »
Quote "I love that camera's IQ, but for other than studio, I hate it's AF. I needed a camera that could tracking moving targets like professional cyclists, equestrian jumping, and kids football, baseball, and soccer.

Hahaha says the guy who posts a "centre" weighted "DOG" photo all on the same image plane showing the 5d mark ii's focus capabilities. God this is priceless! Hypocrit !

Dude.....I didn't post that photo, that was not my posting.  It was Brian's.  Go back and check again.  You quoted my posting above, but you referenced a photo and posting that is not mine.  Can't you keep your thoughts straight, or it that too difficult this early in the morning?

You just made a complete ass out of yourself.  That is PRICELESS.  What a jackass.

+1  8) 8) 8)

Especially as the picture was clearly labelled as an all AF points shot in low light :D And obviously never tried photographing a lively young terrier  in low light ??? ??? ???
« Last Edit: February 29, 2012, 12:06:02 PM by briansquibb »

D_Rochat

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #779 on: February 29, 2012, 11:49:57 AM »
Now people are getting flamed for gear and posting example images...... This thread has gone down hill. Grow up.

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Re: *UPDATE* The Next 5D on March 2, 2012 [CR3]
« Reply #779 on: February 29, 2012, 11:49:57 AM »