New Canon Speedlites and ST-E3!

[neuroanatomist]

The only indication I've seen is a post here: http://www.bhphotovideo.com/indepth/canon/announcements/new-canon-600ex-rt-speedlite-flash-powerhouse stating that Canon will release a legacy radio trigger add-on, I guess once everybody who is in a hurry bought multiple 600rt flashes.

You're referring to the statement by an anonymous poster that 'a Canon rep told me...'  Not the most reliable of sources...

I expect Canon will release one down the line, but first they'll release a 430EX II replacement with -RT, then wait for sales of both the 600EX-RT and it's new smaller cousin to slow down, before they release an RF receiver to allow older flashes to work with the RT system.

[Marsu42]

You're referring to the statement by an anonymous poster that 'a Canon rep told me...'  Not the most reliable of sources...

Yep, I know - that's why I was asking here. Waiting for a Canon legacy trigger wouldn't be a problem for many, but it would be bad if they *only* could trigger Canon flashes and not dumb, cheaper ttl ones. Do you think Canon would do that to its valued customers? Without this information, it's very hard what way to go - 3rd party or Canon.

[neuroanatomist]

...it would be bad if they *only* could trigger Canon flashes and not dumb, cheaper ttl ones. Do you think Canon would do that to its valued customers?

Yes, I think Canon would very likely do exactly that...

[AvTvM]

I expect Canon will release one down the line, but first they'll release a 430EX II replacement with -RT, then wait for sales of both the 600EX-RT and it's new smaller cousin to slow down, before they release an RF receiver to allow older flashes to work with the RT system.

exactly my expectation. It would be so truly Canon to handle it that way.

* 600EX-RT is a 580EX II with radio wireless and 200m reflector added, but price nearly doubled
* ST-E3 lacks AF-light capability but is still bloody expensive
* Radio receivers enabling seemless radio control setups with new and existing Canon flashes  being maliciously withheld ...

so incredibly wrong, so incredibly irksome, so incredibly short-sighted.

Radio receivers at a very reasonable price (think USD/Euro 99 !) would lead to really quick propagation of teh Canon wireless system in the market. It would still require purchase of at least an ST-E3 or one 600EX-RT ... and would make that purcase really worthwile.  And if they like the radio-wireless experience, many users would sooner rather than later add additional 600EX-RT's (and other future radio-controlled flashes) to their setups. 

Withholding simple receivers for 580 and 430 - at least for the version II's [if that is necessary to tie the entire setup into the camera menu system] and withholding firmware updates for pre-2012 bodies (5D 2, 7D) to also allow use of the mixed ETTL-manual "group" features on 600EX-RT/ST-E3 just makes a lot of people sit on the sidelines and wait to see whether Canon eventually gets its act together.

I for one, am holding off buying into the Canon radio-wireless system, until all components including receivers are out, prices have come down and a firmware update has finally enabled second curtain sync via the Canon wireless ETTL protocol and until my 7D gets a firmware upgrade that wil allow it to control radio-flashes exactly like 2012 EOS models (5D 3 and 1D X). If Canon charges outrageously I may pick up PWs or Phottix Odin to run my 580/II's and 430's  radio-controlled.  Until then I stick with optical control using the 7D's popup master-flash.

[AvTvM]

...it would be bad if they *only* could trigger Canon flashes and not dumb, cheaper ttl ones. Do you think Canon would do that to its valued customers?

Yes, I think Canon would very likely do exactly that...

THAT I would have no problem with. Original Canon radio receivers working seemlessly with Canon Speedlites 580EX/II and 430EX/II  would be sufficient. Even I would consider it asking too much from Canon to expect them to include ETTL-control for Yongnuos.  That task is up to Yongnuo et al - if they can reverse engineer it and make it work at significantly lower cost, fine. If not, then not.

But I do expect Canon to help users to tie their 580/430's [at least the Mk. II's!] into a Canon radio-controlled flash setup. After all, their clients may have purchased these flashes as recently as only days befor the 600EX-RT was announced or became available locally. Canon owes one to their clients on that count as far as I am concerned.

[FunPhotons]

Heck, I'd be happy if they just shipped the damn ST-E3

[MarkWebbPhoto]

I currently have 3 600EX-RT units and I am in love with them. I'm working up a review right now but here's a quick post for naysayers.

Shot with 5D MK II
Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS II
Two 600EX-RT speedlites flashed at full power, I left them in the frame for you to see their exact location
Triggered with 1 600EX-RT on the hot-shoe
HSS was enabled
Shot in broad daylight
1/8000 sec, f/3.5, ISO 100

This setup took only a couple minutes and weighed far less than my Elinchrom Ranger RX Speed AS kit and was much smaller. The lights work great despite a few limitations of using an older model body.

[kdsand]

I currently have 3 600EX-RT units and I am in love with them. I'm working up a review right now but here's a quick post for naysayers.

Shot with 5D MK II
Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS II
Two 600EX-RT speedlites flashed at full power, I left them in the frame for you to see their exact location
Triggered with 1 600EX-RT on the hot-shoe
HSS was enabled
Shot in broad daylight
1/8000 sec, f/3.5, ISO 100

This setup took only a couple minutes and weighed far less than my Elinchrom Ranger RX Speed AS kit and was much smaller. The lights work great despite a few limitations of using an older model body.

 I'm sure it simplifies your kit/setup time.

 Ouch could you have found a less photojenic model? 

[FunPhotons]

Yep, I've got three as well, and a ST-E3 I've been waiting forever for. I'm really happy I waited until these guys, it's a small, light and flexible system that works really well. I can afford some expensive flashes, can't afford lugging lots of stuff around.

[MarkWebbPhoto]

I currently have 3 600EX-RT units and I am in love with them. I'm working up a review right now but here's a quick post for naysayers.

Shot with 5D MK II
Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS II
Two 600EX-RT speedlites flashed at full power, I left them in the frame for you to see their exact location
Triggered with 1 600EX-RT on the hot-shoe
HSS was enabled
Shot in broad daylight
1/8000 sec, f/3.5, ISO 100

This setup took only a couple minutes and weighed far less than my Elinchrom Ranger RX Speed AS kit and was much smaller. The lights work great despite a few limitations of using an older model body.

 I'm sure it simplifies your kit/setup time.

 Ouch could you have found a less photojenic model? 

Best to experiment with friends before working with clients with a new setup! I'll be sure to grab a hot babe next time, in the meanwhile I just have photos of my sweaty friend Sholten after he received a bad haircut haha.

[DarkKnightNine]

I have two 600ex-rts on order; when will the ST-E3-RT be available?  No one seems to have the ST-E3-RT.

I have it and been using it for a while, what would you like to know? Shot the attached picture with it and two 600EX-RTs outside in the rain.

[Marsu42]

Shot the attached picture with it and two 600EX-RTs outside in the rain.

You seem to be very confident in your equipment's weather sealing :-o ... any difference between the 600rt & 580ex2 here?

[MarkWebbPhoto]

I have written a very detailed review on the 600EX-RT, it includes some tips for setups and I shot a variety of different events to cover as many people as possible who would be interested in the new system.

Overall I am very impressed with the new system and glad to see that high-speed sync works like a charm.

http://markwebbphoto.com/blog/2012/6/canon-600ex-rt-review

[Marsu42]

My review and guide for the 600EX-RT - http://markwebbphoto.com/blog/2012/6/canon-600ex-rt-review

Concerning the limitations of the 600rt and 5d2: I read Canon's manual p.51 and don't quite understand it :-o ... Canon says the the x-sync drop of 1 stop and non-working hss is *only* for radio remote operation, *not* for optical remote?

Despite the many warnings that the maximum sync speed will be 1-stop lower and that radio-transmitter shooting will be disabled, I have only run into one limitation so far with my 5D MK II and my 1D MK IV.

You're saying you find that the x-sync actually works at *full* speed with the 5d2/600rt combination despite what Canon says (and the flash giving the <!Tv> warning) ?!?

My friend Marcus was one of the first folks I know in my area to get the 5D MK III so I wanted to test to see if HSS had changed any. In our findings the 5D2 was just as good as the 5D3. Nothing gained or lost between the bodies except a few menu options and maybe something else I am missing.

And in addition to the above, you're saying that hss works with the 5d2/600rt combination on radio remote even if Canon says the exact opposite?!? Sorry if I mis-read your review, but I really want to be clear about this.

[FunPhotons]

Yes, as verified by Syl Arena who was the only photog to get pre-release versions of the flash as far as I know, hss works with the 5DMKII at all shutter speeds. He says this again in his Canon Professional Network article on the flash. I've also verified it with my 5DMKII. On the 1-stop loss there also, while I haven't done extensive testing, I haven't noticed any problems.

Presumably Canon is being conservative, and it doesn't work with all prior camera bodies, but I haven't heard of any tests with anything other than a 5DMKII.