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Author Topic: New Canon 5D mark III raws  (Read 16898 times)

LetTheRightLensIn

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #30 on: March 06, 2012, 09:10:10 PM »
Comparing the 5D2 RAWs to the 5D3 RAWs in ACR and Photoshop it looks like the 5D3 is two-thirds of a stop better for high ISO SNR.

Lots of dangers in the comparison though since we don't know what ACR does to them for each camera or even if the ISO stops are rated the same way or not.

We really need DxO for the SNR measurements.

But looking at these, I'd say a solid 2/3 stop advantage for 5D3 over 5D2 SNR.

At ISO 100 it seems the 5D3 won't do much for you, early reports are basically no increase in dynamic range and only modestly better banding (still likely worse than the 1Ds3 at ISO 100). The dynamic range tests were carried out using the masking region though so there is a modest chance that they might not fully tell the true story at all, although they probably do.

Based on all of this, sometimes a bit sketchy info, the 5D3 may offer no advantage over the 5D2 at low ISO but a solid 2/3rds of a stop advantage at high ISO (almost D3s-level, but the greater MP actually makes it effectively better than the D3s since you can NR more and still have the same final detail*).

(The D800 would offer 50% more MP and perhaps a solid 2.5 stops better dynamic range at ISO 100 and perhaps between 1/3 stop worse to 1 stop better performance at high ISO. Based on that, the D800 most likely does have an all around better sensor, although it is not set in stone yet.*)


* note how despite all the talk about how high MP cams make a mess of things, the ones with higher MP don't seem to be doing so badly compared to one with lower MP
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 09:24:23 PM by LetTheRightLensIn »

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #30 on: March 06, 2012, 09:10:10 PM »

melbournite

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #31 on: March 06, 2012, 09:11:42 PM »
Talk it up boys.  The more good stuff I see and hear about the 5DIII the more excited I get about it's arrival in the post!

jdavis37

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #32 on: March 06, 2012, 09:30:09 PM »
After installing the ACR release candidate, I downloaded the 5D ISO6400 CR2 file as well as the Nikon D4 NEF of same file with NR set to 0. While I realize all of this is premature I was actually quite surprised to see how well the 5D3 file looked after downsampling to 16 MP. There wasn't as much difference between the 2 as I had expected. Not sure this means a whole lot given the files are still beta as is the ACR release candidate but i was really expecting the D4 to be a lot better than the 5d3 and in this example it wasn't the case. I did not, however, do any post processing work on the files.

I don't think we will have long to wait.  It sounds like the first shipment is on the boat, if the March 17 delivery statements for Canada are correct. 

Chuck Westfall was quoted as saying that a large inventory has been stockpiled, and two production lines at different factories are kicking them out in large numbers, so we can soon compare between our old MK II and our new MK III's.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 10:08:14 PM by Mt Spokane Photography »

BaconBets

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #33 on: March 06, 2012, 09:44:34 PM »
The D800 is not the successor to the D700....who thinks Nikon is going to turn everything on its head later this year by announcing the D700s. I can feel it coming....and those sneaky Nikon people might just put their flagship sensor in it once again. I like Canon, but nobody can deny that the D4 is a horse.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 09:53:02 PM by BaconBets »

DavidRiesenberg

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #34 on: March 06, 2012, 10:10:28 PM »
Same could be said about Canon as well. Who's to say that Canon won't actually release the rumored 5DX. High 30s - low 40s MPs.

jrista

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #35 on: March 06, 2012, 10:25:38 PM »
The most interesting sample photo to me is the very last one, the one with the X-Rite color checker cards and the resolution diagrams. Looking at the radial moire test bubbles...I can't really see much color moire at all. There is obviously normal monochromatic moire (simple matter of physics there)...but color moire seems largely absent (but certainly a welcome absent). There is some visible color moire in the pink and blue bubble, and maybe a little in the red bubble, but the rest seem to lack any color moire at all.
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V8Beast

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #36 on: March 06, 2012, 10:25:52 PM »
(The D800 would offer 50% more MP and perhaps a solid 2.5 stops better dynamic range at ISO 100 and perhaps between 1/3 stop worse to 1 stop better performance at high ISO. Based on that, the D800 most likely does have an all around better sensor, although it is not set in stone yet.*)

How do you figure the D800's DR is 2.5 stops better than the 5DIII? Just curious.

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #36 on: March 06, 2012, 10:25:52 PM »

awinphoto

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #37 on: March 06, 2012, 10:32:46 PM »
I downloaded the raws but my photoshop cs5 cant load them nor DPP.. what update do I need to do this?  Regarding image resource, I compared apples to apples Canons 5d3 vs Canons 5d2 on same images and the 5d3 looked sharper overall in almost all the ISO ranges compared to the 5d2, which seems to differ from internet sample images.  All things being the same, if this is indeed the case that the 5d3 is cleaner and sharper than the 5d2, i'm game.  It's a shame they dont have a D800 to compare against so we can really comb down to brass tax and know where we stand...
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justsomedude

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #38 on: March 06, 2012, 10:39:20 PM »
I looked at the images and camera settings in the exif, and was disappointed.

The sample images are really not what should be used to see low light high iso performance.  They are taken in bright light, which will reduce the noise level and give overly optomistic results, assuming that you really want low light usage.  The lighting varies, but is close to ev 10.

But by comparing to other models in the IR test database, you can find relative improvement across various models of camera body.

V8Beast

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #39 on: March 06, 2012, 10:39:33 PM »
I've spent way more time pixel peeping than I care to admit, but these raw files are very promising. With some noise reduction and a quick unsharp mask, I wouldn't hesitate to shoot at ISO 12,800 for images that will be printed at 5x7 or smaller. There's still plenty of detail. Heck, the jpegs look pretty good, too.

ippikiokami

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #40 on: March 06, 2012, 10:40:02 PM »
Played with the 25600 raw a little bit in Topaz Denoise and all I can say is Sweet Baby Jesus this generation of cameras is amazing.

If the AF is as accurate as it should be it's a major upgrade from my 5d II (which i'm happily keeping btw. It didn't all the sudden start taking crap pictures). I was going to bite the bullet and grab a 1DX but I might skip a 1 series generation this time around

jrista

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #41 on: March 06, 2012, 10:45:54 PM »
(The D800 would offer 50% more MP and perhaps a solid 2.5 stops better dynamic range at ISO 100 and perhaps between 1/3 stop worse to 1 stop better performance at high ISO. Based on that, the D800 most likely does have an all around better sensor, although it is not set in stone yet.*)

How do you figure the D800's DR is 2.5 stops better than the 5DIII? Just curious.

He can't. Theoretically, the maximum possible DR would be 14 stops with a full 14-bit image sensor and image processing pipeline (think about the nature of a bit...every successive bit has twice the significance...or value-holding power...as the previous; a doubling; in other words, every bit is one EV, or one stop, difference in dynamic range.) The 5D II achieved about 11.86 stops of DR, and the D7000 (Nikon's highest DR camera) achieved about 13.87 stops of DR (based on DXO data, which measures DR from the point where a single photon strikes the sensor to the point where the first pixel is fully saturated). Assuming the 5D III has not improved at all on the DR front, the maximum difference in DR would be about 2.01 stops. I think most of us are pretty solidly confident that Canon has resolved their read noise issues, and are probably getting much closer to that 13.9 stops of maximum DR that Sony Exmor sensors are getting...so the difference is probably less than a stop, (personally I hope and believe it will be in the realm of 0.25 or less stops), of DR difference between any one of the 1D X, 5D III, D800, D4 and D7000.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2012, 10:48:33 PM by jrista »
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LetTheRightLensIn

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #42 on: March 06, 2012, 11:22:12 PM »
(The D800 would offer 50% more MP and perhaps a solid 2.5 stops better dynamic range at ISO 100 and perhaps between 1/3 stop worse to 1 stop better performance at high ISO. Based on that, the D800 most likely does have an all around better sensor, although it is not set in stone yet.*)

How do you figure the D800's DR is 2.5 stops better than the 5DIII? Just curious.

Because someone measured the ISO100 read noise of the 5D3 (using masked area of the image, granted that is not ideal) and measured essentially the same exact read noise as for the 5D2 and because the D800 uses and Exmor sensor, most of which have had a good 2-2.5 stops on the 5D2 (and the difference is even greater since they are also free of pattern banding which bothers the eye more).

We will see, but things, unfortunately, seem to be pointing this way. I hope it won't be the case, but....

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #42 on: March 06, 2012, 11:22:12 PM »

LetTheRightLensIn

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #43 on: March 06, 2012, 11:24:19 PM »
I downloaded the raws but my photoshop cs5 cant load them nor DPP.. what update do I need to do this?  Regarding image resource, I compared apples to apples Canons 5d3 vs Canons 5d2 on same images and the 5d3 looked sharper overall in almost all the ISO ranges compared to the 5d2, which seems to differ from internet sample images.  All things being the same, if this is indeed the case that the 5d3 is cleaner and sharper than the 5d2, i'm game.  It's a shame they dont have a D800 to compare against so we can really comb down to brass tax and know where we stand...

If you search around on google you can find the link for ACR 6.7RC.

Yeah the comparator on IR gives a very false impression since you are comparing 5D2 and 5D3 images that were each processed with extremely different settings and different converter version, the huge sharpness advantage goes away look a images processed with the same settings.


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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #44 on: March 06, 2012, 11:25:35 PM »
Same could be said about Canon as well. Who's to say that Canon won't actually release the rumored 5DX. High 30s - low 40s MPs.

My problem is that, if the 22 MP 5D3 is $3500, there's no way a high MP 5DX would be anything less than $4000.  Sure, maybe they'll use a less sophisticated AF and metering system, but I can't find any way for Canon to compete with the D800 in terms of price if the 5D X comes to pass.  I mean, do you think Canon would price a 30-40 MP FF camera BELOW the price of the 5D Mk III?  I don't. 

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Re: New Canon 5D mark III raws
« Reply #44 on: March 06, 2012, 11:25:35 PM »