November 26, 2014, 02:12:58 PM

Author Topic: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult  (Read 34672 times)

PhilDrinkwater

  • Guest
Re: Manual Mode 5D mark iii
« Reply #75 on: May 07, 2012, 03:39:14 AM »
Learn exposure and how to shoot in manual mode and never look back.

Oh thats right! Because anyone who uses a semi auto mode totally misunderstands how to expose!!

Ridiculous. Different tools for different jobs. I'd like to see you change exposure when you have 1/10 second to do so.

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Manual Mode 5D mark iii
« Reply #75 on: May 07, 2012, 03:39:14 AM »

AvTvM

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1110
    • View Profile
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #76 on: May 07, 2012, 07:38:18 AM »
for those who understand what Auto-ISO is and have use for it in their photography, Canon is still not offering a good implementation of the feature. While 1-series cams at least offer some more or lesse clumsy work-arounds, all other bodies have intensily annoying limitations to Auto-ISO functionality, although this is just a cheap  and easy firmware item.

Compared to what would be REALLY RIGHT in an advanced DSLR of 2012, the Nikon D4 & D800 come closest:
1. EC correction available in M-mode with Auto-ISO  ... YES
2. Minimum threshold for shutter time 1s to 1/4000 [not limited to 1/250s]  ... YES
3. In modes A, P where cam determines shutter-speed, focal length is taken into account ... YES 
4. this shutter speed can be further fine-tuned slower/faster by user ... YES
5. Auto-ISO in D800 [@ € 2800] not crippled, but exactly as in flagship-model D4 @ 6k ... YES

-> http://www.nikonusa.com/en_US/o/Y6wrkA9OU_z04IreazIXl_22UII/PDF/D800_TechnicalGuide_En.pdf
on page 12 you can see, how smart and easy Auto-ISO can and should be in 2012:

This is the MINIMUM I expect in a camera 20% MORE EXPENSIVE than the D800 ... if Canon wants me to buy it. :-) 

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #77 on: May 07, 2012, 09:18:48 AM »
for those who understand what Auto-ISO is and have use for it in their photography, Canon is still not offering a good implementation of the feature. While 1-series cams at least offer some more or lesse clumsy work-arounds, all other bodies have intensily annoying limitations to Auto-ISO functionality, although this is just a cheap  and easy firmware item.

Compared to what would be REALLY RIGHT in an advanced DSLR of 2012, the Nikon D4 & D800 come closest:
1. EC correction available in M-mode with Auto-ISO  ... YES
2. Minimum threshold for shutter time 1s to 1/4000 [not limited to 1/250s]  ... YES
3. In modes A, P where cam determines shutter-speed, focal length is taken into account ... YES 
4. this shutter speed can be further fine-tuned slower/faster by user ... YES
5. Auto-ISO in D800 [@ € 2800] not crippled, but exactly as in flagship-model D4 @ 6k ... YES

-> http://www.nikonusa.com/en_US/o/Y6wrkA9OU_z04IreazIXl_22UII/PDF/D800_TechnicalGuide_En.pdf
on page 12 you can see, how smart and easy Auto-ISO can and should be in 2012:

This is the MINIMUM I expect in a camera 20% MORE EXPENSIVE than the D800 ... if Canon wants me to buy it. :-)

All these points can be done in the 1D4 (except for #3 as there is no P mode)

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • **********
  • Posts: 14965
    • View Profile
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #78 on: May 07, 2012, 09:26:29 AM »
All these points can be done in the 1D4 (except for #3 as there is no P mode)

OMG, no P mode?  I'll have to cancel my 1D X pre-order, unless Canon has rectified that glaring oversight.   :P
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #79 on: May 07, 2012, 09:28:02 AM »
All these points can be done in the 1D4 (except for #3 as there is no P mode)

OMG, no P mode?  I'll have to cancel my 1D X pre-order, unless Canon has rectified that glaring oversight.   :P

I really miss the green square  ;)

plam_1980

  • Guest
Re: Manual Mode 5D mark iii
« Reply #80 on: May 07, 2012, 09:56:05 AM »
Learn exposure and how to shoot in manual mode and never look back.

Oh thats right! Because anyone who uses a semi auto mode totally misunderstands how to expose!!

Ridiculous. Different tools for different jobs. I'd like to see you change exposure when you have 1/10 second to do so.

You are so right! All Canon apologists should not ne bashing people who want a feature that can come handy in many situations and that is present in the bodies from the competition - are all people who got Nikon D4 & D800 bad photographers? Before anyone accuses me of being a Nikon troll - I have only Canon equipment and planned to go full frame and further invest in glass but all this elitist and arrogant attitude from the company and fanboys makes me suspicious

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • **********
  • Posts: 14965
    • View Profile
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #81 on: May 07, 2012, 10:02:48 AM »
I really miss the green square  ;)

I know you jest, but I will sort of miss it - I use back-button AF among other customizations on my cameras, and the green square mode was useful when I wanted to hand the camera to someone to take a picture with me in it.  I'll learn to live with it...
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

canon rumors FORUM

Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #81 on: May 07, 2012, 10:02:48 AM »

AvTvM

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1110
    • View Profile
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #82 on: May 07, 2012, 11:26:09 AM »
Compared to what would be REALLY RIGHT in an advanced DSLR of 2012, the Nikon D4 & D800 come closest:
1. EC correction available in M-mode with Auto-ISO  ... YES
2. Minimum threshold for shutter time 1s to 1/4000 [not limited to 1/250s]  ... YES
3. In modes A, P where cam determines shutter-speed, focal length is taken into account ... YES 
4. this shutter speed can be further fine-tuned slower/faster by user ... YES
5. Auto-ISO in D800 [@ € 2800] not crippled, but exactly as in flagship-model D4 @ 6k ... YES
...
All these points can be done in the 1D4 (except for #3 as there is no P mode)

Wrong!

5D3 Auto ISO - which is main subject in this thread - sucks on all five points.
And 1D IV also falls way short ...

Specifically:
1. only available via twisted workaround in "faux M-mode" ... using Av and setting min and ma shutter speed to the same value. 
3. focal-length-aware shutter-times in Av,P mode plus Auto-ISO not available in any current Canon EOS body
4. also not available in any current Canon EOS body 
5. all Canon EOS below 1 series are artificially crippled in their Auto-ISO functionality for "marketing differtiation" reasons. Annoyingly so, even and especially where pure firmware items are concerned.

Compared to "2012 gold standard" [Nikon D800, D4] Auto-ISO functionality in all Canon EOS bodies is inferior ... big time in anything including 5D 2, considerably in 7D and 5D3, still quite a bit in 1D IV / 1D X.

If you don't need it or use it due to personal preferences and or shooting situations, fine. But there are many others, who would love to have and rightfully expect Canon to deliver more bang for the buck on this.

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #83 on: May 07, 2012, 12:35:23 PM »
Compared to what would be REALLY RIGHT in an advanced DSLR of 2012, the Nikon D4 & D800 come closest:
1. EC correction available in M-mode with Auto-ISO  ... YES
2. Minimum threshold for shutter time 1s to 1/4000 [not limited to 1/250s]  ... YES
3. In modes A, P where cam determines shutter-speed, focal length is taken into account ... YES 
4. this shutter speed can be further fine-tuned slower/faster by user ... YES
5. Auto-ISO in D800 [@ € 2800] not crippled, but exactly as in flagship-model D4 @ 6k ... YES
...
All these points can be done in the 1D4 (except for #3 as there is no P mode)

Wrong!

5D3 Auto ISO - which is main subject in this thread - sucks on all five points.
And 1D IV also falls way short ...

Specifically:
1. only available via twisted workaround in "faux M-mode" ... using Av and setting min and ma shutter speed to the same value. 
3. focal-length-aware shutter-times in Av,P mode plus Auto-ISO not available in any current Canon EOS body
4. also not available in any current Canon EOS body 
5. all Canon EOS below 1 series are artificially crippled in their Auto-ISO functionality for "marketing differtiation" reasons. Annoyingly so, even and especially where pure firmware items are concerned.

Compared to "2012 gold standard" [Nikon D800, D4] Auto-ISO functionality in all Canon EOS bodies is inferior ... big time in anything including 5D 2, considerably in 7D and 5D3, still quite a bit in 1D IV / 1D X.

If you don't need it or use it due to personal preferences and or shooting situations, fine. But there are many others, who would love to have and rightfully expect Canon to deliver more bang for the buck on this.

Sorry but you are totally wrong on point #1 The 1D4 has an even better feature than you are asking for. You set the minimum to whatever you want and the maximum to 1/8000. So if the iso gets to 100 but that would overexpose then the shutter speed increases approriately. I am sorry that you think that using the function as intended is such a bad thing but it does the job and does in in a failsafe fashion

#2 the minimum is setable from 30s to 1/8000 in the 1D4

#3 yes - http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/education/infobank/camera_settings/shooting_modes.do

#4 this is available on the 1D4

#5 Auto iso is NOT crippled in the 1D4

I find it disappointing that you have decided to have anti Canon/pro Nikon rant. It sounds like you have never used a series 1 Canon and that you have sucumbed to the 'D800 is greatest' brainwashing.

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • **********
  • Posts: 14965
    • View Profile
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #84 on: May 07, 2012, 01:21:14 PM »
I find it disappointing that you have decided to have anti Canon/pro Nikon rant. It sounds like you have never used a series 1 Canon and that you have sucumbed to the 'D800 is greatest' brainwashing.

The next logical response is that with Canon you need to spend thousands more to get those features, compared to the D800.

EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #85 on: May 07, 2012, 01:42:07 PM »
I find it disappointing that you have decided to have anti Canon/pro Nikon rant. It sounds like you have never used a series 1 Canon and that you have sucumbed to the 'D800 is greatest' brainwashing.

The next logical response is that with Canon you need to spend thousands more to get those features, compared to the D800.



.... if the D800 is what you want  8) 8) 8)

AvTvM

  • 1D X
  • *******
  • Posts: 1110
    • View Profile
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #86 on: May 07, 2012, 01:49:17 PM »
Sorry but you are totally wrong on point #1 The 1D4 has an even better feature than you are asking for. You set the minimum to whatever you want and the maximum to 1/8000. So if the iso gets to 100 but that would overexpose then the shutter speed increases approriately. I am sorry that you think that using the function as intended is such a bad thing but it does the job and does in in a failsafe fashion


only applicable in "Av" mode. D800/D4 will do the same, only (theoretical) advantage of the  1D IV is the range of shutter times between 1s and 30s in combination with Auto ISO:
#2 the minimum is setable from 30s to 1/8000 in the 1D4


As far as #3 and #4 are concerned the D800/D4 are way better ... beacuase the 1D IV will not
* automatically set shutter speed to 1/focal length in Av and P in Auto-ISO [#3]
* and allow the user to choose to apply a correction factor to that auto funtion for faster or longer shutter times. [#4]

#3 yes - http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/education/infobank/camera_settings/shooting_modes.do

If you refer to the "program line" in the link you provided ... this only applies to "P" mode ... and only to time+aperture combinations @ a chosen ISO setting. It is not at all an equivalent of the D800/D4 "ISO Sensitivity" function in Auto-ISO.

But since you state in an earlier post
All these points can be done in the 1D4 (except for #3 as there is no P mode)

you may want to try out the instructions in the Canon-link you provided:
"To set the shooting mode on EOS-1D and 1Ds series cameras press the Mode button (top left) and then turn the electronic input dial. The mode selected (P, Tv, Av or M) will appear in the top left of the LCD panel."

I find it disappointing that you have decided to have anti Canon/pro Nikon rant. It sounds like you have never used a series 1 Canon and that you have sucumbed to the 'D800 is greatest' brainwashing.

I find it disappointing that even in 2012 Canon is still not able to provide competitive Auto-ISO functionality, especially since all of it simply is a cheap firmeware item.

I find it even more disappointing, that Canon has brought out an inferior, firmware-crippled  camera and is charging 20% more for it than Nikon asks for a camera that has way better IQ and bests the 5D3 in practically every other respect, with the sole exception of fps. Heck, as far as IQ is concerned, it is probably even a better crop camera than my 7D.

And I find it disappointing, that any Canon-critical discusion is immediately termed "Anti-Canon rant" around here.

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #87 on: May 07, 2012, 02:09:32 PM »
Sorry but you are totally wrong on point #1 The 1D4 has an even better feature than you are asking for. You set the minimum to whatever you want and the maximum to 1/8000. So if the iso gets to 100 but that would overexpose then the shutter speed increases approriately. I am sorry that you think that using the function as intended is such a bad thing but it does the job and does in in a failsafe fashion


only applicable in "Av" mode. D800/D4 will do the same, only (theoretical) advantage of the  1D IV is the range of shutter times between 1s and 30s in combination with Auto ISO:
#2 the minimum is setable from 30s to 1/8000 in the 1D4


As far as #3 and #4 are concerned the D800/D4 are way better ... beacuase the 1D IV will not
* automatically set shutter speed to 1/focal length in Av and P in Auto-ISO [#3]
* and allow the user to choose to apply a correction factor to that auto funtion for faster or longer shutter times. [#4]

#3 yes - http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/education/infobank/camera_settings/shooting_modes.do

If you refer to the "program line" in the link you provided ... this only applies to "P" mode ... and only to time+aperture combinations @ a chosen ISO setting. It is not at all an equivalent of the D800/D4 "ISO Sensitivity" function in Auto-ISO.

But since you state in an earlier post
All these points can be done in the 1D4 (except for #3 as there is no P mode)

you may want to try out the instructions in the Canon-link you provided:
"To set the shooting mode on EOS-1D and 1Ds series cameras press the Mode button (top left) and then turn the electronic input dial. The mode selected (P, Tv, Av or M) will appear in the top left of the LCD panel."

I find it disappointing that you have decided to have anti Canon/pro Nikon rant. It sounds like you have never used a series 1 Canon and that you have sucumbed to the 'D800 is greatest' brainwashing.

I find it disappointing that even in 2012 Canon is still not able to provide competitive Auto-ISO functionality, especially since all of it simply is a cheap firmeware item.

I find it even more disappointing, that Canon has brought out an inferior, firmware-crippled  camera and is charging 20% more for it than Nikon asks for a camera that has way better IQ and bests the 5D3 in practically every other respect, with the sole exception of fps. Heck, as far as IQ is concerned, it is probably even a better crop camera than my 7D.

And I find it disappointing, that any Canon-critical discusion is immediately termed "Anti-Canon rant" around here.

Yep you are right I haven't used P mode and I had forgotten that it was there - I RTFM and corrected myself.

You are right about the speed in AV mode - but then I am setting the speed as in #1 and I can work out for myself that a 400mm lens means a shutter speed of 1/500 - I dont need the camera to work that one out for me so it is just not relevant.

Perhaps you need to RTFM before slating a manufacturer?

When someone posts a post that basically is incorrect in the facts to make the point that Canon is useless and Nikon is wonderful
Quote
I find it even more disappointing, that Canon has brought out an inferior, firmware-crippled  camera and is charging 20% more for it than Nikon asks for a camera that has way better IQ and bests the 5D3 in practically every other respect, with the sole exception of fps.
  and is saying that all Canon cameras are not up to the job- it comes across as an anti Canon rant - especially as the thread is not comparing Canon with Nikon.

canon rumors FORUM

Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #87 on: May 07, 2012, 02:09:32 PM »

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • **********
  • Posts: 14965
    • View Profile
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #88 on: May 07, 2012, 02:27:12 PM »
I find it disappointing that even in 2012 Canon is still not able to provide competitive Auto-ISO functionality, especially since all of it simply is a cheap firmeware item.

Me, too.  I'd certainly like to have EC available when using Auto ISO in M mode.

And I find it disappointing, that any Canon-critical discusion is immediately termed "Anti-Canon rant" around here.

From what I've seen, well-reasoned and fairly presented posts which are critical of Canon are well received by most here.  But people do consider the source, and when the source is clearly biased, the posts come off as trolling, and generate a pretty harsh response.  I looked back through the last 30 or so of your posts, here are some excerpts:

  • "Canon has brought out an inferior, firmware-crippled camera..."
  • "Canon will move very slowly and half-heartedly on this..."
  • " Canon's [should]... quickly reduce price of 5D3 below price of competitors' superior product"
  • " 5D III is overpriced. Nikon D800 is both a much better camera and a much better value."

And my personal favorite:

  • "Sepcifically, Canon F_____ up when they..."

You're dissatisfied with Canon.  We get it.  b\Beating your personal dead horse over and over may be cathartic for you, but it gets old.  Please, go buy a D800.  You'll love that it's so much better than the 5DIII you don't have, you'll love all those recently-released high-IQ lenses from Nikon (maybe you won't love their comparatively higher prices so much, though), you'll love the famed Nikon ergonomics, I bet you'll even love the spiffy gold box the D800 comes in. 

BTW, you realize you'll have to change your handle, right?  "AvTvM" won't win you any friends on the Nikon forums, you might try ASM instead. 
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #89 on: May 07, 2012, 04:46:36 PM »

Me, too.  I'd certainly like to have EC available when using Auto ISO in M mode.


You will get it with the 1DX  ;) ;) ;)

canon rumors FORUM

Re: AutoISO messed up.... AGAIN? arrrrrrr it's just not that difficult
« Reply #89 on: May 07, 2012, 04:46:36 PM »