Canon EF 200-400 f/4L IS Development Announced

[Hulk]

Sounds like there are a lot of people trapped within the Circle of Confusion surrounding DoF.   

To put it into practical terms, yes, sensor size affects DoF.  The effect can be phrased differently, though.  The common viewpoint is that a larger sensor means shallower DoF - that's true if and only if you're talking about a shot with the same framing, i.e. to compensate for the narrower angle of view with a crop sensor, you move further from the subject to maintain framing, so the increased subject distance means deeper DoF with the crop sensor (and the perspective is different, too, but that's another discussion).   However, if you keep the camera-to-subject distance constant, the DoF with the crop sensor is actually shallower than with a FF sensor, because the CoC of a crop sensor is smaller.

Agree with your first statement, but not completely with the second. If you stay at the same distance, but use a different focal length to get the same image, the smaller sensor will have deeper dof and less blur. That's common field experience I think.

[Justin]

+$1200 for an extender doesn't seem like an educated guess to me. I love Bryan's site. And I read his guessview earlier, but I got to say that Canon would be much better off if they really want to sell these in volume not going stratospheric with the price. <$6800 would make this a competitive lens. The Nikon equivalent lens was selling for 6k not long ago.

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Reviews/Canon-EF-200-400mm-f-4-L-IS-USM-Extender-1.4x-Lens-Review.aspx

Just a thoughtful analysis of what the lens is likely to be, nothing firm or certain, but from a lens expert.

[neuroanatomist]

Agree with your first statement, but not completely with the second. If you stay at the same distance, but use a different focal length to get the same image, the smaller sensor will have deeper dof and less blur. That's common field experience I think.

I don't believe I mentioned using a different focal length to get the same image.  Using the same focal length, same distance, the crop sensor will have shallower DoF (and obviously a tighter framing).  Try it yourself - go to DoFMaster, pick a focal length, aperture, and distance, leave them constant, and set the camera to a 5DII vs. a 7D and see what that does to the DoF.  For example, 5DII, 50mm, f/1.4, 10 ft = 1.02 ft DoF whereas 7D, 50mm, f/1.4, 10 ft = 0.65 ft DoF, i.e. shallower with the crop body. 

I mentioned compensating for the effect of sensor size on angle of view by changing distance to subject, but of course you could also compensate by using a different focal length.  You're right that if you change lenses (or zoom) to keep the angle of view the same when you switch sensor formats, the crop body will have deeper DoF (e.g. for the example above, keeping things the same for the 7D, but comparing a 5DII, 80mm, f/1.4, 10 ft = 0.39 ft DoF, shallower with full frame).

So, the point is that if you keep the framing the same (however you do that - changing lenses, zooming, or walking), the FF body will have shallower DoF, but if you keep focal length, distance, and aperture constant, the crop body will have shallower DoF.

[Flake]

According to Northlight Images one UK camera dealer has listed this lens at a jaw dropping £10, 000 or $15,000.  At the moment he's unsure if this is a real price or a placeholder for pre orders.  It's an indication though that this is not going to even be a reasonably priced lens!

http://www.parkcameras.com/18509/Canon-EF-200-400mm-f-4-0L-USM-IS.html?referrer=Froogle&utm_source=google&utm_medium=froogle&utm_campaign=pid18509

[WarStreet]

According to Northlight Images one UK camera dealer has listed this lens at a jaw dropping £10, 000 or $15,000.  At the moment he's unsure if this is a real price or a placeholder for pre orders.  It's an indication though that this is not going to even be a reasonably priced lens!

http://www.parkcameras.com/18509/Canon-EF-200-400mm-f-4-0L-USM-IS.html?referrer=Froogle&utm_source=google&utm_medium=froogle&utm_campaign=pid18509

I checked the link and now the price seems to be £11,500 ! I understand that the build in extender is a great advantage, and the question here is how much extra will Canon charge for that advantage ? I doubt this price is correct.
 

[kubelik]

I checked the link and now the price seems to be £11,500 ! I understand that the build in extender is a great advantage, and the question here is how much extra will Canon charge for that advantage ? I doubt this price is correct.

the lens has only been announced for development, not even announced for release yet.  I agree with WarStreet in that the price is a placeholder and can easily be off by several thousands of dollars.

we've seen in the past placeholders in even large retailers' behind-the-scenes inventories that were more than a couple of zeros off from the real price, simply because the placeholder price doesn't really matter.

if they are offering it up for preorder without knowing the real price (which I'm sure they don't, as Canon won't have a final price until they have a final design, which they also don't at this point), then it behooves the retailer to mark it up significantly.  that way you know that whichever pre-sales you lock in are probably likely to stay around, and you'll be hitting your budgetary marks on the item.  if you underprice it initially, you'll receive lots of initial interest, but then a bunch of either lost sales or unhappy customers once the higher real price is revealed.

[barton springs]

I have to think these high price indicators will be very close since the just released new 400 2.8 is priced in at a whooping $10,499 on B&H. The older model is priced at $3,900 less. These prices are just too much for me I hate to say. I'm a pro photog but not "that" pro. I could do a total remodel of two rooms in my house with new carpet for $10,000. When the prices get that high it's time to re-evaluate.

With that said I'll eventually somehow end up with a 200-400 4.0 but with careful planning with an accountant. Possibly even lease it. Professionally this is not a must have lens for me. I'll just want to have one.

Rick
Austin, TX

[Flake]

It's changed again (one wonders why):

Developement of new lens featuring an integrated focal length extender. No price has been announced from Canon as yet

Odd they should quote an SRP though, it implies they must have had some indication