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Author Topic: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon  (Read 26033 times)

Hesham

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STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #90 on: April 20, 2012, 11:01:39 AM »
What’s significant here is not that the defect only produces a problem in ‘extreme’, rarely-encountered environments.
What defect? The camera behaves as it was DESIGNED to behave. If you are shooting beyond the specified limits of the meter, then you are doing so at your own risk in any case, light leak or not. This will NOT affect your shots, if you know what you are doing in those situations and use a meter or your own calculations in the rare situations you are in those conditions. (To reuse someone else's example from the original thread, "This would only be an issue if you are shooting a black cat in a coal pit, with no moon." In which case, you should be using either an exceptionally sensitive light-meter or careful calculations and a strobe set to M.)

When a device operates outside its operational limits, it should warn the user and not operate under those circumstances. That's what we get when exposure requires more than 30 seconds, the number flashes indicating that you are trying to operate outside device limits. That's engineering 001 (not even 101)


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STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #90 on: April 20, 2012, 11:01:39 AM »

skitron

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #91 on: April 20, 2012, 11:07:03 AM »
What’s significant here is not that the defect only produces a problem in ‘extreme’, rarely-encountered environments.
What defect? The camera behaves as it was DESIGNED to behave. If you are shooting beyond the specified limits of the meter, then you are doing so at your own risk in any case, light leak or not. This will NOT affect your shots, if you know what you are doing in those situations and use a meter or your own calculations in the rare situations you are in those conditions. (To reuse someone else's example from the original thread, "This would only be an issue if you are shooting a black cat in a coal pit, with no moon." In which case, you should be using either an exceptionally sensitive light-meter or careful calculations and a strobe set to M.)

When a device operates outside its operational limits, it should warn the user and not operate under those circumstances. That's what we get when exposure requires more than 30 seconds, the number flashes indicating that you are trying to operate outside device limits. That's engineering 001 (not even 101)

Do you really want the camera to blurt out "WARNING! You are shooting with the lens cap on!"???
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Hesham

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #92 on: April 20, 2012, 11:17:13 AM »
What’s significant here is not that the defect only produces a problem in ‘extreme’, rarely-encountered environments.
What defect? The camera behaves as it was DESIGNED to behave. If you are shooting beyond the specified limits of the meter, then you are doing so at your own risk in any case, light leak or not. This will NOT affect your shots, if you know what you are doing in those situations and use a meter or your own calculations in the rare situations you are in those conditions. (To reuse someone else's example from the original thread, "This would only be an issue if you are shooting a black cat in a coal pit, with no moon." In which case, you should be using either an exceptionally sensitive light-meter or careful calculations and a strobe set to M.)

When a device operates outside its operational limits, it should warn the user and not operate under those circumstances. That's what we get when exposure requires more than 30 seconds, the number flashes indicating that you are trying to operate outside device limits. That's engineering 001 (not even 101)

Do you really want the camera to blurt out "WARNING! You are shooting with the lens cap on!"???

I bet you don't own a 5DM3. Ok, at least check the videos where night scenes exposure changes (without lens cap on). I can't believe how people defend a brand blindly. CANON THEMSELVES ACKNOWLEDGE THE PROBLEM!! IS THIS NOT ENOUGH PROOF?? I understand that this could happen to any company\product, it is a fact which we all will forget three months from now!

somewhere in this forum, Calumet Photo informed a customer that shipping will probably continue by Mid. May, once Canon fixed the problem.

I am so ti

skitron

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #93 on: April 20, 2012, 11:24:36 AM »
I bet you don't own a 5DM3. Ok, at least check the videos where night scenes exposure changes (without lens cap on). I can't believe how people defend a brand blindly. CANON THEMSELVES ACKNOWLEDGE THE PROBLEM!! IS THIS NOT ENOUGH PROOF?? I understand that this could happen to any company\product, it is a fact which we all will forget three months from now!

somewhere in this forum, Calumet Photo informed a customer that shipping will probably continue by Mid. May, once Canon fixed the problem.

I am so ti

I own a 5D2, a model which has the same issue that was interestingly enough, not discovered until the advent of the 5D3 and testing with the lens cap on.

Look, I'm not defending anyone and totally agree Canon should fix it if for no other reason, to eliminate threads like this one. But my point is to put the thing in perspective. Bottom line is if it can shoot shots like this:

http://www.extremeinstability.com/stormpics/2012/v-i36758.jpg

Then in a practical sense, just how much of a "problem" exisits?
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Hesham

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #94 on: April 20, 2012, 11:42:46 AM »
I bet you don't own a 5DM3. Ok, at least check the videos where night scenes exposure changes (without lens cap on). I can't believe how people defend a brand blindly. CANON THEMSELVES ACKNOWLEDGE THE PROBLEM!! IS THIS NOT ENOUGH PROOF?? I understand that this could happen to any company\product, it is a fact which we all will forget three months from now!

somewhere in this forum, Calumet Photo informed a customer that shipping will probably continue by Mid. May, once Canon fixed the problem.

I am so ti

I own a 5D2, a model which has the same issue that was interestingly enough, not discovered until the advent of the 5D3 and testing with the lens cap on.

Look, I'm not defending anyone and totally agree Canon should fix it if for no other reason, to eliminate threads like this one. But my point is to put the thing in perspective. Bottom line is if it can shoot shots like this:

http://www.extremeinstability.com/stormpics/2012/v-i36758.jpg

Then in a practical sense, just how much of a "problem" exisits?

I am currently using the 5DM3 (used it with the 8-15 fisheye today, loads of fun), it's the best cam I ever used. I might not be affected by the leak issue but the fact is it is defective instrument, period. Yes it takes wonderful pictures 99% of the time, but still it is defective. Since 20D, I have been using canon gear and upgrading every other model. I keep my cameras in good condition to maintain reasonable re-sale value. The 5DM3 in its current state will not hold its value compared with newer "fixed" versions after one or two years from now. I am waiting for canon's verdict while making sure I don't miss my return window. I hope we hear something today or Monday....

skitron

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #95 on: April 20, 2012, 11:54:58 AM »
The 5DM3 in its current state will not hold its value compared with newer "fixed" versions after one or two years from now. I am waiting for canon's verdict while making sure I don't miss my return window. I hope we hear something today or Monday....

I don't think you'll need to worry about diminished value. My guess is they fix the ones in the wild via the warranty channel and of course also fix it on the production line. I'm guessing the unreleased stock probably gets fixed by the same team that does the warranty jobs. LOL, my 5D2 is still in warranty, I should ask them about it, not that I'd actually send it in. Sandman expressed he's uncomfortable with a reworked copy, and that's fair enough, depending on how invasive the fix is I'd probably feel the same way.
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swrightgfx

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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #96 on: April 20, 2012, 12:37:41 PM »
There is no defect

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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #96 on: April 20, 2012, 12:37:41 PM »

MrSandman

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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #97 on: April 20, 2012, 01:25:47 PM »
There is no defect

Ok, well, you go on thinking that.  That’s fine.  There are plenty of people (myself included) who think there is.  And more importantly, the people who actually make the camera think there is a defect - a defect that is, at very least, worth looking into and possibly correcting.

So no matter how much you insist that there’s no problem, there are people whose opinions deserve more weight than yours saying that there is.

MrSandman

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #98 on: April 20, 2012, 01:26:52 PM »
Quote
Sandman expressed he's uncomfortable with a reworked copy, and that's fair enough, depending on how invasive the fix is I'd probably feel the same way.

Well, a repair that requires them to open up the camera is pretty invasive in my book.

chimpmitten

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #99 on: April 20, 2012, 02:08:14 PM »
Ok, at least check the videos where night scenes exposure changes (without lens cap on). I can't believe how people defend a brand blindly. CANON THEMSELVES ACKNOWLEDGE THE PROBLEM!! IS THIS NOT ENOUGH PROOF?? I understand that this could happen to any company\product, it is a fact which we all will forget three months from now!

Hesham,

Can you point to some of the videos of the lens cap off that demonstrate the issue?  I did a quick look and the videos I saw of the lens cap off did not have the issue.  They only ones I saw demonstrating the issue were when the lens cap was on or no lens at all with the body cap.

If this is all that it is, when in the complete absence of light a few stray light waves manage to get in an effect the metering of a completely black scene so that it is a slightly different shade of completely black, then I am not worried in the least.   I doubt that Canon would even make any fix to the camera at all.

If someone could demonstrate how this effects things while actually taking a picture of something, then that would be great, but I haven't seen that yet, and I've been trying to look for it.

Here, I'll even give an example that should demonstrate the issue.  Maybe MrSandman can do this and post results.  Stand outside in bright sunlight with a telephoto lens and take a picture through a window into a darkened room.  Then go into the darkened room and take another picture.  When outside the direct sunlight should cause the light leak issue and screw up the metering.  Post both pictures so we can see the difference.

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Hesham

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #100 on: April 20, 2012, 02:51:52 PM »
Ok, at least check the videos where night scenes exposure changes (without lens cap on). I can't believe how people defend a brand blindly. CANON THEMSELVES ACKNOWLEDGE THE PROBLEM!! IS THIS NOT ENOUGH PROOF?? I understand that this could happen to any company\product, it is a fact which we all will forget three months from now!

Hesham,

Can you point to some of the videos of the lens cap off that demonstrate the issue?  I did a quick look and the videos I saw of the lens cap off did not have the issue.  They only ones I saw demonstrating the issue were when the lens cap was on or no lens at all with the body cap.

If this is all that it is, when in the complete absence of light a few stray light waves manage to get in an effect the metering of a completely black scene so that it is a slightly different shade of completely black, then I am not worried in the least.   I doubt that Canon would even make any fix to the camera at all.

If someone could demonstrate how this effects things while actually taking a picture of something, then that would be great, but I haven't seen that yet, and I've been trying to look for it.

Here, I'll even give an example that should demonstrate the issue.  Maybe MrSandman can do this and post results.  Stand outside in bright sunlight with a telephoto lens and take a picture through a window into a darkened room.  Then go into the darkened room and take another picture.  When outside the direct sunlight should cause the light leak issue and screw up the metering.  Post both pictures so we can see the difference.

chimpmitten

Here is one of the videos (BTW, it is referenced in the beginning of this thread!)
Canon 5D Mark III - Light Leak via Viewfinder

I did similar tests with similar results. Hope I didn't, but can't undo it;-)

chimpmitten

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Re: STOP MAKING EXCUSES, THIS IS CANON PR's JOB
« Reply #101 on: April 20, 2012, 03:10:08 PM »


Here is one of the videos (BTW, it is referenced in the beginning of this thread!)
Canon 5D Mark III - Light Leak via Viewfinder

I did similar tests with similar results. Hope I didn't, but can't undo it;-)


As was said, in the beginning of this thread, that is not even remotely the same issue as we are discussing.

The fact that this guy is shocked that light will go through the view finder is in itself mind boggling for someone purporting to be a camera expert. 

Since you did a similar test, I can only assume that you have a 5d iii (since that is what we are discussing).  Could you try the test that I suggested in my previous post?
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AAPhotog

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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #102 on: April 20, 2012, 03:32:17 PM »
What steps must I take to find out if my camera has the light leak issue?
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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #102 on: April 20, 2012, 03:32:17 PM »

chimpmitten

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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #103 on: April 20, 2012, 04:18:33 PM »
What steps must I take to find out if my camera has the light leak issue?

Whether there is a light leak "issue" is up for debate.  You can replicate it by putting on your lens cap and putting the camera in an auto mode, then hold the shutter button down half way.  The camera should try to properly expose the absence of light. 

While holding the shutter button half way, if you press the top LCD back light button the exposure settings should change to compensate for a minuscule amount of light reaching the sensor used for exposure metering. 

I have yet to see or hear of an example where this occurs without the lens cap on, so the effect appears to have little or no impact on real world use.  I'd be more than happy (well not happy since I'd like to get a 5d iii), to be proven wrong about that.
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AAPhotog

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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #104 on: April 20, 2012, 04:27:49 PM »
So I put it on the AV mode with lens cap on. Exposure is zerod out. then I turned on the backlight for the top LCD screen. Nothing changed. Did I do everything correct>? If so, mine must not have the issue

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shutter speed: 30"
f/ 1.8
iso: 100
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Re: Light leak on 5D3 IS a big issue, and should embarrass Canon
« Reply #104 on: April 20, 2012, 04:27:49 PM »