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Author Topic: The 5D Mark III Fix  (Read 34184 times)

neuroanatomist

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #165 on: May 05, 2012, 10:31:59 AM »
I'll admit that you make a convincing point. My main concern is wether or not I should continue investing in Canon glass with the eventual plan of buying a 5D III when for the first time a Nikon camera has made me question my loyalty to the EOS system. Despite the fact that I still see the D800 as a more advanced camera (the Ivy Bridge to Canon's Sandy Bridge, to continue your computer analogy), I've heard enough today to be reassured.

I agree that the D800 has a more advanced sensor - but I'd argue that doesn't make it a more advanced camera.  The 5DIII has 6 fps (vs. 4 fps, 6 fps is achieved only in DX mode and then only with buying the grip, AFAIK), and has 2 stops higher native and expanded ISO settings.  The 5DIII has a better AF system, but less advanced metering system.  Overall, I think the 5DIII is a better general purpose camera, while the D800 is better for still/studio work, provided you have top lenses to match the sensor (even the 14-24mm seems softer than I'd want in the corners on the D800 - the high pixel density is exposing a weakness in what is an otherwise excellent lens).

The cost of changing systems is pretty significant - a lot of lost $ on the same of your Canon lenses, compared to the cost of purchasing Nikon replacements (and most of the Nikon counterparts are more expensive - sometimes substantially more expensive).  New flash(es), accessories like wireless triggers, etc.  I do know at least one photographer whom I respect that did switch to Nikon for the D800, it really depends on how strongly you feel about it.
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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #165 on: May 05, 2012, 10:31:59 AM »

plutonium10

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #166 on: May 05, 2012, 12:40:45 PM »
The cost of changing systems is pretty significant

This is why I'm "flaming" the DR and ISO of the 5D III. I want to be sure that the system I invest in keeps up with the competion and this is why I've been playing devil's advocate lately. I really like my Canon system but I guess the grass is always greener on the other side.
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neuroanatomist

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #167 on: May 05, 2012, 01:05:36 PM »
The cost of changing systems is pretty significant

This is why I'm "flaming" the DR and ISO of the 5D III. I want to be sure that the system I invest in keeps up with the competion and this is why I've been playing devil's advocate lately. I really like my Canon system but I guess the grass is always greener on the other side.

Canon has been lagging well behind Nikon in DR and ISO noise for years.  Why haven't you switched yet, if wide DR and low noise are most important to you?  Are they really most important?
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plutonium10

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #168 on: May 05, 2012, 05:13:04 PM »
The cost of changing systems is pretty significant

This is why I'm "flaming" the DR and ISO of the 5D III. I want to be sure that the system I invest in keeps up with the competion and this is why I've been playing devil's advocate lately. I really like my Canon system but I guess the grass is always greener on the other side.

Canon has been lagging well behind Nikon in DR and ISO noise for years.  Why haven't you switched yet, if wide DR and low noise are most important to you?  Are they really most important?

Good question. I've just been a Canon guy ever since I got my XSi in 2008 when I was 15. Great little camera. At the time I didn't know a lot about tech specs and I just grew to like the EOS system. It's only recently that I started paying attention to the D800 because people have been making such a big fuss about it.
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briansquibb

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #169 on: May 05, 2012, 05:17:34 PM »
If you think you have achieved the maximum potential from your 7D then that is a good time to move on

plutonium10

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #170 on: May 05, 2012, 05:44:51 PM »
If you think you have achieved the maximum potential from your 7D then that is a good time to move on

DxO says the 7D's DR is 11.7 EVs, exactly the same as the 5D MK III's. The D800 meanwhile manages 14.4. In practice how does this translate?
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DavidRiesenberg

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #171 on: May 05, 2012, 05:57:36 PM »
More information in the shadows and easier to contain high contrast scenes like landscapes. Now what this means in real life is that some shots will be a little easier to accomplish and it will be a bit easier to salvage badly exposed photos. Basically, it is a nice and useful feature but not game changing like some of the people around here make it to be. You just have to look at some of the many breath taking images that the 5D2 can produce to see that.

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #171 on: May 05, 2012, 05:57:36 PM »

briansquibb

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #172 on: May 05, 2012, 06:14:31 PM »
Oh dear - we are back to using the DxO lab figures which I had thought we had agreed were open to mis interpretation - now we are back to choosing cameras based on them

I just wish people understood how difficult it is to reach 10ev in a picture, never mind 14. Only then will we get to understand  how few people will use the enhanced DR never mind those that need it.

neuroanatomist

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #173 on: May 05, 2012, 06:25:08 PM »
DxO says ...The D800 meanwhile manages 14.4.

In practice, it's like saying the D800 has a DR of 50,000.....divided by zero.  That's mathematically impossible, just like it's mathematically impossible for a camera with a 14-bit analog-to-digital converter to have more than 14 bits of DR.

I find DxO's measurements (note: measurements, not the scores based on those measurements) to be useful...but it's very important to understand what those measurements are, and more importantly, what they are not.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2012, 06:27:15 PM by neuroanatomist »
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plutonium10

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #174 on: May 05, 2012, 06:36:11 PM »
More information in the shadows and easier to contain high contrast scenes like landscapes. Now what this means in real life is that some shots will be a little easier to accomplish and it will be a bit easier to salvage badly exposed photos. Basically, it is a nice and useful feature but not game changing like some of the people around here make it to be. You just have to look at some of the many breath taking images that the 5D2 can produce to see that.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/plutonium10/6993973748/#sizes/c/in/photostream/
Yeah, that's what I thought. Here is an example of where I think I could benefit from higher DR, tell me if I'm wrong. This is an unedited exif-JPEG that I posted straight to Flickr. Slightly blown highlights in some of the glass detail and a few patches of blocked up black near the bottom of the frame (when reviewing the RAW file in DPP).
« Last Edit: May 05, 2012, 06:38:23 PM by plutonium10 »
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dr croubie

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #175 on: May 05, 2012, 06:38:07 PM »
It's only recently that I started paying attention to the D800 because people have been making such a big fuss about it.

Yep, in terms of numbers, it's a fact* that the D800's biggest internet advertising base is from whingers on this forum.



*as much of a fact as any other D800 or 5D3 sales figures you see quoted around here
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V8Beast

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #176 on: May 05, 2012, 06:51:17 PM »
Good question. I've just been a Canon guy ever since I got my XSi in 2008 when I was 15. Great little camera. At the time I didn't know a lot about tech specs and I just grew to like the EOS system. It's only recently that I started paying attention to the D800 because people have been making such a big fuss about it.

I mentioned this in another thread, somewhat as joke, but if DR is the most important factor for someone's shooting needs, Nikon has several options that get you almost as much DR as the D800 for far less money. The D7000 has 13.9 stops of DR for $1,200, while the D5100 gets you 13.6 stops of DR for $700. Let's break it down:

D800   = $208 per stop of DR
D7000 = $86 per stop of DR
D5100 = $51 per stop of DR

So why is everyone humping the D800 instead of the D5100, when the D5100 is clearly the better DR value ;D?

briansquibb

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #177 on: May 05, 2012, 06:51:20 PM »
More information in the shadows and easier to contain high contrast scenes like landscapes. Now what this means in real life is that some shots will be a little easier to accomplish and it will be a bit easier to salvage badly exposed photos. Basically, it is a nice and useful feature but not game changing like some of the people around here make it to be. You just have to look at some of the many breath taking images that the 5D2 can produce to see that.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/plutonium10/6993973748/#sizes/c/in/photostream/
Yeah, that's what I thought. Here is an example of where I think I could benefit from higher DR, tell me if I'm wrong. This is an unedited exif-JPEG that I posted straight to Flickr. Slightly blown highlights in some of the glass detail and a few patches of blocked up black near the bottom of the frame (when reviewing the RAW file in DPP).

The benefit would be having less shadows - there are many ways of achieving this - not just selective level adjustments.

A tickle of flash would eliminate all the dark areas.

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #177 on: May 05, 2012, 06:51:20 PM »

plutonium10

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #178 on: May 05, 2012, 07:00:16 PM »
They are quite strict in regards to flash photography. Very few churches allow it.  :-\
« Last Edit: May 05, 2012, 07:02:20 PM by plutonium10 »
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plutonium10

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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #179 on: May 05, 2012, 07:08:20 PM »
Good question. I've just been a Canon guy ever since I got my XSi in 2008 when I was 15. Great little camera. At the time I didn't know a lot about tech specs and I just grew to like the EOS system. It's only recently that I started paying attention to the D800 because people have been making such a big fuss about it.

I mentioned this in another thread, somewhat as joke, but if DR is the most important factor for someone's shooting needs, Nikon has several options that get you almost as much DR as the D800 for far less money. The D7000 has 13.9 stops of DR for $1,200, while the D5100 gets you 13.6 stops of DR for $700. Let's break it down:

D800   = $208 per stop of DR
D7000 = $86 per stop of DR
D5100 = $51 per stop of DR

So why is everyone humping the D800 instead of the D5100, when the D5100 is clearly the better DR value ;D?

Fair point.
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Re: The 5D Mark III Fix
« Reply #179 on: May 05, 2012, 07:08:20 PM »