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Author Topic: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)  (Read 20518 times)

TrumpetPower!

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2012, 11:02:28 PM »
The fredmiranda.com d800/5D3 comparo speaks volumes to the advancements Sony/Nikon has made with respect to DR.


I'd take that comparison with a huge grain of salt. In some very casual backyard experiments, I was able to get similar results with my 5DIII as Fred got with the D800 in even more extreme conditions, using either DPP or ACR. If you really, really need to do that kind of shadow recovery, you can do it just fine on the 5DIII, though you might have a stop or so more grain than the D800. Considering how damned little noise there is any of these cameras, even at insane ISOs, I really don't see how that's at all a problem.

Especially considering that the proper solution, with either camera, is to either fix the lit or shoot a multiple-exposure HDR....

Cheers,

b&

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2012, 11:02:28 PM »

unfocused

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #16 on: May 03, 2012, 11:05:02 PM »
How many times and in how many threads do we have to rehash the same old craziness?

I commend Neuro and others for their patience in explaining a few facts to people.

Canon did their market research. The found that customers were generally satisfied with the 5DII except for the autofocus, weathersealing and a few other features. They also found that real customers (wedding and event photographers) would snap up a camera with improved ISO performance. They calculated what the proper price point would be to capture the largest and virtually only remaining professional market (wedding and event photographers).

The camera is here and as Canon knew from its market research, it is selling very well to their target audience.

They didn't design the camera for people who post on forums. They didn't even design it for enthusiasts like myself. They designed it for photographers who are in a very competitive business and have to have a tool that will give them an edge. I doesn't makes a dime's worth of difference what its testing geek "scores" might be and it doesn't make a difference that it might not be what you wanted. 
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noisejammer

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2012, 11:17:55 PM »
I'm sure that Canon will be making a profit on the 5D3... but I can't see any of it coming from me. If they were offering something with the banding fixed, better dynamic range or an improvement in ergonomics, I'd have one already. Right now, I'm contemplating whether my next lens should have an F mount.

I suspect the reason we're not seeing a camera that competes with the D800 is simply that Canon thinks it can make more money with the spec it has offered. Very few of the Canon lenses will outresolve the sensor, so offering a higher resolution sensor is a backhanded incentive to purchase third party glass - read Zeiss. Of course, the same argument holds over many Nikon lenses too but Nikon had very little to loose in this market segment.

stevenrrmanir

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2012, 11:22:28 PM »
Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII?

To make a profit.  And guess what?  They will.  'Nuf said.

True, but you forgot the second part. To make a profit off the hype. The product is a marginal upgrade over the 5D MKII - NOT worth the upgrade and the cost! Only fanboys and die hard Canon individuals who are stuck with their system (ie. cannot sell all the glass) will auto-convince themselves that the new 5DMKII is heavenly mana... in a year from now it will become too painfully obvious even to the blind followers. Right now there are better alternatives out there at lower cost.

stevenrrmanir

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2012, 11:28:22 PM »
They brought it out because it was spec'd exactly the way I wanted it....and I could not wait any longer  :)

Would I have liked a better price?  Yes....but a few hundred USD are not a major issue, and I blame that more on the weak $, not, so much, Canon.

Greater DR at low ISO?  Maybe..?  But more as insurance against my not getting the correct exposure.  While intellectually it may seem nice to open up all the dark shadows, an image like that usually looks too artificial and is why we often tire of HDR....even if it is not garish.

More megapixels?  Always nice, but has trade offs....which I guess is true of pretty much all the specs.  It's like what we are told about tripods....if you want cheap, light, and sturdy, you can have any 2, but not all three.

In summary,I believe the 5D3 is an extremely well balanced system....and aim glad I jump on getting it right away (even if it is going to need some taping up).

John

The DR is VERY BAD on this body! What do you mean a maybe? Have you even seen how it compares to, say D800? It is like comparing a Fiat to a nice BMW when it comes to DR! The IQ across all kinds of situations is evident by the sensor!

If you are going to spend $3500 at least spend it on a worth-while body! Otherwise, stick with $500 cameras capable of raw - you will get the same IQ as the Canon 5D MKIII when it comes to noise, and DR.

It is beyond pathetic how some people can find reasons to justify their purchase! It is a bad purchase at that price! Something like that should have been priced at $2500, and they should have reduced the cost of 5D MKII to about $1800 - but they got greedy! Hiked the price of MKII by about $300 here in Canada!

I am not a stupid customer and will not budge just because they have a new body! Screw them! I am going to wait until the price for the quality is worthwhile. I am happy with my 40D which has better IQ than the 50D and 60D with the lenses I have!

Mike Ca

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2012, 11:40:53 PM »
Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII?

To make a profit.  And guess what?  They will.  'Nuf said.

This.

I think Canon chose to stick with the off sensor ADC technology rather than going to something similar to the Sony Exmor technology because it is much easier to do high quality video in Canon's current technology.

Sony had problems with video. Some of their cameras had problems with sensor overheating and shutting down doing video. Those problems have been fixed in the newest Sony cameras. In the D800 Nikon/Sony have gotten high quality low ISO video, but the high ISO video on the D800 is still much nosier than the 5D III. I think Canon decided not to purse Sony Exmor technology a number of years ago because they thought high quality video was more important and that technology makes video more challenging.

sach100

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2012, 11:57:20 PM »

I am not a stupid customer and will not budge just because they have a new body! Screw them! I am going to wait until the price for the quality is worthwhile.

I think you will have to hang on to your 40D for few more years. Happy shooting with your 40D! <No sarcasm>


It is beyond pathetic how some people can find reasons to justify their purchase! It is a bad purchase at that price!


In my limited experience, at least i haven't come across people who've made purchase decision only based on DR. For many many other reasons that ARE important for photographers there is Canon. Thank you.
<Again zero sarcasm>
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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2012, 11:57:20 PM »

Sony

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #22 on: May 04, 2012, 01:32:12 AM »
How many times and in how many threads do we have to rehash the same old craziness?

I commend Neuro and others for their patience in explaining a few facts to people.

Canon did their market research. The found that customers were generally satisfied with the 5DII except for the autofocus, weathersealing and a few other features. They also found that real customers (wedding and event photographers) would snap up a camera with improved ISO performance. They calculated what the proper price point would be to capture the largest and virtually only remaining professional market (wedding and event photographers).

The camera is here and as Canon knew from its market research, it is selling very well to their target audience.

They didn't design the camera for people who post on forums. They didn't even design it for enthusiasts like myself. They designed it for photographers who are in a very competitive business and have to have a tool that will give them an edge. I doesn't makes a dime's worth of difference what its testing geek "scores" might be and it doesn't make a difference that it might not be what you wanted.
Damn right! Thumbs up!

Ellen Schmidtee

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #23 on: May 04, 2012, 02:14:55 AM »
* Most people don't want the 5d3 to have any more resolution and I'm sure Canon knows this because they will have asked
Until it comes out. Then everyone wants it.

No, it's just that those who want more MP make a lot more noise than those who don't.

moreorless

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #24 on: May 04, 2012, 06:21:01 AM »
They brought it out because it was spec'd exactly the way I wanted it....and I could not wait any longer  :)

Would I have liked a better price?  Yes....but a few hundred USD are not a major issue, and I blame that more on the weak $, not, so much, Canon.

Greater DR at low ISO?  Maybe..?  But more as insurance against my not getting the correct exposure.  While intellectually it may seem nice to open up all the dark shadows, an image like that usually looks too artificial and is why we often tire of HDR....even if it is not garish.

More megapixels?  Always nice, but has trade offs....which I guess is true of pretty much all the specs.  It's like what we are told about tripods....if you want cheap, light, and sturdy, you can have any 2, but not all three.

In summary,I believe the 5D3 is an extremely well balanced system....and aim glad I jump on getting it right away (even if it is going to need some taping up).

John

The DR is VERY BAD on this body! What do you mean a maybe? Have you even seen how it compares to, say D800? It is like comparing a Fiat to a nice BMW when it comes to DR! The IQ across all kinds of situations is evident by the sensor!

If you are going to spend $3500 at least spend it on a worth-while body! Otherwise, stick with $500 cameras capable of raw - you will get the same IQ as the Canon 5D MKIII when it comes to noise, and DR.

It is beyond pathetic how some people can find reasons to justify their purchase! It is a bad purchase at that price! Something like that should have been priced at $2500, and they should have reduced the cost of 5D MKII to about $1800 - but they got greedy! Hiked the price of MKII by about $300 here in Canada!

I am not a stupid customer and will not budge just because they have a new body! Screw them! I am going to wait until the price for the quality is worthwhile. I am happy with my 40D which has better IQ than the 50D and 60D with the lenses I have!

This post just seems to illistrait the point that others are making, your looking to translate your needs to every potential user.

Resolution and DR are obviously well behind the D800 but neither are "very bad" in objective terms and I think its easy to see many users not having an issue with these.

Equally I think its easy to see many users needing the 5D3's higher FPS, higher ISO performance, better Jpeg's and much better mid ISO video perfromance.

The big issue is I'd say that the people who want these things tend to be pro's who do not spend there time posting on net forums as much as amatures who may not even be looking ti buy a FF DSLR dispite spending alot of time commenting on them.

DavidRiesenberg

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #25 on: May 04, 2012, 07:09:46 AM »
The DR is VERY BAD on this body! What do you mean a maybe? Have you even seen how it compares to, say D800? It is like comparing a Fiat to a nice BMW when it comes to DR! The IQ across all kinds of situations is evident by the sensor!

The DR is VERY BAD on the D800! Have you even seen how it compares to, say a welding camera? It is like comparing a Fiat to a nice BMW when it comes to DR! The IQ across all kinds of situations is evident by the sensor!

NormanBates

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #26 on: May 04, 2012, 09:43:29 AM »
OK, I don't have a clue what customers want
more mpix? more DR? richer colors? lower price?
guess what: the D800 beats the 5D3 at basically every aspect of image quality you care to compare, and it's cheaper too
whatever customers want, they'll probably find it on the D800 (sadly that probably will be "more megapixels", sigh)

with the 5D3 finally shipping, we should soon see if sales are anywhere close to those of the D800
if they're not, looking at what happened with D700 vs 5D2, I'm expecting the 5D3 to fall to $2700 by mid-summer; if that hapens, I may buy one

* July 2008: Nikon launches D700 at $3000
* Sep 2008: Canon launches much better 5D2 at $2700
* Dec 2008: D700 has fallen to $2320, 5D2 still $2700
http://camelcamelcamel.com/Nikon-12-1MP-FX-Format-Digital-3-0-Inch/product/B001BTCSI6
http://camelcamelcamel.com/Canon-21-1MP-Frame-Digital-Camera/product/B001G5ZTLS

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #27 on: May 04, 2012, 10:01:17 AM »
Step 1:  Release 5D Mark III

Step 2: ???

Step 3:  Profit
Canon 5D3  /  Canon 8-15L  /  Canon 35L  /  Canon 85L  /  Canon 100L  /  Canon 580EX II  / Canon MR 14-EX

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #27 on: May 04, 2012, 10:01:17 AM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2012, 10:42:24 AM »
Step 1:  Release 5D Mark III

Sounds a lot better than collecting underpants...   ;D
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unfocused

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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2012, 11:27:55 AM »
Quote
It is like comparing a Fiat to a nice BMW when it comes to DR!

Just a piece of advice. Obscure references don't work very well as analogies. I have no idea if a Fiat is better or worse than a BMW.  Nor do I care. But then again, I don't really care whether a Canon 5DIII or a Nikon D800 scores higher on some equally obscure, arbitrary test.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2012, 11:31:40 AM by unfocused »
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Re: Why did Canon Release the 5D MkIII (pure conjecture)
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2012, 11:27:55 AM »