July 25, 2014, 09:26:06 PM

Author Topic: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?  (Read 11482 times)

Maxis Gamez

  • PowerShot G1 X II
  • ***
  • Posts: 51
  • Bird Photography
    • View Profile
    • Bird Photography in Florida
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2012, 12:34:48 PM »
I still believe using a full frame for bird photography is not ideal even using a long lens like my 800mm.

I can understand that. Do you think you'd get a 7d (or an upgraded 7d) if a 1.3x crop doesn't happen again?

Just wondering what bird photographers will buy next..

If Canon drops the 7D line, and does not bring back a 1.3x crop camera, and really does indeed intend to drop f/8 AF in their Pro bodies, I think bird photographers on Canon gear are just SOL. I have a 7D now, and I would stick with that until the day it dies. I'd pick up a 1D IV if I could (they are getting rather hard to find...seems a lot of people still want the 1-series performance with a crop factor). In the absence of f/8 AF on any body and the loss of pro-grade crop bodies, I might move to Nikon. I really don't like that thought (I like Canon gear and ergonomics), but if Canon decides to ditch the bird photographers, I think bird photographers will have to ditch Canon. Reach is probably the most important factor for a birder, and being able to AF at maximum reach (which is often 600mm + 2x TC + CF... 1920mm on 1.6x or 1560mm on 1.3x) is critical. Nikon seems quite happy and capable of providing multiple f/8 sensitive AF points in their 51pt AF system, which is used on quite a few bodies.

Hang in there... I'm sure something is coming. Maybe not until late 2013 but They are well aware of our frustration. Trust me!

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2012, 12:34:48 PM »

jrista

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 3739
  • POTATO
    • View Profile
    • Nature Photography
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #16 on: May 08, 2012, 12:49:25 PM »
I still believe using a full frame for bird photography is not ideal even using a long lens like my 800mm.

I can understand that. Do you think you'd get a 7d (or an upgraded 7d) if a 1.3x crop doesn't happen again?

Just wondering what bird photographers will buy next..

If Canon drops the 7D line, and does not bring back a 1.3x crop camera, and really does indeed intend to drop f/8 AF in their Pro bodies, I think bird photographers on Canon gear are just SOL. I have a 7D now, and I would stick with that until the day it dies. I'd pick up a 1D IV if I could (they are getting rather hard to find...seems a lot of people still want the 1-series performance with a crop factor). In the absence of f/8 AF on any body and the loss of pro-grade crop bodies, I might move to Nikon. I really don't like that thought (I like Canon gear and ergonomics), but if Canon decides to ditch the bird photographers, I think bird photographers will have to ditch Canon. Reach is probably the most important factor for a birder, and being able to AF at maximum reach (which is often 600mm + 2x TC + CF... 1920mm on 1.6x or 1560mm on 1.3x) is critical. Nikon seems quite happy and capable of providing multiple f/8 sensitive AF points in their 51pt AF system, which is used on quite a few bodies.

Hang in there... I'm sure something is coming. Maybe not until late 2013 but They are well aware of our frustration. Trust me!

Well thats VERY good to hear. :) Thanks for the update, btw. The lack of f/8 aside, how did you like the 1D X in general? If Canon made an APS-H version of the 1D X, would it fill the role as a birders body?
My Photography
Current Gear: Canon 7D | Canon EF 600mm f/4 L IS II | EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS | EF 16-35mm f/2.8 L | EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro | 50mm f/1.4
New Gear List: Canon 5D III/7D II | Canon EF 300mm f/2.8 L II

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ********
  • Posts: 13548
    • View Profile
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2012, 01:05:36 PM »
600mm X 1.4= 840mm (1D X with a  1.4x TC – f/5.6)
600mm X 1.3= 780mm (1D MKIV – f/4) – No tele-converter attached.
600mm X 1.3 X 1.4= 1092mm (1D MKIV with a 1.4x TC – f/5.6)
600mm X 1.3 X 2= 1560mm (1D MKIV with a 2x TC – f/8) with a not so great AF. Single point.

600mm X 1.5 X 2= 1800mm (D800 with a 2x TC – f/8) with multiple cross-type AF points after cropping to the same 16 MP as the 1D MKIV.

Just sayin'. 
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

Maxis Gamez

  • PowerShot G1 X II
  • ***
  • Posts: 51
  • Bird Photography
    • View Profile
    • Bird Photography in Florida
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2012, 01:06:19 PM »
I still believe using a full frame for bird photography is not ideal even using a long lens like my 800mm.

I can understand that. Do you think you'd get a 7d (or an upgraded 7d) if a 1.3x crop doesn't happen again?

Just wondering what bird photographers will buy next..

If Canon drops the 7D line, and does not bring back a 1.3x crop camera, and really does indeed intend to drop f/8 AF in their Pro bodies, I think bird photographers on Canon gear are just SOL. I have a 7D now, and I would stick with that until the day it dies. I'd pick up a 1D IV if I could (they are getting rather hard to find...seems a lot of people still want the 1-series performance with a crop factor). In the absence of f/8 AF on any body and the loss of pro-grade crop bodies, I might move to Nikon. I really don't like that thought (I like Canon gear and ergonomics), but if Canon decides to ditch the bird photographers, I think bird photographers will have to ditch Canon. Reach is probably the most important factor for a birder, and being able to AF at maximum reach (which is often 600mm + 2x TC + CF... 1920mm on 1.6x or 1560mm on 1.3x) is critical. Nikon seems quite happy and capable of providing multiple f/8 sensitive AF points in their 51pt AF system, which is used on quite a few bodies.

Hang in there... I'm sure something is coming. Maybe not until late 2013 but They are well aware of our frustration. Trust me!

Well thats VERY good to hear. :) Thanks for the update, btw. The lack of f/8 aside, how did you like the 1D X in general? If Canon made an APS-H version of the 1D X, would it fill the role as a birders body?

The camera AF System is extremely fast. I would love to own this body but not as full frame.

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2012, 01:10:50 PM »
600mm X 1.4= 840mm (1D X with a  1.4x TC – f/5.6)
600mm X 1.3= 780mm (1D MKIV – f/4) – No tele-converter attached.
600mm X 1.3 X 1.4= 1092mm (1D MKIV with a 1.4x TC – f/5.6)
600mm X 1.3 X 2= 1560mm (1D MKIV with a 2x TC – f/8) with a not so great AF. Single point.

600mm X 1.5 X 2= 1800mm (D800 with a 2x TC – f/8) with multiple cross-type AF points after cropping to the same 16 MP as the 1D MKIV.

Just sayin'.

Not enough fps tho :(

jrista

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 3739
  • POTATO
    • View Profile
    • Nature Photography
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2012, 01:42:54 PM »
600mm X 1.4= 840mm (1D X with a  1.4x TC – f/5.6)
600mm X 1.3= 780mm (1D MKIV – f/4) – No tele-converter attached.
600mm X 1.3 X 1.4= 1092mm (1D MKIV with a 1.4x TC – f/5.6)
600mm X 1.3 X 2= 1560mm (1D MKIV with a 2x TC – f/8) with a not so great AF. Single point.

600mm X 1.5 X 2= 1800mm (D800 with a 2x TC – f/8) with multiple cross-type AF points after cropping to the same 16 MP as the 1D MKIV.

Just sayin'.

And only 4fps...I'll pass. ;P I'd LOVE a D800E for landscapes, given its DR...but even the 8fps of the 7D is sometimes a bit slow. I don't think I'd be able to stand 4fps. I think even the 6fps of the 5D III is probably at the edge of the lower limit on FPS for birding. Its amazing how much a fine, nuanced movement of a birds head or posture can make or break a photo.

(And thats nothing to say of the space requirements of using the D800. If I spend a day out photographing birds around a Colorado lake or reservoir, I can fill 4 16Gb CF cards, and as much as 6 cards if there is a lot of BIF. The 7D gets about 610 RAW shots per CF card, so thats about 2500-3600 photos. That would be 175Gb to 252Gb of photos a day, or 10-16 16Gb CF cards, if I was using the D800! Every five shoots would fill up a 1Tb drive...)
« Last Edit: May 08, 2012, 01:44:55 PM by jrista »
My Photography
Current Gear: Canon 7D | Canon EF 600mm f/4 L IS II | EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS | EF 16-35mm f/2.8 L | EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro | 50mm f/1.4
New Gear List: Canon 5D III/7D II | Canon EF 300mm f/2.8 L II

neuroanatomist

  • CR GEEK
  • ********
  • Posts: 13548
    • View Profile
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2012, 01:46:00 PM »
Just playing devil's advocate.  ;) I am getting a 1D X (which will replace my 5DII)...would I like f/8 AF?  Sure.  But...I'm keeping my 7D for birds/wildlife shooting.
EOS 1D X, EOS M, and lots of lenses
______________________________
Flickr | TDP Profile/Gear List

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2012, 01:46:00 PM »

npc2396

  • Guest
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #22 on: May 08, 2012, 02:38:45 PM »
Am I the only one that prefers birding with a 5DIII over a 7D?  I had both and there was just more detail available in the 5DIII then the 7D which negated the crop advantage of the 7D completely. 

Maxis Gamez

  • PowerShot G1 X II
  • ***
  • Posts: 51
  • Bird Photography
    • View Profile
    • Bird Photography in Florida
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #23 on: May 08, 2012, 02:41:46 PM »
Am I the only one that prefers birding with a 5DIII over a 7D?  I had both and there was just more detail available in the 5DIII then the 7D which negated the crop advantage of the 7D completely.

I used it for 2 1/2 years before upgrading to the 1D MKIV.

Marsu42

  • Canon EF 400mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 4356
  • ML-66d / 100L / 70-300L / 17-40L / 600rts
    • View Profile
    • 6D positive spec list
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #24 on: May 08, 2012, 03:02:17 PM »
Hang in there... I'm sure something is coming. Maybe not until late 2013 but They are well aware of our frustration. Trust me!

1.5 years is a long time in the technology market - while it is fine that Canon is listening to customers now and then, I'm not really confident because they've gotten caught with their pants down twice now considering the d800/5d3@3500$ and 1dx/af8 issues. But maybe that's too much concentrating on weaknesses.

jrista

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 3739
  • POTATO
    • View Profile
    • Nature Photography
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #25 on: May 08, 2012, 03:09:34 PM »
Am I the only one that prefers birding with a 5DIII over a 7D?  I had both and there was just more detail available in the 5DIII then the 7D which negated the crop advantage of the 7D completely.

Well, the "complete" negation argument is just plain false. From a spatial resolution standpoint, you would have to have a 47.6mp FF sensor to be able to crop out the center 18mp to match a 7D (both of which would have a 116lp/mm native spatial resolution (a bit less if you factor in the low pass filter)). Assuming you had a 47.6mp FF sensor, using the same lens on both cameras, if you fill the frame on the 7D with say a 600/4, then you could use the same lens on the FF and crop out the center 18mp and end up with an identical photo. Only then could you actually claim "complete negation" of the 7D's resolution advantage. The 5D III is actually at a disadvantage spatially (80lp/mm), which is the very reason why you need a longer lens (960mm) to get the same "framing" as you might with the 7D and a shorter lens (600mm).

If you are lucky enough to own an 800mm lens, the 5D III will probably serve you well...but you would be stuck with 800mm. You couldn't slap on a teleconverter and get more (since you would then be at f/8, and could no longer AF). You could use a 600mm f/4 with a 1.4x TC and get 840mm, but your still short of that 960mm you would need to actually fully negate the 7D's resolution advantage. And thats nothing to speak of the additional advantage of the 7D with the same 600/4 + 1.4x TC, which gives you an effective 1344mm. One way or another, the 7D has a reach advantage you just can't match with the 5D III, or for that matter even the 36.3mp D800.
My Photography
Current Gear: Canon 7D | Canon EF 600mm f/4 L IS II | EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS | EF 16-35mm f/2.8 L | EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro | 50mm f/1.4
New Gear List: Canon 5D III/7D II | Canon EF 300mm f/2.8 L II

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #26 on: May 08, 2012, 05:20:44 PM »
Am I the only one that prefers birding with a 5DIII over a 7D?  I had both and there was just more detail available in the 5DIII then the 7D which negated the crop advantage of the 7D completely.

The 7D hasn't got f/8 AF so it is down realistically between the 1D4 and the 1DX/5DIII

The 7D is a compromise for birding

jrista

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 3739
  • POTATO
    • View Profile
    • Nature Photography
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #27 on: May 08, 2012, 05:35:07 PM »
Am I the only one that prefers birding with a 5DIII over a 7D?  I had both and there was just more detail available in the 5DIII then the 7D which negated the crop advantage of the 7D completely.

The 7D hasn't got f/8 AF so it is down realistically between the 1D4 and the 1DX/5DIII

The 7D is a compromise for birding

Somewhat. You still get the extra crop factor, and a bit of extra reach, so its a compromise, but not really a bad one. I would prefer a 1.3x CF with f/8 AF though (or, if it was possible...not sure it is...f/8 AF and a 1.6x CF).
My Photography
Current Gear: Canon 7D | Canon EF 600mm f/4 L IS II | EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS | EF 16-35mm f/2.8 L | EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro | 50mm f/1.4
New Gear List: Canon 5D III/7D II | Canon EF 300mm f/2.8 L II

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #27 on: May 08, 2012, 05:35:07 PM »

briansquibb

  • Guest
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #28 on: May 08, 2012, 05:36:42 PM »
Am I the only one that prefers birding with a 5DIII over a 7D?  I had both and there was just more detail available in the 5DIII then the 7D which negated the crop advantage of the 7D completely.

The 7D hasn't got f/8 AF so it is down realistically between the 1D4 and the 1DX/5DIII

The 7D is a compromise for birding

Somewhat. You still get the extra crop factor, and a bit of extra reach, so its a compromise, but not really a bad one. I would prefer a 1.3x CF with f/8 AF though (or, if it was possible...not sure it is...f/8 AF and a 1.6x CF).

The 1D4 wins out on the low light stakes - doing iso 6400 without breaking a sweat

jrista

  • Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II
  • *******
  • Posts: 3739
  • POTATO
    • View Profile
    • Nature Photography
Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #29 on: May 08, 2012, 05:42:20 PM »
Am I the only one that prefers birding with a 5DIII over a 7D?  I had both and there was just more detail available in the 5DIII then the 7D which negated the crop advantage of the 7D completely.

The 7D hasn't got f/8 AF so it is down realistically between the 1D4 and the 1DX/5DIII

The 7D is a compromise for birding

Somewhat. You still get the extra crop factor, and a bit of extra reach, so its a compromise, but not really a bad one. I would prefer a 1.3x CF with f/8 AF though (or, if it was possible...not sure it is...f/8 AF and a 1.6x CF).

The 1D4 wins out on the low light stakes - doing iso 6400 without breaking a sweat

Hmm, good point. Thats one of the things that is a bummer with the 7D...it only Auto ISO's up to 3200, and 3200 is pretty rough to boot.
My Photography
Current Gear: Canon 7D | Canon EF 600mm f/4 L IS II | EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS | EF 16-35mm f/2.8 L | EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro | 50mm f/1.4
New Gear List: Canon 5D III/7D II | Canon EF 300mm f/2.8 L II

canon rumors FORUM

Re: Any new news about Canon 1D X f/8 AF?
« Reply #29 on: May 08, 2012, 05:42:20 PM »