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Author Topic: 7D full frame  (Read 19837 times)

facedodge

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #30 on: May 25, 2012, 12:08:07 PM »
My guess

Improved 18MP APS-C Sensor... one extra stop of usable ISO at Raw, two at Jpeg
Dynamic Range probably no meaningful change
Dual Digit 5
10FPS
headphone jack
improved weather sealing
5D3 AF

$2000+

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #30 on: May 25, 2012, 12:08:07 PM »

colin1984

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #31 on: May 25, 2012, 01:09:36 PM »
So as I said;

Here is the german link:

http://www.slashcam.de/news/single/Demnaechst-Einsteiger-Fullframe-VDSLRs-von-Nikon----9910.html

and here is the text translated with google translation:

Soon beginners VDSLRs full frame Nikon & Canon?

[09:48 Thu, May 24, 2012 [d] by rob ]
The rumor mill has done a great bubbling and ready as it seems both Canon full frame Nikon DSLRs before, which complete the full-frame segment toward the bottom. At Canon, it would be a Canon EOS 7D, Nikon MKII and a Nikon D600. Looking at the current product portfolio of the two DSLR market leader, makes an entry level full-frame DSLR actually sense, especially since the starting price for the full frame now a whopping 3.000, - € is.

Price in regions between 1500-2000 € could be an entry in the full-frame segment well imagine. The crucial question for us is whether the video capabilities of higher-quality full-frame DSLRs are 1:1 also be found in the entry-level or whether the user is inclined VDSLR with reduced functions have to live video.

This abundant cost-driving equipment features exist in the current full-frame DSLRs, which could be omitted from the entry-without the video capability approach must: magnesium housing, sensor resolution, frame rate (photo) to AF sensors and dust-/watersealing only a pair of call ... it probably will eventually amount to a marketing decision whether you want to leave the video segment as more significant focus of the USP or not - we are very excited to see how they will decide this.

A possible, though perhaps less likely scenario would be the reversal of the previous segmentation by bringing out a full-frame DSLR, which is intended primarily for video, and only secondarily for photography. Ok, Canon has the EOS 1 DC (4K) brought out but what about 2K and what with Nikon? Especially the latter buzz around current rumors that it might be a start to introduce into the video camera range - a Nikon video-cam with interchangeable lenses, which would be just as consistent at least focused on video as the Panasonic GH2 would impress us in any case difficult and once again is: 2012 - an exciting year for the large area sensor cam.

« Last Edit: May 25, 2012, 01:12:48 PM by colin1984 »
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nicku

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2012, 02:25:57 AM »
i Have read the most replies on this topic....conclusion:  do you realy think that canon will just kill the highly successful APS-H sensor???

Maybe the 7D2 will be APS-C but i am certain we will hear again from the APS-H sensor in the near future...

briansquibb

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2012, 02:49:42 AM »
i Have read the most replies on this topic....conclusion:  do you realy think that canon will just kill the highly successful APS-H sensor???

Maybe the 7D2 will be APS-C but i am certain we will hear again from the APS-H sensor in the near future...

The APS-H sensor was highly developed and was the heart of the top of the range cameras for some time. The logic of throwing away expertise and technology that good is not something that I would forecast - especially as the APS-H size is cheaper to produce than ff, plus it is a video friendly sized sensor. It is of course possible that the APS-H may be consigned to video cams in future rather than DSLRs

ecka

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2012, 03:48:04 AM »
For example, I'm using 5D2 and the Set button has no function in image replay/preview mode. Canon could make it a "fast focus check" button which would just switch between normal and 100% view.

Doesn't ml do this on the 5d2, too? On the 60d you can set the + button to instantly zoom to 100% (I'm always using it), and if you ask nicely they'll put it on the set button, too.

Yes, it does zoom on the 5D2 and I can choose normal-50%-100% jumps or just normal-100%. However, ML main purpose is video and it's fantastic for manual focus, bu I find it a bit awkward for stills.
FF + primes !

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #35 on: May 26, 2012, 03:51:11 AM »
How about trying to put all these options in perspective. Based on current rumours, what could the near future mid to high range Canon body line up look like? Ignoring the Cinema range of bodies that is.

My interpretation:

1D X
Future high MP full frame body
5D mk3
Future budget full frame model (5D2 taking that role for now)
7D mk2 - APS-C sensor, 5D3 style AF
70D - updated with 7D style AF

Imagine possibly THREE sub-1D full frame bodies in the lineup. I'm not sure there's a space for APS-H to fit in to all that.

The logic of throwing away expertise and technology that good is not something that I would forecast - especially as the APS-H size is cheaper to produce than ff, plus it is a video friendly sized sensor. It is of course possible that the APS-H may be consigned to video cams in future rather than DSLRs
I don't think there is much value in APS-H as a technology in itself. It's essentially a scaling exercise. If they can make APS-C and full frame sensors, making something in between isn't likely to cause anyone nightmares.

As an open question, who wants an APS-H body? I can imagine 1D series users may wish to continue having a future path for them on the same course, but do full frame or APS-C users also want APS-H?
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ruuneos

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2012, 04:26:53 AM »
Agreeing with lol, 7D will always have APS-C sensor. 5D must have little brother ::)

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #36 on: May 26, 2012, 04:26:53 AM »

Marsu42

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #37 on: May 26, 2012, 04:42:29 AM »
1D X
Future high MP full frame body
5D mk3
Future budget full frame model (5D2 taking that role for now)
7D mk2 - APS-C sensor, 5D3 style AF
70D - updated with 7D style AF

I agree if the this is what makes sense as far as I understand what would be competitive and what Canon users would buy. The only thing I'm not so sure about if there is a big enough market for a 7d2 that would cost as much as the "budget ff", but maybe since it's got the 1.6x tc and if it would be better equipped for outdoor use. Now let's see what Canon really does and when :-o

As an open question, who wants an APS-H body? I can imagine 1D series users may wish to continue having a future path for them on the same course, but do full frame or APS-C users also want APS-H?

The problem with aps-h is that you cannot use the good ef-s ultrawides nor can you use the potential of ef ones. That's why I think it'll be phased out. And even if the sensor is cheaper to produce than ff, I don't think this would make that large a difference nowadays in comparison to the rest of the body. If Canon want to release a new ff body well below $2000, they certainly can and don't need aps-h for that.

edawg

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #38 on: May 26, 2012, 05:33:05 PM »
7d ii won't be aps-h since you wouldn't be able to use ef-s lenses. Canon's not gonna sell a new dslr with the potential to kill that entire line of lenses.

briansquibb

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #39 on: May 26, 2012, 07:01:40 PM »

The problem with aps-h is that you cannot use the good ef-s ultrawides nor can you use the potential of ef ones. That's why I think it'll be phased out. And even if the sensor is cheaper to produce than ff, I don't think this would make that large a difference nowadays in comparison to the rest of the body. If Canon want to release a new ff body well below $2000, they certainly can and don't need aps-h for that.

Thanks for this evenings laugh :D

1D4 = sports camera being phased out because it doesn't make most use of ultra wide lens. The logic escapes me - but you wont see a sports tog with anything as short as a 14mm

Carrying your logic forward then the APS-C is doomed  because it cant make good use of the ultra wide lens like the ff bodies

Marsu42

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #40 on: May 26, 2012, 07:31:09 PM »
Thanks for this evenings laugh :D

:-)) This is the great thing about the internet - just understand what you want, and you'll have plenty to laugh forever! Also, it saves you plenty of calories because there's no need to think anymore, and why would you  given the current style in this forum. Right on, commander!

If you read my post again, I didn't write the *1d4* was phased out because of not working with ultrawides, but *aps-h* will be because it won't appear in a 7d2 (see the thread title?) for this reason. Just because the 7d is very well received by people who want the built-in 1.6x tc, it's still positioned for general use and thus will either have to work with ef or ef-s ultrawides. And at the same time the 1dx replaces the 1d4 for completely other reasons that have nothing to do with this thread, so aps-h is gone. 1+1 = 2, see?

briansquibb

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #41 on: May 26, 2012, 07:39:11 PM »
Thanks for this evenings laugh :D

:-)) This is the great thing about the internet - just understand what you want, and you'll have plenty to laugh forever! Also, it saves you plenty of calories because there's no need to think anymore, and why would you  given the current style in this forum. Right on, commander!

If you read my post again, I didn't write the *1d4* was phased out because of not working with ultrawides, but *aps-h* will be because it won't appear in a 7d2 (see the thread title?) for this reason. Just because the 7d is very well received by people who want the built-in 1.6x tc, it's still positioned for general use and thus will either have to work with ef or ef-s ultrawides. And at the same time the 1dx replaces the 1d4 for completely other reasons that have nothing to do with this thread, so aps-h is gone. 1+1 = 2, see?

The reason for APS-H is as for a sports camera. You might believe the 1DX replaced the 1D4 because that was the story Canon told us. Personally I believe the 1DX is not a functional replacement for the 1D4 - ask any wildlife/BIF shooter. The 7D is also a sports camera - so I would guess an APS-H version would also be a sports camera. Probably explains why the APS-C is still here because they dont do ultra wide like the FF.


Marsu42

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #42 on: May 26, 2012, 08:18:45 PM »
The 7D is also a sports camera - so I would guess an APS-H version would also be a sports camera.

It is a sports camera to *you*. But go in a shop and ask "What's the 7d good for?". They'll say it's an excellent camera for everything. And it is, well, if it would run magic lantern. And "everything" simply contains a lens offer below ff-20mm that isn't a fisheye. The many bird shooters with a 7d here in this forum produce a shifted view where the 7d is really positioned by Canon.

I don't say a 7d2 with aps-h wouldn't make sense or that I wouldn't want to use it, but I am saying that this is the reason why I am rather sure it won't happen, even if the ef-s compatibility problem wasn't there.

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #42 on: May 26, 2012, 08:18:45 PM »

briansquibb

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #43 on: May 27, 2012, 04:34:18 AM »
The 7D is also a sports camera - so I would guess an APS-H version would also be a sports camera.

It is a sports camera to *you*. But go in a shop and ask "What's the 7d good for?". They'll say it's an excellent camera for everything. And it is, well, if it would run magic lantern. And "everything" simply contains a lens offer below ff-20mm that isn't a fisheye. The many bird shooters with a 7d here in this forum produce a shifted view where the 7d is really positioned by Canon.

I don't say a 7d2 with aps-h wouldn't make sense or that I wouldn't want to use it, but I am saying that this is the reason why I am rather sure it won't happen, even if the ef-s compatibility problem wasn't there.

First time I have heard the 7D described as a general purpose camera - sure any camera will take any picture - like I often use the 'studio' 1DS3 for sports.

From Canon Europe on the 7D product page

Quote
18 Megapixel APS-C CMOS sensor
The EOS 7D offers superb resolution thanks to its 18MP CMOS sensor. Offering the photographer the choice of flexibility and creativity.

Up to 8 frames per second
Shoot 18MP 14-bit images at up to 8 fps as standard, in a burst of up to 126 large JPEGs; photographers can capture both detail and action.

FF have the superb 14mm wide angle lens to use - shorter than anything possible on APS-C.

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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #44 on: May 27, 2012, 04:58:01 AM »
Sigma 8-16 is not a fisheye and is equivalent to around 13mm. No, it isn't as fast but be realistic you're not using this class lens for shallow DoF short of the subject sitting on the lens filter, so ignoring DoF you could argue it has a bit more low light potential. With ignored DoF equivalence, full frame has that anyway.

Of course you can at this point suggest using one of the 12mm zooms on full frame and trump that again...
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Re: 7D full frame
« Reply #44 on: May 27, 2012, 04:58:01 AM »