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Author Topic: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]  (Read 24470 times)

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1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« on: March 12, 2011, 11:30:35 AM »

A new timetable?

Comments from Australia [NL].



  • The 5D Mark III will come at least 6 months after the 1Ds replacement. If a 1Ds is announced in April, that would put a 5D3 in the Oct 2011 timeframe. That would be just over 3 years since the 5D Mark II

  • The EF-S line of lenses are not high on the list of priorities at Canon.

  • “L” lenses and the development of them are whats needed to get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors.

  • Australia could expect price drops in April to combat the grey market.


I will note, I have not yet heard from the “2012 for the 1Ds replacement” folks in a while.


cr


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1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« on: March 12, 2011, 11:30:35 AM »

Chewy734

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2011, 11:56:57 AM »
While on the other end...  Nikon is rumored to be advancing their technology at a much faster pace and may release a mirrorless system in just a few weeks.

Honestly, I don't see why Canon just doesn't announce the 1Ds4 and/or 5D3 soon, and then tell people the release date will be sometime this Fall/Winter?  At least we'll have some concrete information that way.

AJ

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2011, 01:13:43 PM »
The EF-S line of lenses are not high on the list of priorities at Canon.
“L” lenses and the development of them are whats needed to get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors.


Hehehe...  Sounds like a line from a full-frame enthusiast and L-snob  Someone who obviously doesn't understand business.  Canon makes good money on their crop gear.  Furthermore, if you want to get the most out of your 18 mpix crop sensor then EF-S lenses like 17-55 and 15-85 are the way to go.  Why struggle with full-frame ultrawides thast have limited focal length range and/or aperture.

This is CR -10, folks.

traveller

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2011, 02:00:32 PM »
Canon has been pretty watertight recently, with few leaks of any substance until days before the official announcement.  I'm guessing that when the 1Ds Mk4 is annouced it wil all start to happen very quickly. 

It's a shame that EF-S has been relagated as there are still so many holes in the lineup.  Apart from the 17-55mm f/2.8, the 60mm f/2.8 Macro and the recent 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6, there are no other lenses for serious users.  I'd have to agree that what Thom Hogan says about the Nikon DX lineup (http://www.bythom.com/state2010.htm) applies equally (if not more so) to Canon.  Yes, there are FF lenses that fill some gaps, but many of these are old and a bit sub-par (e.g. the non-L primes in the 28-35mm range) and using others leaves you with a camera bag that is heavy, expensive and a bit long for many people (e.g. the 70-200mm Ls).  I guess that there are third party options, but a company with Canon's market share shouldn't need to rely on Sigma and Tamron to prop up its lens lineup. 

So, lets give Canon a break and write EF-S off for a year (as it's a full frame camera refresh year); may I suggeat that in 2012-3, Canon fill out some of my wishlist:

Budget - Sub $250:
EF-S 30mm f/1.8 USM (priced at under $250 -Nikon can do it, why can't Canon?!)


Mid-range - $250-$499
EF-S 15mm f/2.8 USM (wide angle was what EF-S was designed for)
EF-S 22mm f/2 USM (nice compact lens/body combo for street photographers)
EF-S 50-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM (EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 USM IS replacement for those who can't afford the L).   

High-end - over $500
EF-S 50-135mm f/2.8 IS USM WS (weathersealed ala Pentax -to complement the 7D Mk2)
EF-S 15-50mm f/2.8 IS USM WS (weathersealed to complement the 7D Mk2)
EF-S 8-15mm f/? (not sure for f/4 size/weight, or f/2.8 for available light?)

In addition, I think that Canon should re-focus its crop sensor lineup to offer smaller cameras to go with these smaller lenses; the 7D is great, but (IMHO) it would be even better if it were the size of the Pentax K5. 

Would this mean that some people might stay APS-C rather than go full frame? Possibly, but I think that this would be more than offset by the people who would choose the Canon system and those that are currently forced to buy third party lenses. 

c.d.embrey

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2011, 02:51:50 PM »
The EF-S line of lenses are not high on the list of priorities at Canon.
“L” lenses and the development of them are whats needed to get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors.


Hehehe...  Sounds like a line from a full-frame enthusiast and L-snob  Someone who obviously doesn't understand business.  Canon makes good money on their crop gear.  Furthermore, if you want to get the most out of your 18 mpix crop sensor then EF-S lenses like 17-55 and 15-85 are the way to go.  Why struggle with full-frame ultrawides thast have limited focal length range and/or aperture.

This is CR -10, folks.

The EF-S 10-22mm f3.5/4.5 is also a great lens. That and a EF 85mm f1.8 is all I use.

c.d.embrey

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2011, 02:55:21 PM »
Canon has been pretty watertight recently, with few leaks of any substance until days before the official announcement.  I'm guessing that when the 1Ds Mk4 is annouced it wil all start to happen very quickly. 

It's a shame that EF-S has been relagated as there are still so many holes in the lineup.  Apart from the 17-55mm f/2.8, the 60mm f/2.8 Macro and the recent 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6, there are no other lenses for serious users.  I'd have to agree that what Thom Hogan says about the Nikon DX lineup (http://www.bythom.com/state2010.htm) applies equally (if not more so) to Canon.  Yes, there are FF lenses that fill some gaps, but many of these are old and a bit sub-par (e.g. the non-L primes in the 28-35mm range) and using others leaves you with a camera bag that is heavy, expensive and a bit long for many people (e.g. the 70-200mm Ls).  I guess that there are third party options, but a company with Canon's market share shouldn't need to rely on Sigma and Tamron to prop up its lens lineup. 

So, lets give Canon a break and write EF-S off for a year (as it's a full frame camera refresh year); may I suggeat that in 2012-3, Canon fill out some of my wishlist:

Budget - Sub $250:
EF-S 30mm f/1.8 USM (priced at under $250 -Nikon can do it, why can't Canon?!)


Mid-range - $250-$499
EF-S 15mm f/2.8 USM (wide angle was what EF-S was designed for)
EF-S 22mm f/2 USM (nice compact lens/body combo for street photographers)
EF-S 50-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM (EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 USM IS replacement for those who can't afford the L).   

High-end - over $500
EF-S 50-135mm f/2.8 IS USM WS (weathersealed ala Pentax -to complement the 7D Mk2)
EF-S 15-50mm f/2.8 IS USM WS (weathersealed to complement the 7D Mk2)
EF-S 8-15mm f/? (not sure for f/4 size/weight, or f/2.8 for available light?)

In addition, I think that Canon should re-focus its crop sensor lineup to offer smaller cameras to go with these smaller lenses; the 7D is great, but (IMHO) it would be even better if it were the size of the Pentax K5. 

Would this mean that some people might stay APS-C rather than go full frame? Possibly, but I think that this would be more than offset by the people who would choose the Canon system and those that are currently forced to buy third party lenses.

Sign-me-up for the 15mm, 22mm and 30mm primes. That and the EF 85mm f1.8 is all I need.

dthomasla

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2011, 03:14:05 PM »
Another prediction about when the 5D3 will be announced !!   After delaying my purchase of the 5D2 for six months because of the latest prediction that the 5D3 was just a few months away I got disgusted with this "cat and mouse" game and bought the 5D2.  I couldn't be happier.   :)   The new body has given me many new challanges and taken my photography to a new level .  I have literally taken hundreds of photos that would have been impossible or mediocre on my old 40D.   I'm glad I stopped waiting for the 5D3 "ghost" to appear.

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2011, 03:14:05 PM »

x-vision

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2011, 05:00:44 PM »
This is CR -10, folks.

+1000.

First of all, there would be no 1Ds4. That boat has sailed.
Next pro body from Canon will the 1DV - FF, high resolution, high frame rate.

Second, Canon already has EF-S updates in the pipeline.
An update of the efs-60 macro is coming with IS.
Also, Canon has patented a design for an update of the 17-55 f2.8 efs lens.
The new design is flexible and allows either making the aperture of the current 17-55 faster to f2 (yes, f2) or extending the focal range to 15-55.
Don't know what Canon will chose. Most likely marketing will push for 15-55/f2 (yes, f2).

fultonx

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2011, 07:33:41 PM »
Well, if the 1Ds Mark IV were to come out this year, it would probably be best for April/May when they are releasing their new telephoto lenses.

As an Australian, I'm paying a lot of attention to the part about price drops coming.  Their high prices here are damaging local camera shops because they can't compete with any operating offshore.  Seeing how the AUD has been relatively close to the USD for some time, this would be a positive move.

Etienne

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2011, 11:10:39 PM »
Another prediction about when the 5D3 will be announced !!   After delaying my purchase of the 5D2 for six months because of the latest prediction that the 5D3 was just a few months away I got disgusted with this "cat and mouse" game and bought the 5D2.  I couldn't be happier.   :)   The new body has given me many new challanges and taken my photography to a new level .  I have literally taken hundreds of photos that would have been impossible or mediocre on my old 40D.   I'm glad I stopped waiting for the 5D3 "ghost" to appear.

I went through this same dilemma over a year ago. There's always going to be something better just about to be released. I don't regret getting the 5DII at all. Sure, I'd love to see the 5DIII released, and I'll get one when it is. And I'll get the 5DIV too. In the meantime I'm enjoying the 5DII immensely. I sold the 40D, and bought a 60D for backup, and it only made me even more happy that I went 5D instead of 7D. Nothing wrong with the 60D, but the 5DII produces better pictures and better video.

WarStreet

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2011, 05:45:08 AM »
This is CR -10, folks.

Agree ! Apart the fact that EF-S lenses and APS-C customers are very important for Canon, the guy is not technical at all. "“L” lenses and the development of them are whats needed to get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors."

(1) It is easier to get a better resolving ability with an EF-S lens instead an EF one when used on APS-C

(2) "Get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors" is just non sense.  Resolution will improve when you improve either the sensor or lens. So, a better lens will improve the end result resolution on both a 12mp and an 18mp sensors. On the other hand, an 18mp sensor will improve the end result resolution compared to a 12mp sensor, even when used on an old low resolution lens. So the 18mp sensors resolution with the current lenses, are ahead than the lower mp sensors and don't need any extra help, while an improved lens is welcome for all sensors not just the 18mp ones  ;)
   
« Last Edit: March 13, 2011, 08:13:24 AM by WarStreet »

match14

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2011, 09:31:37 AM »
The EF-S line of lenses are not high on the list of priorities at Canon.
“L” lenses and the development of them are whats needed to get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors.


Hehehe...  Sounds like a line from a full-frame enthusiast and L-snob  Someone who obviously doesn't understand business.  Canon makes good money on their crop gear.  Furthermore, if you want to get the most out of your 18 mpix crop sensor then EF-S lenses like 17-55 and 15-85 are the way to go.  Why struggle with full-frame ultrawides thast have limited focal length range and/or aperture.

This is CR -10, folks.

I agree, unless of course Canon are going to make a 15-70mm f/4L or similar, which is unlikely.

match14

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2011, 09:34:08 AM »
EF-S 15-50mm f/2.8 IS USM WS (weathersealed to complement the 7D Mk2)

15-55mm surely?

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2011, 09:34:08 AM »

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2011, 03:52:32 PM »
The EF-S line of lenses are not high on the list of priorities at Canon.
“L” lenses and the development of them are whats needed to get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors.


Hehehe...  Sounds like a line from a full-frame enthusiast and L-snob  Someone who obviously doesn't understand business.  Canon makes good money on their crop gear.  Furthermore, if you want to get the most out of your 18 mpix crop sensor then EF-S lenses like 17-55 and 15-85 are the way to go.  Why struggle with full-frame ultrawides that have limited focal length range and/or aperture.

This is CR -10, folks.

I agree, unless of course Canon are going to make a 15-70mm f/4L or similar, which is unlikely.

I'm with Match and AJ on this one. The third-party manufacturers seem to be putting a heavy emphasis on developing quality lenses for crop sensor cameras. I can't see Canon ceding that market.

Actually, this statement doesn't make any sense:
Quote
“L” lenses and the development of them are whats needed to get the most out of the 18mp crop sensors.

If you need higher quality lenses to get the most out of 18mp sensors, why wouldn't you be developing and marketing these lenses? Especially since the 18mp sensor now dominates the Canon crop sensor line up. Really though, optical quality hasn't been the problem with the more recent EF-S lenses – the issue is inconsistent build quality and speed. There is definitely a market for fast, well-built lenses for crop sensor cameras.

Call it CR -10 or, more accurately, an opinion masquerading as a rumor.
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Etienne

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2011, 04:03:32 PM »
Most crop cameras are sold to consumers who are reluctant to pay $1000 - $2000 or more for a lens.  That's probably why Canon seems reluctant to invest as much in EFS. That may change, but why wait when FF cameras produce better images/video and have more/better glass options. The crop cameras haven't even produced a huge weight/size savings if you use good glass (EF-S 17-55 2.8 is same size as 24-105 f4, which is the closest equivalent lens)

Whereas most pros will be the best available lens even if it's 4 times as expensive as the next best option.

I'd love a 20-24mm pancake for the 60D, but failing that, I'll take the 5DII even as a walk around.

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Re: 1Ds4 & 5D3 Timetable [CR1]
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2011, 04:03:32 PM »