Canon Rebel T4i/650D EF-S 18-135 f/3.5-5.6 IS STM & EF 40mm f/2.8 STM Officially Announced

[Silverstream]

Bottom line: IQ and ISO in RAW will be the same as T2i\T3i.

Yup.  I can't believe my more than 2-year-old T2i will basically have the same RAW IQ as the latest and greatest Canon crop body offering, which is $849 body only.  It's rather sad.

Since this is a new sensor, It is extremely unlikely that IQ will be the same with 3 years of technological refinement time. Please take the time to read the materials out there before making such silly statements.

Autofocus actually has some features that exceed the autofocus in the 7D. I had my expectations low and am now super excited.

[neuroanatomist]

Since this is a new sensor, It is extremely unlikely that IQ will be the same with 3 years of technological refinement time. Please take the time to read the materials out there before making such silly statements.

Please detail the effect of >3 years of tecnhological refinement on the FF CMOS sensor used in the 5DIII vs. that in the 5DII.  I'm not talking about better jpg conversion thanks to improvements in Digic, I mean the actual RAW image quality from the sensor, nor am I talking about Canon's marketing Kool-Aid.  Please take the time to review past history before making such silly statements. 

[Tammy]

Am i the only one who would like handheld night mode and NR multi-shot modes as an option even on my 5D Mark III as well!?

Yes the handheld night mode springs from a feature on Sony's point and shoots and could help the more novice shooters with keeping acceptable handheld shutter speeds/sharp low light shots, but it can also be used by more advanced shooters as a form of image stabilization to achieve the same shot at a lower effective iso.. and with a handheld night shot mode or NR multi-exposure reduction mode helping to gain an additional 1+ stop in noise performance of the 5D Mark III's already outstanding performance, I just think that would be great to have as an option.. which I doubt is in consideration for the next firmware updates.. =T

[Jaahn]

Since this is a new sensor, It is extremely unlikely that IQ will be the same with 3 years of technological refinement time. Please take the time to read the materials out there before making such silly statements.

Please detail the effect of >3 years of tecnhological refinement on the FF CMOS sensor used in the 5DIII vs. that in the 5DII.  I'm not talking about better jpg conversion thanks to improvements in Digic, I mean the actual RAW image quality from the sensor, nor am I talking about Canon's marketing Kool-Aid.  Please take the time to review past history before making such silly statements.

I believe Sipverstream has a point here. This is a NEW sensor, despite having the same resolution as the old one. It is indeed highly unlikely that the RAW IQ is exactly the same. I hope that it is better. However there must be some tweaks as maximum ISO has increased from T3i to T4i. Only reviews will tell...
Im really happy that Canon did not increase MP, I just dont need it...

[neuroanatomist]

Since this is a new sensor, It is extremely unlikely that IQ will be the same with 3 years of technological refinement time. Please take the time to read the materials out there before making such silly statements.

Please detail the effect of >3 years of tecnhological refinement on the FF CMOS sensor used in the 5DIII vs. that in the 5DII.  I'm not talking about better jpg conversion thanks to improvements in Digic, I mean the actual RAW image quality from the sensor, nor am I talking about Canon's marketing Kool-Aid.  Please take the time to review past history before making such silly statements.

I believe Sipverstream has a point here. This is a NEW sensor, despite having the same resolution as the old one. It is indeed highly unlikely that the RAW IQ is exactly the same. I hope that it is better. However there must be some tweaks as maximum ISO has increased from T3i to T4i. Only reviews will tell...
Im really happy that Canon did not increase MP, I just dont need it...

Canon claims a "full 2-stop improvement" for the ISO performance of the 5DIII vs. the 5DII, and the maximum ISO on the 5DIII is indeed two stops higher.  But analysis of the RAW images shows only a very minor difference - perhaps 1/3-1/2 stops of real improvement.  The balance of the 'full 2 stops' is smoke, mirrors, and marketing hype for the improved jpg engine with Digic 5.  The increase in max ISO from T3i to T4i is only one stop, so if the '3 years of techhological refinement' relative ratio holds, that means 1/6 - 1/4 stop of real improvement in RAW ISO performance, which doesn't fall into my personal 'get excited about it' category, but rather into the BFD category.

[Jaahn]

Since this is a new sensor, It is extremely unlikely that IQ will be the same with 3 years of technological refinement time. Please take the time to read the materials out there before making such silly statements.

Please detail the effect of >3 years of tecnhological refinement on the FF CMOS sensor used in the 5DIII vs. that in the 5DII.  I'm not talking about better jpg conversion thanks to improvements in Digic, I mean the actual RAW image quality from the sensor, nor am I talking about Canon's marketing Kool-Aid.  Please take the time to review past history before making such silly statements.

I believe Sipverstream has a point here. This is a NEW sensor, despite having the same resolution as the old one. It is indeed highly unlikely that the RAW IQ is exactly the same. I hope that it is better. However there must be some tweaks as maximum ISO has increased from T3i to T4i. Only reviews will tell...
Im really happy that Canon did not increase MP, I just dont need it...

Canon claims a "full 2-stop improvement" for the ISO performance of the 5DIII vs. the 5DII, and the maximum ISO on the 5DIII is indeed two stops higher.  But analysis of the RAW images shows only a very minor difference - perhaps 1/3-1/2 stops of real improvement.  The balance of the 'full 2 stops' is smoke, mirrors, and marketing hype for the improved jpg engine with Digic 5.  The increase in max ISO from T3i to T4i is only one stop, so if the '3 years of techhological refinement' relative ratio holds, that means 1/6 - 1/4 stop of real improvement in RAW ISO performance, which doesn't fall into my personal 'get excited about it' category, but rather into the BFD category.

So there probably  IS a difference, albeit maybe a small one. I'm looking forward to read the first in-depth review!

[Marsu42]

But analysis of the RAW images shows only a very minor difference - perhaps 1/3-1/2 stops of real improvement.  The balance of the 'full 2 stops' is smoke, mirrors, and marketing hype for the improved jpg engine with Digic 5.

Unfortunately you seem to be correct - though a lot of people (including 5d3 owners) seem to believe otherwise. IK guess you were talking of iso noise - do you know if the 5d3 at least keeps its dynamic range longer than a minor improvement over the 5d2?

[ozzy666]

[/quote]
So there probably  IS a difference, albeit maybe a small one. I'm looking forward to read the first in-depth review!

If there is a difference ,even slight one then Canon PR machine would use it to full extent .Unfortunately if you look into their press release you will find nothing about IQ improvements,even something like "blah,blah new gapless microlens,improved Iso,IQ etc...... " Nothing, just nothing......... nada. Pity. Thanks NIKON for competition but seems like Canon dont care and all they offer at the moment is price increase.

[Marsu42]

Thanks NIKON for competition but seems like Canon dont care and all they offer at the moment is price increase.

If Canon reacts to the d800 shock, the new 24mp aps-c sensor and the upcoming d600, it'll be with the 70d. Imho the 650d's product cycle was started the day they released the d600, no time to do something revolutionary with it - and the target audience wouldn't notice anyway.

But if the 70d maybe @photokina is again the standard Canon stuff with embarrassing fixes for lack sensor development (hdr mode, multi-shot noise reduction) we'll know what were facing - Canon going premium and video, while trying to save their midrange lineup with better af systems.

[ozzy666]

Thanks NIKON for competition but seems like Canon dont care and all they offer at the moment is price increase.

If Canon reacts to the d800 shock, the new 24mp aps-c sensor and the upcoming d600, it'll be with the 70d. Imho the 650d's product cycle was started the day they released the d600, no time to do something revolutionary with it - and the target audience wouldn't notice anyway.

But if the 70d maybe @photokina is again the standard Canon stuff with embarrassing fixes for lack sensor development (hdr mode, multi-shot noise reduction) we'll know what were facing - Canon going premium and video, while trying to save their midrange lineup with better af systems.

Maybe you are right but third incarnation of the same sensor even for the rebel audience -way out of my understanding,plus they had the chance of at least smoothing that D800\3200 aftershock with more competitive pricing but instead desided to test the limits of their loyal customer base.

[briansquibb]

Maybe you are right but third incarnation of the same sensor even for the rebel audience -way out of my understanding,plus they had the chance of at least smoothing that D800\3200 aftershock with more competitive pricing but instead desided to test the limits of their loyal customer base.

It has already been established that this is a new 18mp sensor.

[neuroanatomist]

It has already been established that this is a new 18mp sensor.

Technically true.  The EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS II is a new lens, too, but the changes are cosmetics and algorithms, not optical - "new" but not in any way that actually matters for IQ.

So, has it been established that this new sensor offers any IQ improvements over its predecessor?

[Edwin Herdman]

If the camera can waste sensor pixels for AF (which will be good - the T1i has a permanently visible overlay that gets annoying), they must really have some notable improvements.

The "headline" improvements are going to baffle many people:  Only 18mp, same 9 point AF?  But on both counts those have been notably improved and the burst rate is nearly doubled to 5 fps, making up half the distance between this camera and the 7D.  That's pretty nice.

Looking forward to the 7D II, although I will probably end up sticking with my 7D for a long while.

[briansquibb]

It has already been established that this is a new 18mp sensor.

Technically true.  The EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS II is a new lens, too, but the changes are cosmetics and algorithms, not optical - "new" but not in any way that actually matters for IQ.

So, has it been established that this new sensor offers any IQ improvements over its predecessor?

Not until it is tested

[ozzy666]

It has already been established that this is a new 18mp sensor.

Technically true.  The EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS II is a new lens, too, but the changes are cosmetics and algorithms, not optical - "new" but not in any way that actually matters for IQ.

So, has it been established that this new sensor offers any IQ improvements over its predecessor?

Not until it is tested

We all want it to be new and improved.Yes it must be technically called new due to added Hybrid AF(welcome feature),but seems it was put on old 18mp.Just take a look at those Digic5 blurred ISO jpegs at DP review...same like t2i....Also if there any impovement, then Canon PR would use it to full extent,but i found nothing at all in their press release.