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Author Topic: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?  (Read 16581 times)

Phenix205

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #15 on: June 20, 2012, 12:26:04 PM »
If you can find a good used 28-70 2.8L, it'd save you money. I've had mine for 10 years. It produces amazingly sharp images.
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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #15 on: June 20, 2012, 12:26:04 PM »

AJ

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2012, 12:29:47 PM »
We have been using the 24-105 for over a year for weddings and have been very pleased with it. The IS offsets the one stop difference of aperture. Good luck!
Thanks for the wishes - but at what shutter rates are you shooting in lower light with the f4 24-105 to freeze motion for what final print/screen size and in what iso ratings does that result?
Let me give you an answer to that question.  The shutterspeed will be somewhere between 1/60 s and your flash synch speed.  Yes, to do wedding photography means you must master hotshoe flash.

My suggestion is 24-105 for standard zoom.  Use this lens with flash.  Then for shallow-dof shots use a long lens (e.g. 70-200/2.8) and perhaps also a shorter prime (e.g. 50/1.4).  You'll have versatility with the 24-105, allowing you to work quickly, and you can use the prime for slower work (e.g. artsy shots during hair or getting dressed).

thepancakeman

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2012, 12:36:07 PM »
The reason to get the 24-70L II version is that then you don't need primes in that range because the zoom will do just as well as the primes can, supposedly.  So suppose a wedding photographer wanted a 35mm and a 50mm prime lens.  Most would probably buy the L version let's say for sake of argument, even though this might not be true.  That would run about 1399 for the 35L new, and 1499 for the 50L new.  You only get two focal lengths for 2898.  If you buy the 24-70L II zoom lens, you probably are going to get just as good of quality for weddings as the primes for 2299, saving $600, plus all the other focal lengths.  It's not a bad deal.  I have some proof at least on my end, because my 24-70L I copy was sharper than my 35L at f/2.8.  That could be lens variation though. 

And the poster who uses the 24-105L, don't count that out with a good high-ISO performer such as the 5D Mk II.  It can do it.

Your forgot the reason we shoot primes. SPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED

Yup, changing lenses is much quicker than just zooming in or out.   ;D

No, seriously though, I know many people do great with primes, but personally if I'm in a dynamic situation (such as a wedding reception) I just miss too many shots if I'm using a prime.  That being said, speed (and DOF) is the big reason I would agree with the recommendations for a 24-70 over the 24-105.  We have a 24-105 and while the range is great, I almost never use it because it's simply not fast enough and doesn't generate enough background blur to pull the subjects out.

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2012, 12:36:39 PM »
We have been using the 24-105 for over a year for weddings and have been very pleased with it. The IS offsets the one stop difference of aperture. Good luck!
Thanks for the wishes - but at what shutter rates are you shooting in lower light with the f4 24-105 to freeze motion for what final print/screen size and in what iso ratings does that result?
Let me give you an answer to that question.  The shutterspeed will be somewhere between 1/60 s and your flash synch speed.  Yes, to do wedding photography means you must master hotshoe flash.

My suggestion is 24-105 for standard zoom.  Use this lens with flash.  Then for shallow-dof shots use a long lens (e.g. 70-200/2.8) and perhaps also a shorter prime (e.g. 50/1.4).  You'll have versatility with the 24-105, allowing you to work quickly, and you can use the prime for slower work (e.g. artsy shots during hair or getting dressed).

BTW, hes right. Marsu42, You will need to very competent in on-camera flash as you wont have an assistant. Direct Fill flash for outdoor use and bounce for indoors. You can use the bounce card or strap an index card to your flash. It works really well. Slow-sync for dances for fun effects but dont intrude too much.

It will always impress a couple to get amazing photos but without them even noticing you there. Its pretty easy to get spotted with the flash popping every other second. Two little primes and two small bodies and most no-one will notice you. Its fun work and have fun!

Pancakeman, I respect your use of zoomz. They're great at what they do, but Some prefer to be more daring and use two primes on two bodies. You'll have to swap sooner or later, why not get the advantage of Speed on your side?
« Last Edit: June 20, 2012, 12:39:12 PM by RLPhoto »

bdunbar79

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #19 on: June 20, 2012, 12:40:45 PM »
but you can still get this lens new from the same online store that I bought mine from for 2/3rds of the price you quoted (see link below)

I'm in Berlin/Germany I'm afraid, and due to the weak Euro prices are climbing and the used gear market is much smaller than in the US.

Or to look at it differently, the 1/25 with the 2.8 becomes 1/60 with the 1.8, 1/80 with 1.4 and 1/100 with 1.2.

But as you know there's a cost - if the subject is close, the dof even at f1.8 is so thin it's unusable for standard run&gun portraits or small group/couple shots. I have the (extremely crappy) 50/1.8 and know about the dof limitations. Imho while wedding clients don't want life-size prints, they do care about people's eyes/faces being out of focus because it kills the *perceived* picture sharpness. And with a thin dof, I'm more likely to screw up.

Since all of your subject matter is going to be middle of the frame (or it should be), edge sharpness is not likely to worry you.

I agree, that's why the Tamron is my current favorite - but better safe than sorry and ask around.

Since the 50 primes are cheap, it wouldn't hurt.

Yes, as long as it isn't the 50L... and Sigma 50/1.4 vs Canon 50L is the same "double the price" issue as 5d2/5d3 or Tamron 24-70 vs Canon 24-70ii.

So okay, I guess maybe I'd suggest to Marsu42 to pick a few lenses and shoot as assistant.  When you start making money, then it would make sense to have all of the lenses.  You could go 50 prime, 24-70 zoom, 85 prime, 135 prime, flash, tripod, 5D Mk II.

But with all these lenses *I* will need an assistant -) ... however, given the local prices into account few people will shoot with an assistant anyway, so I'll have to work this out on my own. Luckily, I have lots of advice from a pro who has shots weddings (he now does animal portraits & macro, he says he's fed up with being the wedding clown :-)).

Getting more lenses along the way is certainly a good idea, now it's just about the basic setup now to get into weddings and see if it works out. For the time being, I have a 100L IS so I hope that'll make up for not having a 85/135 prime.

Ohhhhhhhhhh got ya.  Yeah then at first I'd definitely waive the 85/135 combo in favor of your 100.  My memory isn't quite as sharp as it used to be, you mentioned that :)

Well heck in that case you can get the other lenses b/c you're not worried about 85/135.  You can use 100 on FF for wedding aisle shots.
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Marsu42

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2012, 12:41:46 PM »
Let me give you an answer to that question.  The shutterspeed will be somewhere between 1/60 s and your flash synch speed.  Yes, to do wedding photography means you must master hotshoe flash.

I know about the flash, I'll get a used 580ex2 or even bite the bullet and get a 600rt even for the 5d2 because it should be more future proof and has the 200mm reflector.

But exposing 24-70 (or 24-105) between 1/60 and 1/200 (5d2) or 1/250 (5d3) x-sync is quite a large span, so 1/60s at 70mm doesn't sound too attractive for shooting people. And the question is how high I'd have to raise the iso to get it to 1/125s higher, because as I understand it on the 5d2 I shouldn't got higher than iso3200?

I'll be using even a 24-70 often at f3.5 or f4 for dof safety, but have the versatility of the f2.8 when I need it. The question is if the versatility of the 70-105 zoom range is able to beat this shutter speed safety margin, because I can always crop a 21mp image, but cannot eliminate motion blur or do miracles with iso6400+ noise reduction?

cliffwang

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2012, 12:43:59 PM »
I'd get the tamron, The original 24-70 is a good lens but a bit long in the tooth. The tamron is better in every way except built quality, Plus VC.

Unless you have the budget for the MK2, the tamron is the obvious choice.
+1
If I didn't have my Canon 24-70mm MK1, I would get Tamron 24-70mm VC now.  Many reviews say Tamron 24-70mm overall is better than Canon 24-70mm MK1.  For wedding Canon 24-70mm MK2 may be the best; however, it's not out yet.
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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2012, 12:43:59 PM »

AJ

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #22 on: June 20, 2012, 01:08:47 PM »
And the question is how high I'd have to raise the iso to get it to 1/125s higher, because as I understand it on the 5d2 I shouldn't got higher than iso3200?
That depends on how much ambient you want to mix in.  In most churches you should be able to get away with 1600 iso or thereabouts for background 0 EV (as metered) when shooting f/4.  In darker places (e.g. dancefloor, outdoor patio after dark) the background will be darker with this setting (foreground is lit by flash of course) unless you light the background with flash as well (bounced flash, second off-camera flash).

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #23 on: June 20, 2012, 01:11:25 PM »
I'd get the tamron, The original 24-70 is a good lens but a bit long in the tooth. The tamron is better in every way except built quality, Plus VC.

Unless you have the budget for the MK2, the tamron is the obvious choice.
+1
If I didn't have my Canon 24-70mm MK1, I would get Tamron 24-70mm VC now.  Many reviews say Tamron 24-70mm overall is better than Canon 24-70mm MK1.  For wedding Canon 24-70mm MK2 may be the best; however, it's not out yet.

+1 -0.5

-0.5 is about Canon 24-70 Mk II. It has no VC. And there are plenty of situations in which one needs VC at weddings. I rather preffer not to use flash for many reasons - one of the most important being that the people must be natural in order to get "the shot" and the flashes of the flash break the intimate atmosphere of a wedding.

+1 also for 50mm primes.

dilbert

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #24 on: June 20, 2012, 01:22:07 PM »
Oh, add a macro just in case you want close ups of something small.

Dylan777

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #25 on: June 20, 2012, 01:26:15 PM »
I'm not a big fan using 3rd party lenses - sigma, tamron etc... I'm staying with Canon. I bought 3 different copies of Canon 24-70 mrk I in the past, none of them gave me the sharpness that I'm looking for >:(

Interesting combination, you saying you don't like 3rd party gear while being disappointed by the 24-70 mk1 :-o ... So from what I'm hearing so far the smart move is either to get the €1000 Tamron and a good prime or the stellar 24-70 mk2 on its own - but I'm very interested in further input on how the Tamon would do as the "run & gun" lens for weddings & events.

If am you - I would try Tamron NOW and mrk II later. Buy it from authorized dealer - you have 30days to return it. See which lens is best for you. My feeling is mrk II will be a MUST have lens in the bag, similar to 70-200 2.8 IS II  ;) 

Having IS or VC is great for slowing down shutterspeed, however, you still can't freeeze the object-motion. Why not go for smaller, lighter and sharper.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2012, 01:37:42 PM by Dylan777 »
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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #26 on: June 20, 2012, 01:27:54 PM »
Oh, add a macro just in case you want close ups of something small.

I've got a 100L, as stated in every of my posts (look under my name to the left), mentioned in my first and many successive posts in these thread...

My feeling is mrk II will be a MUST have lens in the bag  ;)

My current "must" is to get some money out of pro photography after 1 year or so, and not spending it :-p

And there are plenty of situations in which one needs VC at weddings.

Are there? Plenty? All I'm all in favor of a "free" IS of a Tamron lens that performs like the Canon mk1 and is much cheaper, and I'll use the IS for my personal spare time shots. But except for totals of the church and such no situations would spring to my mind that wouldn't involve people, thus rendering the IS advantage nearly moot at these focal lengths?

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #27 on: June 20, 2012, 01:38:49 PM »
i'd shoot a wedding with 35 & 85mm prime. on full frame terms.

I might do this too with more experience, but I've been advised that at least for starting wedding photography a 24-70 is the fool-proof option to go with...

We have been using the 24-105 for over a year for weddings and have been very pleased with it. The IS offsets the one stop difference of aperture. Good luck!

Thanks for the wishes - but at what shutter rates are you shooting in lower light with the f4 24-105 to freeze motion for what final print/screen size and in what iso ratings does that result?

So suppose a wedding photographer wanted a 35mm and a 50mm prime lens.  Most would probably buy the L version let's say for sake of argument, even though this might not be true.  That would run about 1399 for the 35L new, and 1499 for the 50L new.  You only get two focal lengths for 2898.  If you buy the 24-70L II zoom lens, you probably are going to get just as good of quality for weddings as the primes for 2299, saving $600, plus all the other focal lengths.  It's not a bad deal. 

Weeellll, I thought about the 35L + 50L > 24-70iiL myself. But I'm not sure if one 24-70/2.8 is really sufficient, but I guess I'll want at least one prime for really low light as well. My most probable choice would be the $400 Sigma 50/1.4 which I can dual-use on my 60d for ~85mm portraits, too - but then its equal 35L + 50L = 24-70ii + s50 :-o

I like 1/100, ISO ranges from 100 (outdoor) to 6400 (if I have to in low light and/or no flash allowed). I had recommended the 24-70 I and 70-200 F/2.8 IS II to my boyfriend as the preferred zoom kit, but they were out of budget. We elected to go with the 24-105 and upgrade lenses later. I've been so pleased with the 24-105 and 5d2 combo, though, that replacing it with a 24-70 is not a priority at the moment. The largest enlargements I've had requested thus far are 20x24. I am also new to wedding photography and just completed my 10th wedding last weekend. It's going well - the brides are thrilled with their photos and are actively referring me to other brides :-) Would have loved the opportunity to work as a 2nd shooter for someone who really knows the tricks of the trade. Instead, I tagged along with my boyfriend who is an established wedding videographer. This was done with the bride's approval, of course, and I made it a point not to interfere with the official photographer. So, the first 5 weddings I shot for free, no pressure because nothing was expected of me, tested settings and started building a portfolio. Once I had a portfolio started, the paid jobs started coming in.

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #27 on: June 20, 2012, 01:38:49 PM »

Dylan777

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #28 on: June 20, 2012, 01:45:01 PM »
Oh, add a macro just in case you want close ups of something small.

I've got a 100L, as stated in every of my posts (look under my name to the left), mentioned in my first and many successive posts in these thread...

My feeling is mrk II will be a MUST have lens in the bag  ;)

My current "must" is to get some money out of pro photography after 1 year or so, and not spending it :-p

And there are plenty of situations in which one needs VC at weddings.

Are there? Plenty? All I'm all in favor of a "free" IS of a Tamron lens that performs like the Canon mk1 and is much cheaper, and I'll use the IS for my personal spare time shots. But except for totals of the church and such no situations would spring to my mind that wouldn't involve people, thus rendering the IS advantage nearly moot at these focal lengths?

How often do you hear "get the right tool for the right job".  Also, Canon L lenses hold their values better than 3rd party lenses.
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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #29 on: June 20, 2012, 01:59:55 PM »
How often do you hear "get the right tool for the right job".  Also, Canon L lenses hold their values better than 3rd party lenses.

Asking what the right tool is what this thread is about - and "right" doesn't mean "most expensive", not even in an enthusiast's forum. For me, the re-sale value is only of concern for lenses I might actually want to sell again, but if I get the 24-70ii I'll keep it and the money is gone for good.

I had recommended the 24-70 I and 70-200 F/2.8 IS II to my boyfriend as the preferred zoom kit, but they were out of budget.

For me "budget" is relative to what a business is about: Earning money after some sane period of time rather than spending it. I *could* get a 5d3, 24-70ii and a 70-200/2.8ii, but I'd be near broke then and I serious doubt that would be smart business in relation to my first clients' expectations and my first salaries.

I had recommended It's going well - the brides are thrilled with their photos and are actively referring me to other brides :-)

Congrats to your successful business start! Please don't move to Berlin/Germany, will you :-> ... I guess being a women does help in this business since it's not that common, allows you more freedom and maybe people tend to be more relaxed? Well, can't change this fact now for me and have to work with what I am :-p

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Re: Which 24-70 to buy for weddings & events?
« Reply #29 on: June 20, 2012, 01:59:55 PM »