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Author Topic: 7D and 5D II that different?  (Read 8883 times)

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2012, 03:09:46 PM »
The larger pixels of the 5DII mean you can stop down further before diffraction begins costing you sharpness in your landscape shots.

If you consider equivalence, you'd need to stop down the 5D2 shots more than on the 7D to get the same depth of field, assuming you have already use the correct focal lengths for the same field of view. So there is no benefit to the 5D2 there. If anything, if you're going pixel peeping, the 5D2 would then be worse for diffraction since it has more of them.

Even for noise, still considering strict equivalence, the 7D is generally superior to me since when you go fishing in the shadows it is less prone to show banding. The only benefit I see for picking a 5D2 over a 7D is if you need the shallower depth of field that can be attained with lenses that exist.

The other apparent advantages of a bigger sensor only come into play if you don't need or care about strict equivalence.

Why would one shoot strictly for equivalence?  FF gives you the option for shallow DOF and faster shutter speed.  Given a trade between faster shutter speed and shallower DOF versus not getting the shot due to blur, I'd choose faster shutter speed and shallower DOF.  I'd rather shoot a 5DII at ISO 3200 in a dark auditorium rather than a 7D at ISO 3200.  The same lenses will also result in higher resolution (lp per image height) on a larger sensor.

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2012, 03:09:46 PM »

neuroanatomist

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2012, 03:40:16 PM »
Why would one shoot strictly for equivalence?  FF gives you the option for shallow DOF and faster shutter speed.

+1.

For me, I believe my deciding factor with going FF was simply just that. I've had a T2i for 2 years now and have heard so much about FF being great. I don't shoot any sports and I want to give FF a go.

The 7D uses the exact same CMOS image sensor as your T2i.  The benefits you'd gain with the 7D are entirely outside the area of (direct) IQ - faster frame rate, better AF especially AI Servo, more robust build, etc.
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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2012, 04:36:08 PM »
The 7D uses the exact same CMOS image sensor as your T2i.  The benefits you'd gain with the 7D are entirely outside the area of (direct) IQ - faster frame rate, better AF especially AI Servo, more robust build, etc.

Which is why I went for the 5D. I wanted to see what kind of image quality I would get from moving up to FF.

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2012, 05:08:21 PM »
Why would one shoot strictly for equivalence?  FF gives you the option for shallow DOF and faster shutter speed.  Given a trade between faster shutter speed and shallower DOF versus not getting the shot due to blur, I'd choose faster shutter speed and shallower DOF.  I'd rather shoot a 5DII at ISO 3200 in a dark auditorium rather than a 7D at ISO 3200.  The same lenses will also result in higher resolution (lp per image height) on a larger sensor.

I'm only using equivalence for comparison purposes, saying that in like for like output conditions, the 7D has the slight edge in theory (in practice, it is not really significant). BUT I also say if you do need to operate in the area that the 5D2 brings in which is not easily attainable on the 7D, obviously that's a benefit too. For those reasons, I have both cameras myself.

Personally, for a lot of my shooting, I don't need a shallow DoF and in fact I struggle to keep enough DoF on subjects. So overall, the 7D (or any other Canon 18MP crop sensor body) is better suited to me than a 5D2 is maybe 99% of the time. But I still got the 5D2 for that 1% of the time when the 7D reaches its sensor size limits.

As a parallel to the so called MP wars, I think too many people blindly think bigger sensor must always be better, without understanding why it might or might not be.
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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2012, 05:31:04 PM »
Lol, I understand where you're coming from. For me, I shoot landscapes and from what I have heard the FF does benefit here, and I am a big fan of shallow DoF in my portraits. Therefore I think the 5D plays more toward my tendencies than does the 7D.

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #20 on: August 08, 2012, 05:45:03 PM »
I hope I have collected all the circumstances on one diagram. Unofficial subjective 5d2 vs 5d3 vs 7d buyer's guide :-) I know the thread is on 7d vs 5d2 but if you can't have them both but still want best they both have, you should go 5d3 anyway (I don't have 5d3 so can't confirm all myself)


5d2 or 5d3 or 7d - buyer's guide :-) by marekjoz, on Flickr
« Last Edit: August 08, 2012, 06:04:20 PM by marekjoz »
flickr | youtube | 5D2, 50 F/1.4, 24-105 F/4 L IS, 300 F/4 L IS, x1.4 II

neuroanatomist

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2012, 05:55:41 PM »
BUT I also say if you do need to operate in the area that the 5D2 brings in which is not easily attainable on the 7D, obviously that's a benefit too. For those reasons, I have both cameras myself.

Agreed, but for me, that's a lot more than 1% of the time.

I had both 7D and 5DII, until swapping the latter for a 1D X.  IMO, the 5DII provides a ~1.3 stop ISO advantage over the 7D. As was pointed out earlier, that's a trade-off with DoF.  But...from my testing, I think the 1D X delivers a 2-stop advantage over the 5DII, with no penalty in terms of thinner DoF.
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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2012, 05:55:41 PM »

Jamesy

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2012, 05:59:10 PM »
I hope I have collected all the circumstances on one diagram. Unoficial subjective 5d2 vs 5d3 vs 7d buyer's guide :-) I know the thread is on 7d vs 5d2 but if you can't have them both but still want best hey have, you should go 5d3 anyway (I don't have 5d3 so can't confirm all myself)


5d2 or 5d3 or 7d - buyer's guide :-) by marekjoz, on Flickr

Hilarious and very true!

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #23 on: August 08, 2012, 06:04:47 PM »
I hope I have collected all the circumstances on one diagram. Unoficial subjective 5d2 vs 5d3 vs 7d buyer's guide :-) I know the thread is on 7d vs 5d2 but if you can't have them both but still want best hey have, you should go 5d3 anyway (I don't have 5d3 so can't confirm all myself)

Hilarious and very true!
Thank you :)
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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #24 on: August 08, 2012, 06:26:49 PM »
The 5DII is still a stellar camera and something about the images just looks awesome compared to the APS-C family.  7D is great but I think you made the right choice, the jump from a T2i was wonderful for me.  The only time I'd recommend the 7D over a 5DII is if you were shooting sports/wildlife and needed the superior AF/burst rate.
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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #25 on: August 08, 2012, 06:43:39 PM »
I hope I have collected all the circumstances on one diagram. Unofficial subjective 5d2 vs 5d3 vs 7d buyer's guide :-) I know the thread is on 7d vs 5d2 but if you can't have them both but still want best they both have, you should go 5d3 anyway (I don't have 5d3 so can't confirm all myself)


5d2 or 5d3 or 7d - buyer's guide :-) by marekjoz, on Flickr


Haha.. I like this :)
...and as long as the models are not running we're safe :)

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #26 on: August 08, 2012, 07:10:39 PM »
The 7D uses the exact same CMOS image sensor as your T2i.  The benefits you'd gain with the 7D are entirely outside the area of (direct) IQ - faster frame rate, better AF especially AI Servo, more robust build, etc.

Which is why I went for the 5D. I wanted to see what kind of image quality I would get from moving up to FF.

Congrads...you should like it! 
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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #27 on: August 08, 2012, 07:11:19 PM »
BUT I also say if you do need to operate in the area that the 5D2 brings in which is not easily attainable on the 7D, obviously that's a benefit too. For those reasons, I have both cameras myself.

Agreed, but for me, that's a lot more than 1% of the time.

I had both 7D and 5DII, until swapping the latter for a 1D X.  IMO, the 5DII provides a ~1.3 stop ISO advantage over the 7D. As was pointed out earlier, that's a trade-off with DoF.  But...from my testing, I think the 1D X delivers a 2-stop advantage over the 5DII, with no penalty in terms of thinner DoF.

It will be interesting to see how the next 1-2 generations of FF cameras develop.  If the pixel density of the 7D is about the limit of good sensor performance (Airy disk, etc.), then a FF camera that is about 46 MP will match it, and there would be no advantage of a crop camera besides price and file size.

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #27 on: August 08, 2012, 07:11:19 PM »

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #28 on: August 08, 2012, 07:18:35 PM »
But also the 5D MKII is a step backwards. AF system is so old and ruins the camera really, is it still worth £1600 I don't think so, if it were £1250 £1300 then I would say yes. But then the 5D MKIII is that worth another £1000 premium again no, but this is a frustrating time as a buyer for Canon so you did right pulling the trigger I just won't! It would be my luck to pull the trigger on one and it be dropped in price by a big margin or this consumer FF camera would be released. Also still shooting a 40D and spending £1600 on a camera with the same AF system would be counter productive IMO.
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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2012, 07:59:12 PM »
But also the 5D MKII is a step backwards. AF system is so old and ruins the camera really, is it still worth £1600 I don't think so, if it were £1250 £1300 then I would say yes. But then the 5D MKIII is that worth another £1000 premium again no, but this is a frustrating time as a buyer for Canon so you did right pulling the trigger I just won't! It would be my luck to pull the trigger on one and it be dropped in price by a big margin or this consumer FF camera would be released. Also still shooting a 40D and spending £1600 on a camera with the same AF system would be counter productive IMO.

Sold my old 5D2 and got one for $1899 brand new not that long ago, canon auth. dealer+freeS&H (that's about £1212 right?). 

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Re: 7D and 5D II that different?
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2012, 07:59:12 PM »