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Author Topic: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?  (Read 2763 times)

Synomis192

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Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« on: August 12, 2012, 08:18:20 AM »
It's a pretty random question but I've been thinking about it ever since the Canon T4i was released.

Canon has been using the same senor as the 7d for 4 cameras now (T2i, T3i, T4i, and 60d).

Is it possible for Canon to create a new sensor for their Rebel line or x0d line? One that don't increase megapixel size, but makes high iso images better, better AF, and higher dynamic range?

I'm not down talking Canon, but it boggles my mind that they've been using the same sensor for 4 cameras. I can't speak for Nikon because I've never handled one myself, but many photographers prefer the dynamic range from Nikon than Canon.
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Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« on: August 12, 2012, 08:18:20 AM »

lola

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2012, 09:14:35 AM »
I they could, I'm sure they would...
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marekjoz

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2012, 10:13:33 AM »
I they could, I'm sure they would...

Not neccesserily. One thing is ability to develop such a sensor, the other thing is seeing a reason to put it there :)
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Ricku

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2012, 10:25:23 AM »
That is a very good question. The same thing can be said about the difference in sensor performance between the 5D2 and the new 5D3! ..There is no difference, unless you shoot above ISO 2000 and want to use your camera as some kind of handheld night vision device.

Hopefully Nikon's D800 has scared Canon's sensor devs into working harder from now on.




M.ST

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2012, 10:26:34 AM »
You can´t make profit when you develop a new sensor for each new camera.

But if you put the same sensor in a lot of different cameras you loose customers.

You loose also customers, if you develop a new sensor, that isn´t much better than the predecessor. You can see this with the 5D Mark II and the 5D Mark III.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2012, 10:29:25 AM by M.ST »

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2012, 10:54:54 AM »
Canon's total R&D spend has been falling between 2009-2011, as a percentage of gross sales, plus Canon's R&D spend for their Consumer Division has also been declining compared to the other 2 divisions (I've used samples of Canon Inc's P&L statements in numerous CR posts before, earlier this year to prove this).

Canon is deliberately spending less and less on R&D on consumer products (includes cameras & DSLR's). Why? Because as their Chairman in Japan states in simple English they see better growth prospects in their Industrial Division, plus there is natural growth geographically (Asia was singled out) for consumer products, especially Digital SLR's.

When you have a major corporation whose marketing department is telling them, we need to spend more on Advertising than on R&D because we need to sell more T3i's or T4i's to South Koreans, than we need to develop a better sensor for Americans & Brits so that they can trade-up. Read their official profit & loss statements and look at their balance sheet -> Canon is a publicly quoted/traded company on the stock market, this info is out there, but few bother to read it.

Mt Spokane Photography

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2012, 01:29:59 PM »
You are not correct in believing that the t4i sensor is the same. 
Canon has stated that they believe 18mp is the optimum photosite count for the best overall quality of a APS-C sensor, but that does not mean all 18mp sensors are the same.
The T4i sensor has changed to allow hybrid autofocus.  There are some microphotos of it here:
http://chipworks.force.com/catalog/ProductDetails?sku=CAN-EOS_Rebel-T4i_Pri-Camera&viewState=DetailView
 
http://www.chipworks.com/en/technical-competitive-analysis/resources/recent-teardowns/2012/07/inside-the-canon-rebel-t4i-dslr/
Here is the 550D Sensor:  https://chipworks.secure.force.com/catalog/ProductDetails?sku=CAN-1190&viewState=DetailView&cartID=&g=&parentCategory=a0u40000000QQstAAG&navigationStr=ListProduct&searchText=
 
The 7D Sensor:  https://chipworks.secure.force.com/catalog/ProductDetails?sku=CAN-1160&viewState=DetailView&cartID=&g=&parentCategory=a0u40000000QQstAAG&navigationStr=ListProduct&searchText=
 
Here is a index to the image sensors analyzed by Chipworks.  They do not necessarily check them all, someone has to buy the analysis.  Normally, a analysis is purchased by the competition to help determine if a patent violation has occurred, for example. 
https://chipworks.secure.force.com/catalog/Products?g=&cartID=&sortOrder=byDate&categoryID=a0u40000000QQstAAG
« Last Edit: August 12, 2012, 01:45:11 PM by Mt Spokane Photography »

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2012, 01:29:59 PM »

marekjoz

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2012, 02:14:11 PM »
You are not correct in believing that the t4i sensor is the same. 
Canon has stated that they believe 18mp is the optimum photosite count for the best overall quality of a APS-C sensor, but that does not mean all 18mp sensors are the same.
The T4i sensor has changed to allow hybrid autofocus.  There are some microphotos of it here:
http://chipworks.force.com/catalog/ProductDetails?sku=CAN-EOS_Rebel-T4i_Pri-Camera&viewState=DetailView
 
http://www.chipworks.com/en/technical-competitive-analysis/resources/recent-teardowns/2012/07/inside-the-canon-rebel-t4i-dslr/
Here is the 550D Sensor:  https://chipworks.secure.force.com/catalog/ProductDetails?sku=CAN-1190&viewState=DetailView&cartID=&g=&parentCategory=a0u40000000QQstAAG&navigationStr=ListProduct&searchText=
 
The 7D Sensor:  https://chipworks.secure.force.com/catalog/ProductDetails?sku=CAN-1160&viewState=DetailView&cartID=&g=&parentCategory=a0u40000000QQstAAG&navigationStr=ListProduct&searchText=
 
Here is a index to the image sensors analyzed by Chipworks.  They do not necessarily check them all, someone has to buy the analysis.  Normally, a analysis is purchased by the competition to help determine if a patent violation has occurred, for example. 
https://chipworks.secure.force.com/catalog/Products?g=&cartID=&sortOrder=byDate&categoryID=a0u40000000QQstAAG

Thanks! Nice research!
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kubrick

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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2012, 03:40:04 PM »
Their last sensors aren't the same, as Mt Spokane states, but the sensor technology they use remains the same. And this is their biggest problem. They also lost ground in the semiconductor lithography market.
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Re: Why doesn't Canon create a better senor for newer bodies?
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2012, 03:40:04 PM »