Who really is the target demographic for the 6D?

[dslrdummy]

I've owned a 5Dc that I Ran its full shutter life into the ground and then purchased a 5D3.

Now considering that a 5Dc can be had for 500$ on craigslist, its still the best camera you can buy for around that price range but the 6D is nothing like the 5Dc a at release.

The 5Dc had no competition in its time, while the 6D has to convice users not to buy a 5D2.

The 5Dc was released as a budget FF camera and still is the Budget FF digital camera, while the 6D isn't.

The 5Dc can still swap focusing screens, and Yes, There is a difference even with the 5D3's magnification.

The 5Dc is a Great camera but Comparing it to the 6D? Not even the same league.

The 6D is more like the 50D to 60D transition.

We agree that the 5DC is a great camera. Don't want to seem argumentative but not sure why you think the competition around at this time makes the 6D any less of a camera. And not sure why the 5DII, which many people have been bagging for the last year, is all of a sudden a more viable option. And when it is discontinued, as it no doubt will be shortly, what will the choices be then. 6D vs 5DIII? They are definitely not in the same league.
You can change focussing screens on the 5DC, OK, but what about the ten areas where the 6D is superior, you don't mention them.
Not in the same league? In what respects exactly? I frankly can't think of any except maybe build quality which we will have to wait and assess, but in terms of weather sealing my 5DC is pretty much hopeless so it won't have to be very good to beat it there.
And if the 6d is not a budget FF, what is it?

[pdirestajr]

I believe you can change focusing screens on the 6D too!

[Jotho]

I am certain trolls are not on Canon's list of potential buyers.

[weekendshooter]

I've owned a 5Dc that I Ran its full shutter life into the ground and then purchased a 5D3.

Now considering that a 5Dc can be had for 500$ on craigslist, its still the best camera you can buy for around that price range but the 6D is nothing like the 5Dc a at release.

The 5Dc had no competition in its time, while the 6D has to convice users not to buy a 5D2.

The 5Dc was released as a budget FF camera and still is the Budget FF digital camera, while the 6D isn't.

The 5Dc can still swap focusing screens, and Yes, There is a difference even with the 5D3's magnification.

The 5Dc is a Great camera but Comparing it to the 6D? Not even the same league.

The 6D is more like the 50D to 60D transition.

We agree that the 5DC is a great camera. Don't want to seem argumentative but not sure why you think the competition around at this time makes the 6D any less of a camera. And not sure why the 5DII, which many people have been bagging for the last year, is all of a sudden a more viable option. And when it is discontinued, as it no doubt will be shortly, what will the choices be then. 6D vs 5DIII? They are definitely not in the same league.
You can change focussing screens on the 5DC, OK, but what about the ten areas where the 6D is superior, you don't mention them.
Not in the same league? In what respects exactly? I frankly can't think of any except maybe build quality which we will have to wait and assess, but in terms of weather sealing my 5DC is pretty much hopeless so it won't have to be very good to beat it there.
And if the 6d is not a budget FF, what is it?

Don't feed the troll plz

[dilbert]

Although many of you have complained about this new Canon DSLR model, I will explain my point of view, as I could be a great example of the 6D target:

- I come from a 550d (T2i) and I'd like to switch to full frame but without spending too much money, so Canon 6D seems like a reasonable option

- I don't give a S___ about the number and type of AF points. I almost exclusively use the center point right now, so having 9, 11, 39, or 61 AF points makes no difference to me. I understand they are very important for some type of photography, but for me one AF point is enough for 99.5% of my photos (and please, that doesn't mean I use my camera as a point and shoot, and I never use auto modes, maybe I'm not an "enthusiast" as some people here have described them, but I am not stupid)

- I _love_ that Canon 6d uses SD cards. I own plenty SD cards from plenty of devices (not only cameras), while my most recent CF card is 256 MB and 9 years old...

- 20 Mp is more than enough for me. I would have liked 22 Mp so 1080p video could be resized from the sensor size with a /3 factor, but anyway 22-24 Mp is something I don't need in my photos.

- We are still pending of some decent reviews, but on paper Canon 6d is much better than D600 for low light photography, both for high ISO and -3 EV AF. And 70% of my photos are indoor, so this is a strong reason for me to prefer 6d over D600

- What I would have liked? Pop-up flash and 100% viewfinder coverage, but no camera is perfect... I can live without that.

- What else I don't bother about? GPS and Wifi, although my mind is changing after seeing the Smartphone remote controller for 6d... I will certainly make use of it

So, am I the perfect buyer? Not yet... I think $2100 (which will be absurdly translated to 2100-2200€ in Europe) is still too much, but I'm assuming a price of $1700-1800 in a few months, and I can wait for that

Yup, I think the "Canon APS-C upgrader" is the target market of the Canon 6D.

[Albi86]

Although many of you have complained about this new Canon DSLR model, I will explain my point of view, as I could be a great example of the 6D target:

- I come from a 550d (T2i) and I'd like to switch to full frame but without spending too much money, so Canon 6D seems like a reasonable option

- I don't give a S___ about the number and type of AF points. I almost exclusively use the center point right now, so having 9, 11, 39, or 61 AF points makes no difference to me. I understand they are very important for some type of photography, but for me one AF point is enough for 99.5% of my photos (and please, that doesn't mean I use my camera as a point and shoot, and I never use auto modes, maybe I'm not an "enthusiast" as some people here have described them, but I am not stupid)

- I _love_ that Canon 6d uses SD cards. I own plenty SD cards from plenty of devices (not only cameras), while my most recent CF card is 256 MB and 9 years old...

- 20 Mp is more than enough for me. I would have liked 22 Mp so 1080p video could be resized from the sensor size with a /3 factor, but anyway 22-24 Mp is something I don't need in my photos.

- We are still pending of some decent reviews, but on paper Canon 6d is much better than D600 for low light photography, both for high ISO and -3 EV AF. And 70% of my photos are indoor, so this is a strong reason for me to prefer 6d over D600

- What I would have liked? Pop-up flash and 100% viewfinder coverage, but no camera is perfect... I can live without that.

- What else I don't bother about? GPS and Wifi, although my mind is changing after seeing the Smartphone remote controller for 6d... I will certainly make use of it

So, am I the perfect buyer? Not yet... I think $2100 (which will be absurdly translated to 2100-2200€ in Europe) is still too much, but I'm assuming a price of $1700-1800 in a few months, and I can wait for that

Nothing personal, but I will use you to exemplify the demographic target for this camera.

You don't like the 6D, you don't think it's a good camera. It's just the only FF in Canon's lineup that you can afford, and this is why you will buy it.

All the rest is just you convincing yourself that it will be a good purchase in absolute terms. You only made a list of "I can live with...", while when I spend 2000€ I like to say "I can't wait to...".

Canon didn't bother to produce a good camera, they just produced a camera that could hit a certain market segment. They're relying on brand loyalty alone as the prime marketing factor, and probably they will succeed.

And this is all very, very sad.

[lopicma]

I am still of the belief that full frames are going to be the antithesis of the new mirror-less and compact system cameras. 

As far as the Canon lineup goes... it would be nice if there were more of a price range for full frame bodies like there is for APS-C bodies.  At least have beginner, intermediate and advanced lines.  Heck, I dug out my Rebel 2000 35mm film camera to shoot "full frame", that's how bad I want a taste of it.

[a9000]

6D is for people who don't need all the 5D3 features, the same people who are buying the 5D2 right now.

It also might be the best camera in the market for legacy/alt lens users (interchangeable focusing screens, better mirror clearance due to 97 % VF) at least until a FF NEX arrives. Although I doubt Canon had this in mind

[Marsu42]

I bought a 5DII (with it's ancient terrible focusing technology) recently from Canon for 1500(refurb new), popped it on a tripod

That's the 6d demography: People who would have bought a 5d2 after that has been phased out. It's for tourists (small, gps, wifi), landscape shooters (ff) and aps-c upgraders ($$$) who for some weird reason won't switch to Nikon when selling their ef-s lenses anyway. People who used the 5d2 for events as a poor man's 1d will either get the 5d3 (x-sync, shutter speed) or also switch to Nikon if they don't want to pay $3000.

[verysimplejason]

I bought a 5DII (with it's ancient terrible focusing technology) recently from Canon for 1500(refurb new), popped it on a tripod

That's the 6d demography: People who would have bought a 5d2 after that has been phased out. It's for tourists (small, gps, wifi), landscape shooters (ff) and aps-c upgraders ($$$) who for some weird reason won't switch to Nikon when selling their ef-s lenses anyway. People who used the 5d2 for events as a poor man's 1d will either get the 5d3 (x-sync, shutter speed) or also switch to Nikon if they don't want to pay $3000.

This is an excellent backup for professionals who are not doing sports or bird photography.  The only thing that's hindering this to be a real success is its price.  If it's priced between 1500 and 1700, this will surely be a smash hit.  Of course for those photographers requiring more complex AF, they can go for 5D3 or just wait for the fabled 7D2.

[dilbert]

That's the 6d demography: People who would have bought a 5d2 after that has been phased out. It's for tourists (small, gps, wifi), landscape shooters (ff) and aps-c upgraders ($$$) who for some weird reason won't switch to Nikon when selling their ef-s lenses anyway.

What landscape shooter is going to buy a ff 6D with 20MP when for the same price they can buy a D600 with 24MP? If you don't have Canon lenses, you'd have to be crazy. The tourist thing I can buy.

[verysimplejason]

That's the 6d demography: People who would have bought a 5d2 after that has been phased out. It's for tourists (small, gps, wifi), landscape shooters (ff) and aps-c upgraders ($$$) who for some weird reason won't switch to Nikon when selling their ef-s lenses anyway.

What landscape shooter is going to buy a ff 6D with 20MP when for the same price they can buy a D600 with 24MP? If you don't have Canon lenses, you'd have to be crazy. The tourist thing I can buy.

That's why it's only the price point that's the primary source of argument.  If 6D is sold around 200-300 cheaper, why not?

[AmbientLight]

Regarding 6D as a backup camera I don't think it qualifies. If you consider a 1D-X as a primary camera, in my humble opinion the logical current camera choices for backup cameras are 5D Mark III and 7D, in my case I use both (mostly 5D Mark III).

[ecka]

Before the annoucement I was sceptical about some of the rumored 6D specs (like different sensor, SD slot) and some of the rest were just unclear. Now when I see that "APS-C sized body" turned out to be basically the 60D body without vari-angle LCD or flash, which would add some more value and reasons to buy it over 5D2. I would prefer a vari-angle screen instead of GPS. It's not the worst, but I expected something more advanced (even if it was more expensive), a camera that would be like 60% of the 5D3, not 40%. Canon could add just a few more or better features and 6D would be a much better camera. For now, it's just too expensive to downgrade from 5D2 or even classic 5D, but in the future (after the price drop) 6D may be a good alternative for someone who cannot afford 5D series. 6D's single SD slot is really disappointing. Specially if you want to pair it with 7D or 5D series, you'll need both CF and SD memory cards, and deal with different button layout. I thought that Nikon was crazy to put the XQD slot into their D4, now I see that they are both crazy .
Who is this camera made for? - 60D lovers lusting for FF and tired of vari-angle LCD, obviously . Similar bodies, similar controls, shared SD cards...

[unfocused]

...Who is this camera made for? - 60D lovers lusting for FF and tired of vari-angle LCD, obviously . Similar bodies, similar controls, shared SD cards...

I was thinking about both the Nikon and the Canon this morning and pretty much came to the same conclusion. I really don't see either one being aimed at owners of the Rebel or DXXXX series. The cost of entry is just too high. Take the Rebel for example. For around $1,000 or less, many Rebel owners have gotten a kit with a 18-55 and a 55-250 mm telephoto.

To replace that kit means an investment of at least $3,000. Many Rebel owners were probably really squeezing to get the $1,000. Now convince them they ought to "upgrade" to a $3,000 setup. And, for what? In 99% of the cases the user will see no discernible improvement in the results.

As a 7D owner, converting to full frame has virtually no appeal to me. Would I consider buying a full frame as a second body? Maybe, but I'll wait until the 7DII comes out and see what it is like, since that is what I really would rather have. So, I don't see many 7D owners as the target market.

So, I came to the same conclusion as ecka, the primary target market may be 60D owners. There may also be a segment of 40D and 50D holdovers who weren't willing to pay the premium for the 7D but couldn't justify the original cost of the 5DII.

Now, I think the same factors apply to the Nikon D600 and it's not a criticism of either company. More of an academic exercise: "Guess the Target Market."

If there is any conclusion I would draw from this it is that, first,  DSLR manufacturing efficiencies have improved sufficiently to the point that Canon and Nikon now feel comfortable developing cameras for much more targeted audiences than they could in the past and second, the DSLR market is so lucrative and desirable that all the manufacturers want to lock it up, and they are willing to give consumers as many options as possible in order to avoid leaving any customers on the table.