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Author Topic: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware  (Read 21830 times)

dadgummit

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Re: How canon charges 6000$ for firmware upgrade
« Reply #60 on: September 21, 2012, 11:08:20 AM »
So does this mean Magic Lantern can turn the 1DX into a 4K camera?

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Re: How canon charges 6000$ for firmware upgrade
« Reply #60 on: September 21, 2012, 11:08:20 AM »

victorwol

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Re: How canon charges 6000$ for firmware upgrade
« Reply #61 on: September 21, 2012, 11:19:03 AM »
Again, what other companies offer 4k for $6800? Aside from JVC with a fixed lens, tiny sensor camera.

The closest thing is the theoretical 4k of Sony when they release it, and even that will likely cost $10k as a package. It'd be insane for Canon to offer their 4k camera for significantly less than their competitors, especially when it would destroy the rest of their video line (who buys a C300 or C500 when they can get better res at half the price).

Also, if you consider that the cost of R&D has to be spread out over potential buyers, who is to say it doesn't cost a S___ ton of money per camera. 4k isn't just some cakewalk piece of software....Sony hasn't even delivered theirs despite announcing their camera 6 months ago. Nobody even seems to know what it will cost or when it will release. Panasonic only has a concept camera that does 4k. Everything else that does 4k is $20k+, and the industry standard stuff is $50k+. The number of people who buy a camera this pricey might literally be in the hundreds or low thousands, and most of that will be production studios and rental shops.

They are selling the same hardware crippled down to HD for half the money. That shows you that they can afford to do it. I understand what you say, but its a very good way to make clients very unhappy to do it the way they are doing it.
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Chewy734

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #62 on: September 21, 2012, 11:20:28 AM »
They also would probably cry that BMW puts in restrictions on the US versions of the M5 that limit it's maximum horsepower and still charge you over $100k for the car.

Along the same lines...  would you be pissed if you bought a $100k M5, and then next year when the new GPS update comes out, BMW made you purchase a new M5 instead of allowing you to buy a DVD with the updated maps?  Or, if you want a Sirius Satellite Radio in your car, you'd have to buy a brand new car with that option, as opposed to just adding it to your current car?  Remember, now you can get BMWs pre-wired with Sirius now, just not activated (in other words, it's similar to just a firmware update).

But, I agree, it's not a question of being ethical or moral...  they can do whatever they want.  But, it doesn't mean that some of us can't be pissed about it.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 11:22:19 AM by Chewy734 »

marinien

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Re: How canon charges 6000$ for firmware upgrade
« Reply #63 on: September 21, 2012, 11:56:09 AM »
why would he say that when it is not the case.. i mean it´s stupid that he admited that at all.

the reaction on this is 95% negative.

... and the same 95% are not the target market for these two cameras  ::)
« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 11:58:20 AM by marinien »
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DB

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #64 on: September 21, 2012, 12:06:03 PM »
Unethical...  Immoral...

You keep using those words.  I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

Totally agree.  People here have never seen an episode of Shark Tank it seems.

When you go to a movie and pay $10 for a ticket per showing when you could buy the Blu-Ray for $20, is that unethical?  Is paying $20 for two drinks and a large popcorn when it costs the theater < $2 for that immoral?? 

Those complaining here are the same lot that complain that the 5D3 should sell for $1200, or that they didn't get all the features of the 1Dx in a body 1/3 the cost, or gee whizz the 6D does not have the same AF as the 7D.  Unrealistic whiners who would fail as corporate leaders.

They also would probably cry that BMW puts in restrictions on the US versions of the M5 that limit it's maximum horsepower and still charge you over $100k for the car.

Your car analogy is totally erroneous! Btw I've owned both the BMW M5 and the BMW M3 (one I chipped to over 400BHP with fun but detrimental results). There are 2 genuine reasons to limit the performance/horsepower of a BMW M5 sold into the US market:

(1) Cars in the USA are subject to different homologation criteria, thus exhaust system (affects HP) and catalytic converters are different

(2) BMW Motorsport automobiles in Europe are designed and optimized to run on RON 98 gasoline that is simply not widely available in the United States. Both my M5 & M3 had a sticker on the inside of the fuel cap door with the recommendation; "Warning 98 Octane Fuel Recommended", with an additional explanation that you could use 95 Octane when 98 was not available. In the US, most gas stations sell 87, 89, 91 or 92 octane fuel!

You could add ethanol to US gasoline to boost the octane level, in the same way that you add an additive to 2-stroke engines but nobody in a suit driving an M5 in NY is going to be sitting there at a gas station mixing 'stuff' into their fuel as they fill up their tank, having paid a hundred grand for the car.


The point you're all missing here, is the difference between genuine product differentiation, coupled with a differential (marketing) pricing policy, where there is an apparent dislocation between product/price

If any of you want a really informative lesson on business ethics, then read "Bad Science" by Ben Goldacre, a journalist and a Doctor who has trained medical students. You'll soon see how Canon is no different to Big Pharma or indeed other multinationals who milk their customers for every last cent of profit, and where MARKETING budgets dwarf R&D budgets in all of the large corporations around the world, including Canon
« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 12:12:50 PM by DB »

unfocused

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #65 on: September 21, 2012, 12:18:02 PM »
OMG! I just learned that for years the Ford Taurus and Mercury Sable were the same car with just different options and nameplate. That's so immoral!
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cliffwang

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Re: How canon charges 6000$ for firmware upgrade
« Reply #66 on: September 21, 2012, 12:25:04 PM »
So does this mean Magic Lantern can turn the 1DX into a 4K camera?
The ML door is opened for 7D and 1DX now.  You will see that later.
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Re: How canon charges 6000$ for firmware upgrade
« Reply #66 on: September 21, 2012, 12:25:04 PM »

K-amps

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #67 on: September 21, 2012, 12:35:45 PM »
Unethical...  Immoral...

You keep using those words.  I do not think they mean what you think they mean.

Dear Global Spam Assassinator...

Thank you for telling me what I mean, and even more thanks onhow stupid I am that I dont know the meaning of immoral or unethical...     ???  . Now to the important stuff:

The thread was started with the premis that Canon has just fessed up that the hardware of 1Dc and 1Dx is the same... this after they made earlier assertions that the two Cameras had different internals and to quote " because of heat dissipation, bandwidth issues" .... I don't know what values you follow, but lying is not only unethical, it is immoral. Misleading customer and the general public is immoral and unethical. Grossly overcharging the customer might be ethical, but maybe NOT immoral.... I can go on but I think you see where this is going.

« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 12:48:28 PM by K-amps »
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K-amps

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #68 on: September 21, 2012, 12:37:30 PM »
yeah well.... it at least shows all your "because manufacturing is so expensive" excuses are nothing but BS.

+1  ;)
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K-amps

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #69 on: September 21, 2012, 12:39:42 PM »
I feel a great respect for them to admitting it. Really!

Really? someone ripped the innards of the 1Dc to find it is same as the 1Dx and when Canon were caught lying with their pants down;  so they fessed and you are stilling finding excuses for them?  What I respect is your unquestional loyalty to them. And assuming you are sufficiently invested in Canon gear; Two words come to mind...

"Stockholm Syndrome"
« Last Edit: September 21, 2012, 12:52:03 PM by K-amps »
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marekjoz

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #70 on: September 21, 2012, 12:52:02 PM »
I feel a great respect for them to admitting it. Really!

Really? someone ripped the innards of the 1Dc to find it is same as the 1Dx and when Canon were caught lying with their pants down;  so they fessed and you are stilling finding excuses for them?  What I respect is your unquestional loyalty to them.

Come on... Where did they lie? What is really wrong in this practice? I feel respect for you work but what you write here is insane. Loyalty has nothing to do here. I don't feel respect for canon because this is canon but because of this action. Am I really so loyal? Read other my posts. My point of view has nothing to do with loyalty.

Someone has written here a good summarize: grow up people...
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nikkito

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #71 on: September 21, 2012, 12:54:45 PM »
Youre essentially paying for the software that costs the company money and time to develop. Programmers arent free guys.

Being a programmer myself, I agree :)

Shawn L.

I also agree!
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awinphoto

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #72 on: September 21, 2012, 12:55:40 PM »
OMG! I just learned that for years the Ford Taurus and Mercury Sable were the same car with just different options and nameplate. That's so immoral!

Shhhh that's a big cover-up conspiracy that no one should ever know about or there will be riots and mass hysteria!   8)
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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #72 on: September 21, 2012, 12:55:40 PM »

K-amps

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #73 on: September 21, 2012, 12:56:34 PM »
Youre essentially paying for the software that costs the company money and time to develop. Programmers arent free guys.

Being a programmer myself, I agree :)

Shawn L.

I also agree!

I agree too... but the issue is about grossly overcharging... since we all agree that production costs are a miniscule part of the price... right?  ;)
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Rat

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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #74 on: September 21, 2012, 12:58:03 PM »
This is the sort of thing competition is supposed to destroy in a capitalist system. The companies should be releasing the best products they can at a fair markup, not artificially segmenting markets and dribbling out capability when it suits them.
I hope today we all learned that capitalism doesn't advance anything but capitalists :)
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Re: Canon 1DC is IDENTICAL to 1DX other than firmware
« Reply #74 on: September 21, 2012, 12:58:03 PM »